Article on Peter Gammons' site

[YouthofToday]

285 PAs is not a large enough sample size.

[mtangelsfan]

Those were players cumulative stats for their careers not just a one year sample.

 

For Ettin: Bourjos numbers were from 190 games and 285 PA. That should be enough to call a sample size.

 

I like how it's now hip to rip on Petey.  More and more peeps have joined the MHD club since he got traded.  

[jshep]

So did Freese just forget "how to drive in the important run" this postseason or something? Cause that's some shitty timing if so.

Edited November 25, 2013 by jshep

[Blarg]

285 PAs is not a large enough sample size.

 

So what exactly is the magic number for players with 4 years of experience? At some point YoT you have to just say this is the guy we sent to the Cardinals. If he improves, great for them but if he doesn't then they knew what they bought.

[Blarg]

I like how it's now hip to rip on Petey.  More and more peeps have joined the MHD club since he got traded.  

 

I am not ripping Bourjos, I am simply putting out there the true numbers he put up for the Angels the last 4 years. As a defensive CF there are few that can match him. As a player with a bat he is inconsistent and does not perform well with runners in scoring position. It is an honest representation of the player we traded away and not some glorified image of a guy we didn't have so people can say we got ripped off in the trade.

 

Too many agendas going on in these threads and people wanting to point fingers. I always though MHD was wrong with his evaluation but there is the player between MHD and the BS that is floating around here about a player that didn't always do what they say he did. He made amazing plays with the glove, he ran as fast as about anyone in baseball ever did from home to third base. He didn't do well in one area and that was driving in runners when he had opportunities. It is a fair evaluation.

[Docwaukee]

"Are people really questioning whether players have different emotional responses to different game situations and whether that can affect performance? "

Impressive straw man argument.

 

In the above quote, I am actually posing a question about what the argument is.  You may want to look up straw man argument. 

[ettin]

Those were players cumulative stats for their careers not just a one year sample.

 

For Ettin: Bourjos numbers were from 190 games and 285 PA. That should be enough to call a sample size.

 

Actually that is probably not a good sample size. The clutch stat needs a very large sample size (talking thousands of PA's) to arrive at some level of decent correlation.

 

[ettin]

I am not ripping Bourjos, I am simply putting out there the true numbers he put up for the Angels the last 4 years. As a defensive CF there are few that can match him. As a player with a bat he is inconsistent and does not perform well with runners in scoring position. It is an honest representation of the player we traded away and not some glorified image of a guy we didn't have so people can say we got ripped off in the trade.

 

Too many agendas going on in these threads and people wanting to point fingers. I always though MHD was wrong with his evaluation but there is the player between MHD and the BS that is floating around here about a player that didn't always do what they say he did. He made amazing plays with the glove, he ran as fast as about anyone in baseball ever did from home to third base. He didn't do well in one area and that was driving in runners when he had opportunities. It is a fair evaluation.

 

Hi Eric,

 

I understand you are just discussing the original thread.

 

Part of the intense "anger" around here is not just the trade of Bourjos but the way the leaders of this message board conducted themselves. It literally was like a free-for-all in that 24 hours after the trade.

 

I'd love a return to normalcy but everyone involved needs to look in the mirror and reflect on how they acted. This is not in any way a reference to you, Eric, I'm simply making a comment to the general reading audience.

[YouthofToday]

Bourjos is coming off of 2 injury prone seasons. Some chronic like a hamstring. Some totally random like a broken wrist due to a pitch.

He was a 4 WAR CF in his only full season. Time will tell if this is who he really is.

[tennischmp]

So did Freese just forget "how to drive in the important run" this postseason or something? Cause that's some shitty timing if so.

He just wasn't clutch. But he will be next year because I said so

[Docwaukee]

Pete is a nice player but the bottom line is that we had an extra OFer.  While I don't necessarily agree with the direction they went in who they got, it was reasonable to trade him.  Trading Grichuk as well was unnecessary. 

[DW711]

This is another one of these 50/50 deals where you can nitpick on either side..but it will probably be pretty square. I don't think it'll make any dramatic difference towards either team.

 

Salas, I expect to be gone by the All Star Break..a couple of my Cardinal friends don't like him and with St Louis' bullpen..it's easy to see why they gave him up.

 

Joe Smith is a great deal. I don't think people will complain about him too much.