What's the goal?

[CanadianHalo]

3 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

It's perfectly fine to prefer other options with more power (Moustakis, Hosmer, etc.), but you sit on here and spew garbage about Maybin has been on 6 teams and how he has performed over the last 24 games. Who gives a fuck? To discredit how Maybin has performed this year is flat out ridiculous because he has done everything we signed him to do.

Well Maybin also only hit .206 in April with a .299 OBP.

So 19 games in April and he's stunk his last 24, he's played in 71 this season. So he's been pretty crappy for 43 games this year. He got hot inbetween for 28 games and AW wants to talk extension already...

[Chuck]

On 7/10/2017 at 10:07 AM, CALZONE said:

@Jeff Fletcher

I think the team is still in a major transitional stage which will require time and patience. They need some good drafts and some smart trades. That coupled with the health of our MASH unit pitching staff will be key. It may take five seasons to get there but they have to trust the process. The downside could be if Trout doesn't hang around long enough to see it through. This franchise has seen its share of failed signings and injuries so some luck is well overdue. 

Every team, almost every season sees its fair share of bad signings and injuries. It happens!

I believe the Angels are just a decent 1B, 2B and SP away from contending for a WC spot and being successful in the playoffs should they enter via the Wild Card. 

[beatlesrule]

As someone that was very vocal about a big firesale last deadline, I am all for another big sell this trade deadline. Keep some of your guys but trade most of them and put more depth on the farm and sign some good players in the offseason. You can bring up guys like Cowart to fill in for which ever players are traded away.  We would be in a better position if we had a firesale in 2016. Damn Arte and his only caring about getting 3 million fans.  

[Ohtaniland]

28 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

It's perfectly fine to prefer other options with more power (Moustakis, Hosmer, etc.), but you sit on here and spew garbage about Maybin has been on 6 teams and how he has performed over the last 24 games. Who gives a fuck? To discredit how Maybin has performed this year is flat out ridiculous because he has done everything we signed him to do.

He's a stop gap player. He was a salary dump. I wouldn't bring him back when other options are available. 

[Angel Oracle]

If Cowart ends up taking 2B in 2018, then Hosmer and Moose might be the best FA options, given the team's corner INF needs and FA starting pitching being hard to gauge.              It depends on the offers they get, though. 

[beatlesrule]

3 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

If Cowart ends up taking 2B in 2018, then Hosmer and Moose might be the best FA options, given the team's corner INF needs and FA starting pitching being hard to gauge.              It depends on the offers they get, though. 

Hosmer?  He is a 1st baseman.  We have a 25 million dollar a year 1st baseman for another bajillion years.  You honestly think Arte is gonna pay 100 million for another 1st baseman and have a 25 million dollar DH?  Moose is possible but not Hosmer.

[Ohtaniland]

22 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

Every team, almost every season sees its fair share of bad signings and injuries. It happens!

I believe the Angels are just a decent 1B, 2B and SP away from contending for a WC spot and being successful in the playoffs should they enter via the Wild Card. 

Well they committed on Espinosa and Valbuena for those two positional spots. They're not going to do anything to change that until the season is done. 

[Chuck]

Just now, CALZONE said:

Well they committed on Espinosa and Valbuena for those two positional spots. They're not going to do anything to change that until the season is done. 

They can release Espinosa or trade him for cash to be some team's utility guy. That or we keep him to be ours and we drop Pennington. 

Valbuena can be a backup 1B/3B and lefty off the bench. 

Neither have worked out, but both can easily be replaced while they head to the bench. 

[Angel Oracle]

8 minutes ago, beatlesrule said:

Hosmer?  He is a 1st baseman.  We have a 25 million dollar a year 1st baseman for another bajillion years.  You honestly think Arte is gonna pay 100 million for another 1st baseman and have a 25 million dollar DH?  Moose is possible but not Hosmer.

That is why I said based on what teams are offering them.   Moose is the better signing of the two, but Hosmer shouldn't be discounted totally. 

Who else is going to play 1B?  Not a 38 year-old Albert, not CRONic bad bat, and not Valnobuena

[CanadianHalo]

Well if this team would've traded for Travis Shaw when I said they should've we wouldn't have a need at 1B/3B. But nope, let's sign some hack named Luis Valbuena instead.

This team has a ton of work to do this offseason and it'd be smart to get a head start on that work at the trade deadline. 

Taking on Gordon's salary in order to save prospects should seriously be discussed. 

But if .500 to just below .500 is the goal then by all means bring back guys like Maybin.

