Lefties bunting against the shift?

[Jeff Fletcher]

8 hours ago, Vladdylonglegs said:

How many of those 12 ABs was it a bunted ball to third base?

He hits .360 with homers and doubles when he pulls the ball. Why should he bunt?

[Stradling]

6 minutes ago, floplag said:

Fair point, but i cant help but wonder if the impact of how the game has evolved is much more of a negative, especially in terms of marketing the game or speeding the game up, the two appear in opposition. 

This is the point I try to make when people don’t want baseball to make rule changes.  “Don’t change the game”.  Well the game has found a way to change itself and not really for the better.  

[Blarg]

1 minute ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

He hits .360 with homers and doubles when he pulls the ball. Why should he bunt?

Because he only hits 19 home runs a season and hundreds of easy outs pulling the ball. 

[mulwin444]

Enjoying all the armchair hitting coaches...

No, please, continue...

[arch stanton]

Is there an easier out than a bunt fielded by the pitcher or catcher?

[Blarg]

It rarely includes a double play. But no, in the AL the pitchers are not really trained like the NL to field bunts and if you are bunting for a base hit you are pushing the ball past the catchers Fielding zone.

[Jay]

Anyway it's an interesting discussion.

I won't be holding my breath waiting for Calhoun to start bunting to the left side.

He's up there swinging away because that's what he knows how to do.

[arch stanton]

14 minutes ago, Blarg said:

It rarely includes a double play. But no, in the AL the pitchers are not really trained like the NL to field bunts and if you are bunting for a base hit you are pushing the ball past the catchers Fielding zone.

Obviously that's the idea but in reality it's not that easy

[GrittyVeterans]

Calhoun's problem is that he's caught in between: He doesn't have the power to be a true all-or-nothing (three true outcome) guy and he doesn't have the hand-eyed coordination/contact skills to be a high average guy(.270 or better) anymore. 

If his approach actually resulted in more balls going over the fence and more walks, we'd be fine. But it's a seriously bad approach when the pay off isn't there.

He needs to figure out who he wants to be in the back 9 of his career. He can either try to make an adjustment that allows him to hit for more power and take more walks or he can do what a lot of people on the board are clamoring for which is change his spray chart pattern by burning teams for shifting on him. If he does neither he's out of the league by 2021

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

I agree with you 100 percent. I would rather the game have more balls in play. But that’s a bigger issue than Kole Calhoun. He’s got to do what he can do to be successful.

I think one solution would be to somehow limit pitching so you’re forced to have pitchers throw more pitches, so they have to pitch to contact. 

oh 100% more than just Kole, hes just our best local example, lol 
Though i will say as a guy that can also run well and hits from the left side hes also perhaps the type of person that really should at least try to take advantage of that option.

[floplag]

1 hour ago, Stradling said:

This is the point I try to make when people don’t want baseball to make rule changes.  “Don’t change the game”.  Well the game has found a way to change itself and not really for the better.  

Games change, its inevitable.  Baseball fans have this thing about stats that makes it somehow a sin to even suggest, this is something ive never agreed with.  Other sports do it all the time, why does baseball think its immune?
I get the whole compare to the past thing but really thats kind of moot anyway when you factor in social changes and other ways the game has changed around the rule book. 

[floplag]

@Jeff Fletcher is very right, it isnt as easy as most people make it sound, however... there is something to be said for making the effort to at least put the thought in the head of the defense to make make them take a step or two back the other way.  Even if it isnt successful.    Hes hitting under Mendoza, i gotta think he might get 2 out of 10 bunts down maybe? 
simply trying to hit into it seems self fulfilling in this case. 

[Homebrewer]

Bring back the Scioscia Bunting Machine!

[Rollinghard]

Glad I was able to inspire a good discussion. LOL   Cole is done playing MLB in a couple of years. If I were his coach (or agent) he would be trying to make the adjustment and practice his push bunt out of the catchers range. It is not that hard. If he went 3 for 4 by bunting a few games the defense would have to adjust therefore opening  up the right side. 

 

To Jeff Fletcher:

 

Change pitching to solve baseballs boredom problem, how?

 

Does anybody remember what a rally was? How fun it was to be at the park and the crowd going crazy. When good teams had multiple .300 hitters and line ups with BAs above .285.  

[Jeff Fletcher]

4 hours ago, Vladdylonglegs said:

Because he’s hitting .179 and hits a HR once a week. Lol

So I guess he should pull the ball all the time then. 

[yk9001]

Whatever Kole Calhoun is doing, it isn't trending in the right direction.

https://www.fangraphs.com/graphs.aspx?playerid=11200&position=OF&statArr=50&legend=1&split=base&time=season&ymin=&ymax=

[yk9001]

I don't claim to watch a ton of games, but Kole Calhoun currently appears to be a pretty good buggy whip maker in an era when Model Ts are rolling off the assembly line.

[Jeff Fletcher]

Guys, if Calhoun bunted for a hit down the 3B once in a while, the 3B would just move a little closer, but they’d still have the other 3 infielders on the right side of the infield. It wouldn’t change much of anything.

