Which Lineup/Team would you take?

[marcosantinia12]

Writing in the Howard trade got me thinking about a couple of sexy and releastic, yet challenging to manifacture lineups.

But just as a concensus, which of the two would everyone pick?

1. Holt 2B (.349 OBP)

2. Escobar 3B (.375 OBP)

3. Trout CF (.992 OPS)

4. Upton LF (.454 SLG... .491 a year ago)

5. Pujols 1B (40 Hr)

6. Calhoun RF (23db, 26hr)

7. Cron DH (.739 OPS)

8. Perez C (.250 BA)

9. Simmons SS (.321 OBP)

Or

1. Heyward RF (.293 BA, .359 OBP, 23SB)

2. Prado 3B (.288 BA, .338 OBP)

3. Trout CF (.992 OPS)

4. Pujols 1B (40hr)

5. Calhoun LF (23 db, 26hr)

6. Cron DH (.739 OPS)

7. Cabrera 2B (.265 BA, .315 OBP, 28db)

8. Perez C (.250 BA)

9. Simmons SS (.321 OBP)

Just an observation,but those lineups are extremely deep. Calhoun is better than a 6 hole hitter, and you could definitely make the case for Cron as well. The 8 hole is what it is but we have a young defensive catcher, so I can't complain. Plus if Soto platoons against lefties, it would be a big bat from the 8 hole. Even Simmons in these lineups doesn't look like the abysmal batter some people here make him out to be. That OBP would have been 2nd highest on the team last year, and that's the production we would be receiving from our 9 hole, as a second leadoff that could provide a baserunner for the top of the lineup.

I think both of these two lineups are drastically better than last year's. Not necessarily in terms of talent, but because we have role players. Escobar/Holt/Prado are not all star hitters but they might as well be because of the difference their added OBP and contact rates would make in front of Trout and the rest of the middle of the lineup.

Best of all , I don't think this is too unrealistic. Assuming we shop for one of Heyward/Upton, next is trying to find a way to snatch Escobar/Holt types or Prado/Cabrera types. Perhaps if we sign an extra mid-tier SP and use 2 of Santiago/Wilson/Tropeabo/Shoemaker along with pieces like Bedrosian, one of Cowart/Kubitza to get it done.

Spend they money on Heyward/Upton

Spend 10-14 mil on an SP to make 2 SP expendable in packages for a 2nd and 3bmen.

Spend on 1-2 Relievers

That's fairly conservative and that deep of a lineup along with a re-vamped lock down pen, and an average yet young SP would do wonders IMO.

Anyways, kinda rambled off for a bit... Which is everybody's pick?

Edited November 26, 2015 by marcosantinia12

[Stradling]

I would take the first line up because I like the idea of getting another young piece in Holt. So with Holt we would have a young core group of offensive players that include:

Trout, Calhoun, Trout, Simmons, and Holt, to go along with Kubitza or Cowart and Perez. I like that a lot.

I have a feeling that Holt will be more difficult to get than you think he will though.

[Guest]

deux

[Stradling]

Sign Heyward, trade for Holt, play Cowart. Game, Set, Match.

[nikkachez]

Don't know the exact order, but I think it'll be Calhoun LF, Trout CF, Heyward RF, Lawrie 3B, Simmons SS, Giavotella or an upgrade at 2B, Pujols 1B/DH, Cron DH/1B, Perez/Soto C 

 

Would be nice if they could do all of those things along with upgrading second base, the pen, and adding a lefty bench bat. Yikes, Billy has a lot of work to do. 

[marcosantinia12]

Strad, do you think CJ (with us eating 10mil) + Smith and Giovotella as a throw in for depth works? They get one of the pitchers they need to fill their bad rotation at a discount as well as smith for after 2016. Plus a 1st round pick after Wilson's QO.

Works for us too because we let go of 10 mil in salary and get Holt.

Edited November 26, 2015 by marcosantinia12

[nate]

Second one.  Upton would be a really stupid signing.

[ispy45]

We are not trading Wilson.  Wilson's value is too low. Plus, we need Wilson. Our rotation is full  of 5 or 6 innings pitchers. Our Bullpen will be worn out like last year.

