Finally, a solid MOTO (and why Next Year's Lineup Could be Good)

[T.G.]

At what point does Miami stop selling off pieces? How active were they at the last trade deadline?

 

[Jeff Fletcher]

2 minutes ago, True Grich said:

At what point does Miami stop selling off pieces? How active were they at the last trade deadline?

 

I can’t answer that but I can say they’d be dumb not to trade Realmuto. 

His value is at its highest and because he’s a catcher, it’ll be short lived (relatively). They aren’t going to be good in the 2 years left before FA and they probably shouldn’t sign him to a big extension that pays him when he’s 30-32. 

[tdawg87]

14 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

There's no way to confidently say Kole Calhoun will be better in 2019 than he was in 2017 or 2018. The only reason he's still the RF is because Hermosillo wasn't developmentally ready and Jabari Blash can't hit major league pitching.

We hope Ohtani will be ready for the season, but we have to see how rehab goes. If he misses all of ST, and then tries to step into the lineup, he'll likely struggle, most players that don't get ST do. So we have to hope his rehab is expedient.

Pujols will be a year older, and won't get the DH days to rest his legs. Chances are, he's going to be worse, and hurt. So whoever our backup 1B is, is going to need to pick up the slack. Maybe JMF. 

Pour catching situation will likely improve offensively, but unless it's Realmuto or a free agent, the improvement may not be that drastic. 

Hopefully Cozart is a lot better than he was.

Either way, this offense isn't good, and it'll take more than a lucky bounce here and there to get that straightened out in 2019. The offense needs help. I'm hoping the Angels can swing a deal for Jose Martinez or Matt Adams to handle DH until Ohtani is ready and then shift to 1B and relegate Pujols into a lesser role. I'm also hoping we can get a new 2B that can shift Fletcher into a utility role, and trade for a replacement in RF for Calhoun. If they can do all that, which likely wouldn't cost much at all, the offense could be where it needs to be. 

I kinda feel like you ignored the part about them being 0.23 runs per game away from being a top 10 offense.

I mean shit, just having Trout those extra 20 games alone would bring us close. 

The reason I believe Calhoun will be at least what he was in 2017 is his career low BABIP of .241 this year. His LD% was right about where it normally is. His K rate was high but not absurdly so. He sucked but he also suffered from some shitty luck. 

Also, even if Ohtani needs extra rehab time he's still going to get more at bats in 2019.

This is an average offense with holes. But they're far closer to being good than you think. 

The one thing we can agree on is that they do need help to get there. But they don't need to blow their load on Harper or Machado, which was my entire point. 

[floplag]

Its funny to me how people are convinced our guys will never be better and yet they want other teams potential cast-offs.  We assume guys like Hernandez or other just need a change of scenery while assuming Kole will only get worse.  Its kinda funny to me.  But, i digress. 

What we dont need is more gambling.  If were going to make trades, it cant be for something someone else wants to move.  There are reasons why they make that determination and we dont exactly have a great track record with turning other peoples garbage around.

We have a very solid core, what we dont have if an acceptable bottom half of the lineup offensively.   There are incredibly obvious spots we could/should upgrade in that regard.

I'im sorry @Scotty@AW but i laughed at this comment "The only reason he's still the RF is because Hermosillo wasn't developmentally ready and Jabari Blash can't hit major league pitching."  Like, what other reason could there be?  Youre basically saying hes only the RF as we had noone better, well thats true of anyone isnt it? 

[Troll Daddy]

 

[Second Base]

38 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

I kinda feel like you ignored the part about them being 0.23 runs per game away from being a top 10 offense.

I mean shit, just having Trout those extra 20 games alone would bring us close. 

The reason I believe Calhoun will be at least what he was in 2017 is his career low BABIP of .241 this year. His LD% was right about where it normally is. His K rate was high but not absurdly so. He sucked but he also suffered from some shitty luck. 

Also, even if Ohtani needs extra rehab time he's still going to get more at bats in 2019.

This is an average offense with holes. But they're far closer to being good than you think. 

The one thing we can agree on is that they do need help to get there. But they don't need to blow their load on Harper or Machado, which was my entire point. 

I didn't know that was your point, but now that I do, I agree. 

Every team in baseball is filling holes, so if the Angels stand pat, they're actually getting worse.

I'm not sure if it was the Angels website or if it was Fletch, but the general belief is that with his winter rehab, and later season ramp up in throwing, Ohtani will probably end up with around 400 plate appearances. More than this year, but not a ton more. 

I wish a full season of Trout and Ohtani were the answer. They're definitely the biggest solutions, but we both agree there needs to Ben more than that to have the offense they need.

[Second Base]

32 minutes ago, floplag said:

Its funny to me how people are convinced our guys will never be better and yet they want other teams potential cast-offs.  We assume guys like Hernandez or other just need a change of scenery while assuming Kole will only get worse.  Its kinda funny to me.  But, i digress. 

What we dont need is more gambling.  If were going to make trades, it cant be for something someone else wants to move.  There are reasons why they make that determination and we dont exactly have a great track record with turning other peoples garbage around.