[Stradling]

14 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

He's a stop gap player. He was a salary dump. I wouldn't bring him back when other options are available. 

Other options that you will bitch about because they will cost more money and probably give you the same WAR.  

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, CALZONE said:

Strad all i'm saying is that we could probably do better than Maybin. If Arte wants to spend than I would like to see Hosmer and Moustakas. Melky, Rasmus or Martinez would also be some good options. We need some guys that can hammer the ball. We have a pop gun lineup that even the juiced baseballs can't fix.

Wait -- you're for signing Melky?  A guy that's been with 5 teams, released once, and been popped for PEDs?  And Rasmus?  A former first rounder who's failed to live up to his draft status and projections and has also been on 4 different teams?    Rasmus BTW carries the reputation of being difficult too.

FTR Claude -- I've said this numerous times.  I think Maybin's skill-set carries some value, I just want him to do well enough to possibly get us a player back via trade.   I've been consistent since before the season started that while I'd like to see them contend, I'm hoping they sell.  Extend him, cut him -- I figure they will cross that bridge when they come to it.   This should be an interesting offseason.  LF, 2B, and 3B will all need help -- and barring some miraculous turnaround at 1B and DH -- those two spots leave a lot to be desired currently.

[Stradling]

10 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

Well if this team would've traded for Travis Shaw when I said they should've we wouldn't have a need at 1B/3B. But nope, let's sign some hack named Luis Valbuena instead.

This team has a ton of work to do this offseason and it'd be smart to get a head start on that work at the trade deadline. 

Taking on Gordon's salary in order to save prospects should seriously be discussed. 

But if .500 to just below .500 is the goal then by all means bring back guys like Maybin.

So you are advocating taking on Alex Gordon and his contract instead of signing Maybin to an extension?  The Alex Gordon who's been worse than Maybin two years in a row, and will probably cost more money?  Seriously?  

[CanadianHalo]

9 minutes ago, Stradling said:

So you are advocating taking on Alex Gordon and his contract instead of signing Maybin to an extension?  The Alex Gordon who's been worse than Maybin two years in a row, and will probably cost more money?  Seriously?  

Who the hell is talking about Alex Gordon?

Dee Gordon. Yes.

We need a leadoff hitter at 2nd. So it opens up the ability to add a big bat in the outfield.

 

Speaking of Alex Gordon, if I recall you were in the massive group that had him ranked behind Heyward at number 2 in options they'd like in LF with Upton and Cespedes 3 & 4... the majority of you would've put the final nail in the Halos coffin if you guys had any control that off-season.

[Stradling]

7 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

Who the hell is talking about Alex Gordon?

Dee Gordon. Yes.

We need a leadoff hitter at 2nd. So it opens up the ability to add a big bat in the outfield.

 

Speaking of Alex Gordon, if I recall you were in the massive group that had him ranked behind Heyward at number 2 in options they'd like in LF with Upton and Cespedes 3 & 4... the majority of you would've put the final nail in the Halos coffin if you guys had any control that off-season.

Yep, I wanted the left handed bat and the defense, plus I thought the contract would be more reasonable than Cespedes and Upton, with similar production.  I like guys with multiple skill sets.  Sorry for some reason I thought you were talking about Alex not Dee.  

[Ohtaniland]

15 minutes ago, Stradling said:

So you are advocating taking on Alex Gordon and his contract instead of signing Maybin to an extension?  The Alex Gordon who's been worse than Maybin two years in a row, and will probably cost more money?  Seriously?  

Yes the same Alex Gordon that you wanted Eppler to sign after they passed on Cespedes, Upton and Heyward. You remember when I told you Arte wasn't going to spend until Hamilton was off the books. 

If we're ok with a pop gun offense then fine keep Maybin. A bunt single here, bloop single there, a walk, a steal and a LOB.....

[Ohtaniland]

12 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

Who the hell is talking about Alex Gordon?

Dee Gordon. Yes.

We need a leadoff hitter at 2nd. So it opens up the ability to add a big bat in the outfield.

 

Speaking of Alex Gordon, if I recall you were in the massive group that had him ranked behind Heyward at number 2 in options they'd like in LF with Upton and Cespedes 3 & 4... the majority of you would've put the final nail in the Halos coffin if you guys had any control that off-season.

Yes I remember.

[Chuck]

2 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

Yes the same Alex Gordon that you wanted Eppler to sign after they passed on Cespedes, Upton and Heyward. You remember when I told you Arte wasn't going to spend until Hamilton was off the books. 