[gotbeer]

1. Holt 2b

2.  Calhoun RF

3.  Trout CF

4.  Cespedes LF

5.  Pujols 1B

6.  Trumbo DH (I can dream right) Cron 

7.  Hwang 3B

8.  Perez C

9.  Simmons SS

 

Holt would be the toughest to get.  

 

Budget route.

1.  Aoki LF

2.  Utley 2B  (outside of last year, look at his numbers.  No QO, 1+1 or a 2+1 at a low rate)

3.  Calhoun RF

4.  Trout CF

5.  Pujols 1B

6.  Trumbo (dammit) Cron DH

7.  Hwang 3B

8.  Perez C

9.  Simmons SS

 

Break that bank

 

1.  Gordon LF

2.  Calhoun RF

3.  Zobrist/Murphy 2B

4.  Trout CF

5.  Pujols 1B

6.  Trumbo/Cron/Davis (of course Davis would move up in the order)

7.  Freese/Hwang 3B

8.  Perez C

9.  Simmons SS

[DailyHalo]

1. Lawrie  ®  3B

2. Gordon  (L)  LF

3. Trout  ®  CF

4. Pujols  ®  1B

5. Cron  ®  DH

6. Calhoun  (L)  RF

7. Simmons  ®  SS

8. Perez  ®  C

9. Giavotella  ®  2B

 

I tried to split up the only two lefties, which might need to be addressed at some point but that's still a good line-up. Maybe an upgrade with Zobrist or Walker at 2B and they're both lefties.

Edited November 26, 2015 by DailyHalo

[halosfan1970]

1. Lawrie  ®  3B

2. Gordon  (L)  LF

3. Trout  ®  CF

4. Pujols  ®  1B

5. Cron  ®  DH

6. Calhoun  (L)  RF

7. Simmons  ®  SS

8. Perez  ®  C

9. Giavotella  ®  2B

 

I tried to split up the only two lefties, which might need to be addressed at some point but that's still a good line-up. Maybe an upgrade with Zobrist or Walker at 2B and they're both lefties.

 

Brett Lawrie as a leadoff hitter? 2015 OBP .299 (.316 career), 2015 SO 144 (124 career). Umm... Why?

[DailyHalo]

or what about this......

 

1. Lawrie

2. Zobrist

3. Trout

4. Pujols

5. Gordon

6. Cron

7. Calhoun

8. Perez

9. Simmons

 

Yeah putting Lawrie lead off is a little worrisome but he has to go somewhere. How would you construct that line-up?

[Docwaukee]

We are not trading Wilson.  Wilson's value is too low. Plus, we need Wilson. Our rotation is full  of 5 or 6 innings pitchers. Our Bullpen will be worn out like last year.

We were 5th in the AL in starters IP and 11th in relievers IP.

 

Wilson wasn't exactly an innings beast either.

 

I've never really understood the importance of sacrificing quality for quantity relative to innings pitched.  

 

Avg pen era is lower than starter ERA and the numbers get worse for the pitcher the more times a batter sees them.  

 

OPS+ splits for  times through the order vs SP

1st 97

2nd 98

3rd 110

4th 115

 

vs RP

1st 96

 

Would you rather have a guy avg 6 innings with a 3.5 era or 7 innings with a 4.0 era?  

 

Remember when Santiago was asked to pitch to contact and get deeper in the games last year?  He ended up with an era of 5.2, got demoted to the pen, and then sent to the minors.  

 

He came back, made 17 starts averaging about 5 innings per with a 3.57 era.  

 

Give us the best you got for 5 or 6.  

 

Spend an extra 5mil on the pen and give your starters that kind of freedom.   If they can't get through the order a 3rd time, don't force it.  It's also cheaper to have someone like hector go 5ip and a 5mil/yr pen arm go 2ip for the total of a 3.4 era than it is to pay Jordan Zimmerman 22mil per season to go 7ip with the same era.  

[halosfan1970]

or what about this......

 

1. Lawrie

2. Zobrist

3. Trout

4. Pujols

5. Gordon

6. Cron

7. Calhoun

8. Perez

9. Simmons

 

Yeah putting Lawrie lead off is a little worrisome but he has to go somewhere. How would you construct that line-up?

If it's that lineup, I leadoff with Gordon. He's left handed, so his HR production at home isn't important. The more doubles the better. Getting baserunners in front of Trout is a priority.

