Heyman: Angels have decided to keep Shohei Ohtani

[Swordsman78]

2 minutes ago, T.G. said:

Where?  Who? 

Do your own research. 

[T.G.]

1 minute ago, Swordsman78 said:

Do your own research. 

How about backing up your post with some actual facts instead.

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Swordsman78 said:

Headline should read "Casey Stengals big toe knows forgot more baseball than you'll ever know.

Wait, you still think Arte is going to break the bank?  how cute... 

[Swordsman78]

6 minutes ago, floplag said:

Wait, you still think Arte is going to break the bank?  how cute... 

In the case of Ohtani, Arte has good reasons on multiple levels to "break the bank".  

For starters Ohtani is a revenue producer.  He get s butt's in seats.  This is a multiplier for $12 drinks, food, merchandise etc.

Ohtani is a marketable commodity for advertising $$.

Ohtani fills (2) roster positions including the all important Angel need for starting pitching.  He can transition to the pen later in his career if necessary.

Ohtani provides power from the left side of the plate.  Also badly needed by the Angels

Ohtani is the AL MVP candidate.

[Inside Pitch]

Has Heyman announced the Angels have decided not to trade Mike Trout yet?

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Swordsman78 said:

In the case of Ohtani, Arte has good reasons on multiple levels to "break the bank".  

For starters Ohtani is a revenue producer.  He get s butt's in seats.  This is a multiplier for $12 drinks, food, merchandise etc.

Ohtani is a marketable commodity for advertising $$.

Ohtani fills (2) roster positions including the all important Angel need for starting pitching.  He can transition to the pen later in his career if necessary.

Ohtani provides power from the left side of the plate.  Also badly needed by the Angels

Ohtani is the AL MVP candidate.

Im not talking about one player, im talking about the team.
Even if you do extend him, we still have multiple needs... are you going to just wait for the kids?  How has that worked out so far? 

[Swordsman78]

2 minutes ago, floplag said:

Im not talking about one player, im talking about the team.
Even if you do extend him, we still have multiple needs... are you going to just wait for the kids?  How has that worked out so far? 

Arte promised Trout that he would invest ,and position the Angels to make the playoffs.   Trading Ohtani and going to a complete rebuild was not what Arte told Trout he would do.   Most fans were optimistic coming into the season and The Angels seemed to be poised for the playoffs until Rendon Fletcher and Trout all got hurt, then the wheels fell off the wagon during the losing streak.

The key is keeping the big payroll guys on the field.   I am confident that with a minimal injury season, and a couple of good aquisitions at SS and catcher, that the Angels can make the playoffs in 2023.   Also confident that some of our recent draft players will contribute in 2023

[Chuck]

I put a bee in Heyman's bonnet. 

 

[Angelsfan1984]

Lol! The guy with no material is telling you to work on yours.

 

[Chuck]

 

[Chuck]

It’s my birthday and I had a couple whisky’s. Let’s go!! 

[Angelsfan1984]

[Angels 1961]

23 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

I put a bee in Heyman's bonnet. 

 

Only thing fair in life is a hit between the foul poles

[tdawg87]

23 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

 

More like Jon Hymen

[Blarg]

18 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

Only thing fair in life is a hit between the foul poles

[Taylor]

Calling someone a woman is actually a compliment.

[Lou]

1 minute ago, Taylor said:

Calling someone a woman is actually a compliment.

@cals

[Ron Mexico]

25 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

It’s my birthday and I had a couple whisky’s. Let’s go!! 

Chuck I thought we made a promise to each other we would stay away from here if we been drinking

[floplag]

2 hours ago, Swordsman78 said:

Arte promised Trout that he would invest ,and position the Angels to make the playoffs.   Trading Ohtani and going to a complete rebuild was not what Arte told Trout he would do.   Most fans were optimistic coming into the season and The Angels seemed to be poised for the playoffs until Rendon Fletcher and Trout all got hurt, then the wheels fell off the wagon during the losing streak.

The key is keeping the big payroll guys on the field.   I am confident that with a minimal injury season, and a couple of good aquisitions at SS and catcher, that the Angels can make the playoffs in 2023.   Also confident that some of our recent draft players will contribute in 2023

Where have you been the last 3+ years?  That promise went away long ago. 

[cals]

1 hour ago, Lou said:

@cals

What can I say at this point?

[ten ocho recon scout]

7 hours ago, jsnpritchett said:

I haven't been around for the past couple months, but decided to check in as the trade deadline nears.  I had a feeling Ohtani wouldn't be traded before the deadline, but as a couple other folks said in this thread, Moreno better up the payroll next year if he's keeping Ohtani.  One thing that I wanted to note was that there's maybe not as much room in the budget heading into next year as some people seem to think--unless Moreno bumps it up.  Some quick math shows:

Subtractions:

 

 

 

 

Upton: $28M

 

 

Syndergaard: $21M

 

 

Lorenzen: $7M

 

 

Bradley: $3.75M

 

 

Suzuki: $1.75M

 

 

Duffy: $1.5M

 

 

Mayers(?): $2.15M

 

 

 

 

TOTAL: -$65.15M

 

 

Contractual raises:

 

 

 

 

Iglesias: $6M

 

 

Stassi: $4M

 

 

Fletcher: $2M

 

 

Rendon: $2M

 

 

TOTAL: +$14M

 

 

 

 

Arbitration raises:

 

 

 

 

Ohtani: $25-30M?