If we're ok with a pop gun offense then fine keep Maybin. A bunt single here, bloop single there, a walk, a steal and a LOB.....

I wouldn't say Maybin provides pop gun offense. He's hit 6 HR so far, 18 doubles and a triple. 

You cannot disregard the defense he's provided (best since GA in his glory days) and his ability to steal a base (25 - on pace for almost 50). He gets on base. That's what you want from a leadoff hitter. He's walked 41 times this season so far. 

[Stradling]

8 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

Yes the same Alex Gordon that you wanted Eppler to sign after they passed on Cespedes, Upton and Heyward. You remember when I told you Arte wasn't going to spend until Hamilton was off the books. 

If we're ok with a pop gun offense then fine keep Maybin. A bunt single here, bloop single there, a walk, a steal and a LOB.....

Yep, I advocated signing Gordon, I wanted a left fielder.  Now we have one and I'm advocating signing him to an extension.  Sorry I want to improve the team rather than run out the Nava's and Gentry's of the world.  

By the way, you are currently advocating the Angels sign another 1st baseman even though we are currently are paying Albert.  Hypocrite. Then again you don't want an improved team, you disappear when we win two in a row.

[fan_since79]

15 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

I wouldn't say Maybin provides pop gun offense. He's hit 6 HR so far, 18 doubles and a triple. 

You cannot disregard the defense he's provided (best since GA in his glory days) and his ability to steal a base (25 - on pace for almost 50). He gets on base. That's what you want from a leadoff hitter. He's walked 41 times this season so far. 

Good point. I was just thinking about Aybar, who walked 25 times in his last season here, which contributed to his sterling .301 on-base percentage. That was a leadoff experiment that failed.

 

[Ohtaniland]

12 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Yep, I advocated signing Gordon, I wanted a left fielder.  Now we have one and I'm advocating signing him to an extension.  Sorry I want to improve the team rather than run out the Nava's and Gentry's of the world.  

By the way, you are currently advocating the Angels sign another 1st baseman even though we are currently are paying Albert.  Hypocrite. Then again you don't want an improved team, you disappear when we win two in a row.

Well I must not disappear very often. 

It's funny that you grill me about my expectations of players but you really don't care how they perform. Albert is way overpaid for what he brings to the lineup. You don't think that affects the rest of the roster? The fact that they can't reallocate those resources is killing this organization. Well he's a good mentor for Trout"....

Stradling, Mike Trout doesn't need a $25M mentor, he needs a $25M hitter that can help him win. But while we continue to surround Trout with everybody's garage sale goods we are wasting Trout's good years. 

Those Espinosa, Valbuena, Revere and Maybin type acquisitions are directly connected to Albert and Hamilton. This team is cash strapped and we are no closer to a championship than we were before Pujols. 

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

Well I must not disappear very often. 

It's funny that you grill me about my expectations of players but you really don't care how they perform. Albert is way overpaid for what he brings to the lineup. You don't think that affects the rest of the roster? The fact that they can't reallocate those resources is killing this organization. Well he's a good mentor for Trout"....

Stradling, Mike Trout doesn't need a $25M mentor, he needs a $25M hitter that can help him win. But while we continue to surround Trout with everybody's garage sale goods we are wasting Trout's good years. 

Those Espinosa, Valbuena, Revere and Maybin type acquisitions are directly connected to Albert and Hamilton. This team is cash strapped and we are no closer to a championship than we were before Pujols. 

The more you bunch Maybin  in with Espinosa and Valbuena the more ignorant you become.  

[Ohtaniland]

18 minutes ago, Stradling said:

The more you bunch Maybin  in with Espinosa and Valbuena the more ignorant you become.  

Eppler took a chance on last years Maybin. .315 / .383 / .418 / .801

When that guy shows up on a consistent basis I'll agree with you on the extension idea. But don't hold your breath. 

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, CALZONE said:

Eppler took a chance on last years Maybin. .315 / .383 / .418 / .801

When that guy shows up on a consistent basis I'll agree with you on the extension idea. But don't hold your breath. 

I'm not expecting him to repeat last year.  If he's between a 3-4 win player then he's a steal for $9 million a year.   What's really the difference between a guy who gets his numbers over 3 months or 6 months.  If he was as good all 6 months as he is those 3 months he'd be an amazing player.  All players have peaks and valleys.   At the end of the year he will still be a 3-4 win player at $9 million.  

[Stradling]

Oh and it was a very good chance that proved him to be right.