Minasian's Gambit

[Angelsjunky]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Again it’s not just a name gap. Giolito has an actual track record of being a 1 or 2 starter and Barria is a 6-7th starter/swing man. 

Giolito hasn't been a #1-2 starter in a couple years. Look at 2022-23: he's been a #3-4. That's better than Barria, although I think his track record is actually closer to a #4-5 -- he always seems under-appreciated and outperforms expectations.

[fan_since79]

I've been told in no uncertain terms that Fletcher does not belong on a major league roster. I don't get that.

[mmc]

Just now, Angelsjunky said:

I'm sorry, @mmc, but the endless rationalization of "made sense at the time" falls apart when the results are almost always bad. 

I just don't think there's ever a reason to trade prospects--even fringe ones--for replacement players. The definition of a replacement player is a guy that can be easily found in the high minors. Due to the Angels lack of depth, even those are hard to find. But they still have some options (e.g. Fletcher) that can equal the warm body on the field that Escobar has been.

I don't even know what point you're trying to make.  He said he didn't understand why we traded for Escobar so I explained it.  Whether you think it was any good or not is irrelevant, I said in another thread we should DFA the guy already.  I'm not naive enough to pretend I have no clue why they made the move though.

[DMVol]

Just now, mmc said:

He hasn't played because he sucks and has been worse than everyone anticipated.  But at the time we needed another 3B and we got one.  

If Perry knew he was going to get Moose the next day, would he have made the trade for Escobar? I don’t know but you have to wonder….I guess the original plan was to play Moose primarily at 1b and Escobar at 3b….In a perfect world, you get Moose for 3b and Cron for 1b in June….

[mmc]

1 minute ago, fan_since79 said:

I've been told in no uncertain terms that Fletcher does not belong on a major league roster. I don't get that.

Have you not watched him play this season?

[mmc]

Just now, DMVol said:

If Perry knew he was going to get Moose the next day, would he have made the trade for Escobar? I don’t know but you have to wonder….I guess the original plan was to play Moose primarily at 1b and Escobar at 3b….In a perfect world, you get Moose for 3b and Cron for 1b in June….

I don't see why not, they replaced different players on the roster

[DMVol]

5 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

I'm sorry, @mmc, but the endless rationalization of "made sense at the time" falls apart when the results are almost always bad. 

I just don't think there's ever a reason to trade prospects--even fringe ones--for replacement players. The definition of a replacement player is a guy that can be easily found in the high minors. Due to the Angels lack of depth, even those are hard to find. But they still have some options (e.g. Fletcher) that can equal the warm body on the field that Escobar has been.

I think Moose and Cron were worth trading prospects….Escobar hasn’t been…Grichuk, we’ll see….

[DMVol]

1 minute ago, mmc said:

I don't see why not, they replaced different players on the roster

Escobar has been exactly the same player he was with the Mets….stats are dead on the same…just not sure it was a good move regardless of who replaced who…

[mmc]

1 minute ago, DMVol said:

Escobar has been exactly the same player he was with the Mets….stats are dead on the same…just not sure it was a good move regardless of who replaced who…

Don't think anyone is trying to say it was good

[Stradling]

11 minutes ago, mmc said:

Have you not watched him play this season?

Or last season or the season before. 

[DMVol]

14 minutes ago, mmc said:

Don't think anyone is trying to say it was good

I guess my original point was although I might disagree with the “all in” plan, since that was the plan, I don’t think any of the deals were bad except Escobar…saying Escobar filled a need is true but you got the exact same guy he was with the Mets….just think Perry pulled the trigger too quickly (although we were pretty desperate)…it was obvious pretty quickly that it wasn’t a good idea….

[Jay]

2 hours ago, DMVol said:

I think Moose and Cron were worth trading prospects….Escobar hasn’t been…Grichuk, we’ll see….

Yeah but you only get two months of Moose, Cron, Escobar and Grichuk. Then they're gone and you have no prospects.

[DMVol]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

Yeah but you only get two months of Moose, Cron, Escobar and Grichuk. Then they're gone and you have no prospects.

Wasn’t debating the wisdom of the “all in” plan, just saying that, if that’s your plan, Moose and Cron have been pretty good pick ups…Escobar, not so much….

[jsnpritchett]

48 minutes ago, DMVol said:

Wasn’t debating the wisdom of the “all in” plan, just saying that, if that’s your plan, Moose and Cron have been pretty good pick ups…Escobar, not so much….

Cron is 5 for 20 (all singles) since joining the Angels.  Grichuk is 5 for 19 with 1 HR.  Escobar has been an unmitigated disaster, as everyone seems to acknowledge.  Moustakas has been hitting pretty well recently.  He's the only one who's been a true plus overall.

[DMVol]

26 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

Cron is 5 for 20 (all singles) since joining the Angels.  Grichuk is 5 for 19 with 1 HR.  Escobar has been an unmitigated disaster, as everyone seems to acknowledge.  Moustakas has been hitting pretty well recently.  He's the only one who's been a true plus overall.

True, he hasn’t been great, although he has the MLB best hitting streak right now….More than anything, I think Cron and Moustakas have stabilized the corner INF spots, which have been a mess for the last two years…

[jsnpritchett]

1 minute ago, DMVol said:

True, he hasn’t been great, although he has the MLB best hitting streak right now….More than anything, I think Cron and Moustakas have stabilized the corner INF spots, which have been a mess for the last two years…

My point about Cron is that I'm just not sure he's really stabilized anything yet.  He's going out there every day, I guess, so if that's your definition of stability, then sure.  But he's not that good.  He's got negative fWAR and bWAR this season.

[DMVol]

15 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

My point about Cron is that I'm just not sure he's really stabilized anything yet.  He's going out there every day, I guess, so if that's your definition of stability, then sure.  But he's not that good.  He's got negative fWAR and bWAR this season.

Everything is relative, I guess. Compared to Walsh (and others) we’ve run out there in 22 and 23, I’ll take him right now…

[Revad]

4 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

I'm sorry, @mmc, but the endless ration

Angels baseball.

[Revad]

We’re all disappointed and angry, justifiably so.  I recall even I got in spats during spring about the level of the team (looks like I was filled with caca).  One of the reasons I find this board a nice hobby is there’s people maybe smarter that me about baseball.  If my son had interest I’d tell him to read this board, that’s  the truth.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Revad

[Angels in 2030]

So Perry got pieces we needed - for this year.   A year that we were not gonna make the playoffs regardless.  What did he get for 2024+.  Maybe a comp 2nd round pick.  That’s the prize awaiting the Angels lol smh. Brilliance by the organization lol.  

[cjcinec]

All the trades in the world would not change the fact that the Angels have a bunch of pitchers that don’t throw strikes and hitters that strike out too much. New manager, pitching and hitting coaches needed along with a completely overhauled training staff. This team has got to be completely retooled.

[full circle]

20 hours ago, Stradling said:

So in one game he had better stuff. Cool. 

That’s not all I said douche Larouche. 

[full circle]

Just now, full circle said:

That’s not all I said douche Larouche. 

Oh and in case it’s not clear for you, I am insinuating that you are a douche.  

[Stradling]

37 minutes ago, full circle said:

Oh and in case it’s not clear for you, I am insinuating that you are a douche.  

Oh I got that. But keep in mind you are kind of an idiot. So your opinion doesn’t matter. 

[m0nkey]

The dipotos are ending the Angels season. Sad