We have a very solid core, what we dont have if an acceptable bottom half of the lineup offensively.   There are incredibly obvious spots we could/should upgrade in that regard.

I'im sorry @Scotty@AW but i laughed at this comment "The only reason he's still the RF is because Hermosillo wasn't developmentally ready and Jabari Blash can't hit major league pitching."  Like, what other reason could there be?  Youre basically saying hes only the RF as we had noone better, well thats true of anyone isnt it? 

RF was wide open for the taking because Kole Calhoun sucked at his job for a long time. No one took advantage. Performances aren't static Flop, guys get better and worse. But look at the Angels roster and that core you're boasting about....

Upton isn't going to get better. Sorry. He is what he is, and he's been that for years. Nothing is out of the question with Trout, but how much better can he get? It'll be exciting to find out. I won't count on him improving. That's not how you team build. And Ohtani....will he have a ST? How much will he play?

That core, needs more. We need more offense from catcher, RF, 2B and 3B. Catcher will require outside help. Either 2B or 3B will require Cozart to stay healthy and perform better. I wouldn't count on it, but because of the contract, that's the reality they're looking at.  Calhoun has shown over a few years now, that he's not going to be improving in RF. He's actively declining. It happens. He needs to be replaced. Whether that happens this year or now, I don't know, but if the Angels actually intended to win in 2019, then no, he wouldn't be the starting RF. We'll see. 

What I'm advocating is that the Angels improve with very short term deals at 2B and RF. 

I believe that either Fletcher, Rengifo or Jahmai Jones are going to be so good that they'll be major assets at 2B, in the future or at utility in a Rengifo and Fletcher's case. I wouldn't want to block them because they're all in AA or higher, so all we need is a one or two year improvement, that's it. And in RF, I'm hoping Jo Adell is ready in 2020, but you never know. But it really shouldn't be that difficult to improve offensively over Kole Calhoun. 

[Troll Daddy]

43 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

RF was wide open for the taking because Kole Calhoun sucked at his job for a long time. No one took advantage. Performances aren't static Flop, guys get better and worse. But look at the Angels roster and that core you're boasting about....

Upton isn't going to get better. Sorry. He is what he is, and he's been that for years. Nothing is out of the question with Trout, but how much better can he get? It'll be exciting to find out. I won't count on him improving. That's not how you team build. And Ohtani....will he have a ST? How much will he play?

That core, needs more. We need more offense from catcher, RF, 2B and 3B. Catcher will require outside help. Either 2B or 3B will require Cozart to stay healthy and perform better. I wouldn't count on it, but because of the contract, that's the reality they're looking at.  Calhoun has shown over a few years now, that he's not going to be improving in RF. He's actively declining. It happens. He needs to be replaced. Whether that happens this year or now, I don't know, but if the Angels actually intended to win in 2019, then no, he wouldn't be the starting RF. We'll see. 

What I'm advocating is that the Angels improve with very short term deals at 2B and RF. 

I believe that either Fletcher, Rengifo or Jahmai Jones are going to be so good that they'll be major assets at 2B, in the future or at utility in a Rengifo and Fletcher's case. I wouldn't want to block them because they're all in AA or higher, so all we need is a one or two year improvement, that's it. And in RF, I'm hoping Jo Adell is ready in 2020, but you never know. But it really shouldn't be that difficult to improve offensively over Kole Calhoun. 

You need to get the f**k off Calhoun’s case

[hangin n wangin]

4 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

You need to get the f**k off Calhoun’s case

How’s it going Kole’s dad?

[Troll Daddy]

6 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

How’s it going Kole’s dad?

Scotty running him mouth like a little blank on his every post. Yea we know there’s a question mark on Calhoun next season but he’s GG defense ... who’s to say he won’t be a allstar next season.

[hangin n wangin]

1 minute ago, Troll Daddy said:

Scotty running him mouth like a little blank on his every post. Yea we know there’s a question mark on Calhoun next season but he’s GG defense ... who’s to say he won’t be a allstar next season.

I don’t have much confidence in Kole being an all star, but I think he could put up a 2 WAR season next year, which is more than ok for a team that needs to fill other positions of bigger priority. Kole isn’t great....he’s streaky as hell and looks like a clown out there when he’s off. But I think he’ll at least be league average. With potential for a bit more.

[wopphil]

29 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

You need to get the f**k off Calhoun’s case

Calhoun is done. Every major metric has fallen significantly two years straight now. He is a 4th outfielder now. Expecting him to improve significantly is like expecting Pujols to improve - it's not happening.

[Jeff Fletcher]

1 hour ago, floplag said:

Its funny to me how people are convinced our guys will never be better and yet they want other teams potential cast-offs.  We assume guys like Hernandez or other just need ...

I’m going to nitpick one point.

Hernandez was down, for him, last year, but still above MLB average offensively as a 2B and well above what the Angels had. If he just repeats his “bad year,” it would be an upgrade. If he gets back to 2017 (which I think is possible since he’s 28), that’s a huge upgrade. 