 

 

Sandoval: $2M?

 

 

Canning: $1.4M?

 

 

Toussaint: $1.4M?

 

 

Rengifo: $1.4M?

 

 

Barria: $1.4M?

 

 

Walsh: $1.4M?

 

 

Ward: $1.4M?

 

 

 

 

TOTAL: +$37.4M

 

NET "GAIN": $13.75M

Notes:

 

- Obviously, the Ohtani raise is a guesstimate.  Could be more than a $30M increase over this year's $5.5M salary, whether through arbitration or an extension.

 

- The other arbitration raises are also just estimates.  Some could be higher, some like Toussaint could be non-tendered. 

- But roughly speaking, the Angels will have somewhere under $15M of room to stay on par with this year's payroll--so roughly 2/3 of what Syndergaard is making this year.

- They'll need at least two starting pitchers (and perhaps as many as four--though some could obviously come from the minors), a C, a competent 4th OF (or, really, a starting OF if Marsh/Adell don't develop), an upgrade to either 2B or SS, plus at least 1-2 bullpen pieces, and a couple of bench pieces.

So, yeah, if Ohtani isn't dealt in the off-season, the purse strings need to be loosened, or the Angels could be worse off than they were heading into this year.

 

Best part of all that is seeing that Rendon, stassi,, Fletcher and Iglesias will all cost us 14 mill more next year.

So at least we have that going for us.

[Jeff Fletcher]

9 hours ago, Dtwncbad said:

And the problem with the “trade him” take is it assumes the Angels will get the right prospects, develop them properly, and it will be enough to make this team a winner.

There is no reason to believe that will be the case.

So with both paths uncertain, you keep the historical icon and try to win with him instead of being the lame organization that messed up having a historical icon.

Sorry to restate a point but the WORST thing you could do is trade him away and mess up the trade and end up losing the player and still suck.

I would rather be a stubborn owner in love with having a historical icon in my team’s uniform as long as I can have him over being a total buffoon that messes up having the icon and also messes up trading the icon.  That would cement Arte as a absolute laughingstock.

 

[AngelsLakersFan]

10 hours ago, Dtwncbad said:

And the problem with the “trade him” take is it assumes the Angels will get the right prospects, develop them properly, and it will be enough to make this team a winner.

There is no reason to believe that will be the case.

So with both paths uncertain, you keep the historical icon and try to win with him instead of being the lame organization that messed up having a historical icon.

Sorry to restate a point but the WORST thing you could do is trade him away and mess up the trade and end up losing the player and still suck.

I would rather be a stubborn owner in love with having a historical icon in my team’s uniform as long as I can have him over being a total buffoon that messes up having the icon and also messes up trading the icon.  That would cement Arte as a absolute laughingstock.

Every path requires a certain leap of faith with regards to the skill of the front office and organization.

What is painfully obvious to me at this point is that the Angels will not be competitive with Ohtani on the team. Sure they may be just as likely to not be competitive without him, but at least there is a chance down the road. 

This team is closer to 100 losses than 100 wins. Trout and Rendon are a year older and everyone is more expensive next year. 2023 will be just like any of the last 7 years.

If they do manage to re-sign Ohtani we are looking at adding an extra $30+ million to the payroll, which will effectively eliminate any other moves in free agency. This will be the core we win or lose with for the next 5+ seasons, and so far all this group has done is lose. Again, Trout and Rendon are getting older and older. There really is no path to victory here.

[Docwaukee]

25 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

Every path requires a certain leap of faith with regards to the skill of the front office and organization.

What is painfully obvious to me at this point is that the Angels will not be competitive with Ohtani on the team. Sure they may be just as likely to not be competitive without him, but at least there is a chance down the road. 

This team is closer to 100 losses than 100 wins. Trout and Rendon are a year older and everyone is more expensive next year. 2023 will be just like any of the last 7 years.

If they do manage to re-sign Ohtani we are looking at adding an extra $30+ million to the payroll, which will effectively eliminate any other moves in free agency. This will be the core we win or lose with for the next 5+ seasons, and so far all this group has done is lose. Again, Trout and Rendon are getting older and older. There really is no path to victory here.

let's keep doing it the same way.  it's gonna work.  

[Jay]

16 hours ago, Dtwncbad said:

I would rather be a stubborn owner in love with having a historical icon in my team’s uniform as long as I can have him over being a total buffoon that messes up having the icon and also messes up trading the icon.  That would cement Arte as a absolute laughingstock.

If Moreno is that worried about becoming a laughingstock he should just sell the team.