In order for him to be the kind of hitter who defenses play straight up, with two infielders on each side, he’s going to have to do a lot more than bunt once in a while. He’s going to have to change his entire swing. And as we see now, when he hits the ball to the left side he doesn’t hit it very hard, so asking him to use the whole field and hit it hard over the whole field is a pretty big ask.

Like I’ve said before, I think with Calhoun’s current offensive tools, in the game as it’s played today, he can be about 240/320/430 kind of guy. That’s what he can do. 

If you want to try to change around his whole swing (as if that’s possible at this point) the best case scenario is he becomes a 270/350/390 kind of guy, which is actually a lower OPS.

I just don’t think it’s possible for him to change his swing to the degree you guys want it changed. 

Edited April 24, 2019 by Jeff Fletcher

[Jeff Fletcher]

1 minute ago, Vladdylonglegs said:

He's hitting .179 because he tries to pull the ball every time.

Well I just pointed out his average is better when he pulls it than when he doesn’t. 

[AngelsLakersFan]

6 hours ago, Blarg said:

I'm not asking him to be Rod Carew and hit to all fields. I'm just saying that if in the NL they can teach pitchers to bunt that have no skills hitting at all and never really practice hitting, then Calhoun should be able to master that one talent, to the point he can force the defense to defend the play, it would open up the field. It is neither unreasonable nor impossible for him to do. 

I think a big issue is that this generation of hitters was brought up hitting in the middle of lineups expected to be run producers and things like bunting have lapsed. There was no obvious purpose to it, so these guys haven't really learned it. I imagine the current crop of hitters is being trained on bunting (or at least should be) not for the purpose of sacrificing but so that they have the ability to keep the defense honest when they come up to bat.

[AngelsLakersFan]

1 hour ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Guys, if Calhoun bunted for a hit down the 3B once in a while, the 3B would just move a little closer, but they’d still have the other 3 infielders on the right side of the infield. It wouldn’t change much of anything.

In order for him to be the kind of hitter who defenses play straight up, with two infielders on each side, he’s going to have to do a lot more than bunt once in a while. He’s going to have to change his entire swing. And as we see now, when he hits the ball to the left side he doesn’t hit it very hard, so asking him to use the whole field and hit it hard over the whole field is a pretty big ask.

Like I’ve said before, I think with Calhoun’s current offensive tools, in the game as it’s played today, he can be about 240/320/430 kind of guy. That’s what he can do. 

If you want to try to change around his whole swing (as if that’s possible at this point) the best case scenario is he becomes a 270/350/390 kind of guy, which is actually a lower OPS.

I just don’t think it’s possible for him to change his swing to the degree you guys want it changed. 

Looking at the numbers posted in this thread the implication is that his swing is designed to pull pitches on the inner half of the zone. The reason his numbers going the other way suck is because he can't make solid contact on pitches on the outer half of the plate. This coincides with the graph showing pitchers constantly pitching him away. The answer to Kole problems isn't to try and hit the ball the other way, it's to figure out how to hit balls on the outer part of the plate with some authority... no matter which way that might be. Im no hitting instructor but I'd probably start by telling him to move closer to the plate and see what happens.

[VariousCrap]

1 hour ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Well I just pointed out his average is better when he pulls it than when he doesn’t. 

 

Those numbers don't tell the entire story though.  Calhoun's approach at the plate is to always pull the ball.  When he does hit to the other side of the field, it is not on purpose.  It is usually because he is late with his swing or was fooled on a pitch.  If he was purposely trying to hit to that side of the field and was producing those types of numbers, that would be different, but that isn't the case.  Again, the fact players like Calhoun don't spend their offseasons practicing to bunt the other way and hit the other way to combat a shift is just lazy on their parts.

Edited April 24, 2019 by VariousCrap

[T.G.]

[Jeff Fletcher]

3 hours ago, VariousCrap said:

 

Those numbers don't tell the entire story though.  Calhoun's approach at the plate is to always pull the ball.  When he does hit to the other side of the field, it is not on purpose.  It is usually because he is late with his swing or was fooled on a pitch.  If he was purposely trying to hit to that side of the field and was producing those types of numbers, that would be different, but that isn't the case.  Again, the fact players like Calhoun don't spend their offseasons practicing to bunt the other way and hit the other way to combat a shift is just lazy on their parts.

That’s cool how you can read his mind and know what he’s trying to do. 

What I’m telling you is none of this stuff is that easy. There aren’t many guys in the world who really use the whole field and hit the ball hard to all fields. I think it probably takes every ounce of energy and endless hours of practice for him to do what he’s doing. 

I would not use the word lazy. 

Its like saying Calhoun is lazy because he can’t hit like Trout. 

[Tank]

13 hours ago, Stradling said:

I’m sure you guys have noticed that when the play you to pull they also pitch you to pull.  So bunting an inside fastball the opposite way is also very hard to do.  

if you're going to jump into this thread with logic and common sense observations, you can just leave now.