But Eppler doesn’t want him, so .....

Carry on....

Oh, also, I think it’s a safe bet Ohtani gets 500+ PAs next year. 

I also think the Angels definitely have a chance to be a top 10 offense with the right tweaks. They do not need to blow it up or go all-in on Harper or anything. 

[tdawg87]

[Jeff Fletcher]

9 minutes ago, wopphil said:

Calhoun is done. Every major metric has fallen significantly two years straight now. He is a 4th outfielder now. Expecting him to improve significantly is like expecting Pujols to improve - it's not happening.

Do you believe he was the same hitter in April and July? You think he was just getting really unlucky in April and really lucky in July?

Or do you think there was a tangible difference in the way he hit?

[m0nkey]

8 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Do you believe he was the same hitter in April and July? You think he was just getting really unlucky in April and really lucky in July?

Or do you think there was a tangible difference in the way he hit?

Was he the same hitter in July and September?

 

I ask because I don't know.

[Second Base]

54 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

You need to get the f**k off Calhoun’s case

[Second Base]

47 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Scotty running him mouth like a little blank on his every post. Yea we know there’s a question mark on Calhoun next season but he’s GG defense ... who’s to say he won’t be a allstar next season.

[tdawg87]

54 minutes ago, Troll Daddy said:

Scotty running him mouth like a little blank on his every post. Yea we know there’s a question mark on Calhoun next season but he’s GG defense ... who’s to say he won’t be a allstar next season.

Hmm. @Englisahh F*ck it he's dead

[Lou]

1 hour ago, Troll Daddy said:

who’s to say he won’t be a allstar next season.

me 

[wopphil]

31 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Do you believe he was the same hitter in April and July? You think he was just getting really unlucky in April and really lucky in July?

Or do you think there was a tangible difference in the way he hit?

I think he was abnormally bad early, abnormally good later, and then a mix of the two the last six weeks. I think his season average accurately captured his abilities. 

[Jeff Fletcher]

55 minutes ago, wopphil said:

I think he was abnormally bad early, abnormally good later, and then a mix of the two the last six weeks. I think his season average accurately captured his abilities. 

Ok. I disagree because there was a tangible, significant, change in his swing from the first two months to when he came back in June.

I don’t think it was reasonable to think he had suddenly become a 1.000 OPS hitter by changing his swing, and what happened in September was probably the expected correction, a slump that all hitters have.

The sum of his 80 games with the new swing was an .800 OPS. 

I think it’s reasonable to think, if he brings back the same swing next year, he can perform somewhere around that level (770 to 830), which would make him a slightly above average offensive RF (as well as an above average defensive RF).

I don’t believe the Angels have any internal options who can do better, and all the external options would require too many of their resources best used on filling more serious holes (pitching, catcher, 1B).

I also believe Jo Adell will be ready by 2020, if not sooner, so it’s a further waste of assets to acquire anyone who would block him.

That is my opinion of Kole Calhoun.

[Dtwncbad]

2 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

You need to get the f**k off Calhoun’s case

Nah. Nobody needs to get off his case.  It is on Calhoun 100% to prove RF isn't a spot to upgrade.

Nobody owes him the benefit of the doubt.  I love the guy and how he plays but production matters.

It's on him.

[eligrba]

4 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Ok. I disagree because there was a tangible, significant, change in his swing from the first two months to when he came back in June.

I don’t think it was reasonable to think he had suddenly become a 1.000 OPS hitter by changing his swing, and what happened in September was probably the expected correction, a slump that all hitters have.

The sum of his 80 games with the new swing was an .800 OPS. 

I think it’s reasonable to think, if he brings back the same swing next year, he can perform somewhere around that level (770 to 830), which would make him a slightly above average offensive RF (as well as an above average defensive RF).

I don’t believe the Angels have any internal options who can do better, and all the external options would require too many of their resources best used on filling more serious holes (pitching, catcher, 1B).

I also believe Jo Adell will be ready by 2020, if not sooner, so it’s a further waste of assets to acquire anyone who would block him.

That is my opinion of Kole Calhoun.

[Blarg]

40 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

The sum of his 80 games with the new swing was an .800 OPS. 

Well, sorta of. His return from the DL was a .742 OPS for his short stint in June. Then July he went full Gorilla and hit like Trout for 23 games running his OPS to 1.136.

August rolls along and his OPS dives by about 400 points. Still good but you can see he is slipping back into old habits, his stance has started to change, he is a little more upright and he's swinging a little harder and more often. 

By September he is complete garbage. He is not working any counts, he's swinging like a madman, grounding into shifts and his OPS plummets to. 498.

The volitility says he learned nothing. Sure, he made changes but once he had success those changes didn't stick. I'm not talking his best month but his bookend June/August months that placed him closer to his career averages. July was bullshit. 

So I have to think that if Kole can't stay the course and be the hitter he was those bookend Months he will be the September Calhoun, a guy buying a bench seat.