 

Zobrist at #2 and Calhoun at #5 could be reversed. I'd like to see Calhoun stop selling out for 25 HR like 2015. The 2014 Calhoun that hit for more doubles, that had fewer strikeouts, and that had an OBP closer to .330 would be a good #2 hitter in front of Trout.

 

Zobrist, Cron, and Lawrie take the lineup much deeper, with better protection behind Pujols, than the 2015 lineup.

 

1. Gordon

2. Zobrist

3. Trout

4. Pujols

5. Calhoun

6. Cron

7. Lawrie

8. Perez

9. Simmons

[ten ocho recon scout]

First lineup, by far. But thats just me

[marcosantinia12]

Yeah putting Lawrie lead off is a little worrisome but he has to go somewhere. How would you construct that line-up?

1.Zobrist

2.Gordon

3.Trout

4.Pujols

5.Calhoun

6.Cron

7.Lawrie

8.Perez

9.Simmons

I was pretty surprised that you would put Calhoun 7th

[ukyah]

you know guys ps4 is going to be on sale tomorrow. feel free to get one and go crazy making lineups on mlb15

[DailyHalo]

Something similar is the ideal version:

 

1. Zobrist

2. Trout

3. Pujols/Gordon

4. Gordon/Pujols

5. Cron

6. Calhoun

7. Lawrie

8. Perez

9. Simmons

 

Why surprised?

[DailyHalo]

We could do something like this and really bulk up the pen instead of going for a front end starter. Maybe focus more on Maeda?

Edited November 26, 2015 by DailyHalo

[Guest]

Actually, I take back what I said. They're both shitty lineups. 

[marcosantinia12]

Actually, I take back what I said. They're both shitty lineups.

Haha, I'm interested in hearing your ideal lineup.

[Docwaukee]

I am not sure how we'd get Yunel Escobar unless the nats realize that his 2015 was a considerable aberration.  They would be smart to trade him now though.  But they probably need him now that Desmond is a free agent and Trea Turner isn't quite ready.  

 

Holt might be more obtainable in that Boston needs pitching desperately.  It would probably take Tropeano.  At that rate, I could take it or leave it.  

 

I was thinking about it, and I don't think Eppler is going to trade Hector unless he gets a player back that has equal club control and offsetting salaries.  So as much as I like Prado, I don't think Eppler is gonna give up anyone but Wilson for him and I don't think MIA would want him even if we paid some of his salary.  

 

I know it's not a popular stance, but I would give Utley a chance in a heartbeat.  He's still way better than Gia defensively and he was horrifically unlucky last year.  He was horribly unlucky last year with a .230 BABIP.  His other peripherals are similar to his career otherwise.  At the very least he'd be a reasonably cheap platoon.  He lives in norcal and I can't see the A's or Giants making an offer.  

[Guest]

Haha, I'm interested in hearing your ideal lineup.

Well, for starters I wouldn't bat Simmons 9th.

[marcosantinia12]

I am not sure how we'd get Yunel Escobar unless the nats realize that his 2015 was a considerable aberration. They would be smart to trade him now though. But they probably need him now that Desmond is a free agent and Trea Turner isn't quite ready.

Holt might be more obtainable in that Boston needs pitching desperately. It would probably take Tropeano. At that rate, I could take it or leave it.

I was thinking about it, and I don't think Eppler is going to trade Hector unless he gets a player back that has equal club control and offsetting salaries. So as much as I like Prado, I don't think Eppler is gonna give up anyone but Wilson for him and I don't think MIA would want him even if we paid some of his salary.

I know it's not a popular stance, but I would give Utley a chance in a heartbeat. He's still way better than Gia defensively and he was horrifically unlucky last year. He was horribly unlucky last year with a .230 BABIP. His other peripherals are similar to his career otherwise. At the very least he'd be a reasonably cheap platoon. He lives in norcal and I can't see the A's or Giants making an offer.

Yeah, you're right about a lot of those question marks. I think that out of them Holt is the most obtainable, although it would likely cost a young pitcher. I would more than likely do it though seeing that we have an excess of pitchers and they have an alexcess of position players.

If we got Holt for 3rd, I wouldn't mind getting Cabrera for 2nd.

I love the Utley idea as well, I also mentioned before but it wasn't too popular. I think he'd be a great buy-low candidate.

[marcosantinia12]

Well, for starters I wouldn't bat Simmons 9th.

And why is that?