Offensively

[Duren, Duren]

Embrace the bat!

The team's strength and identity is offense right now. And as a fan, that is the most appealing part of the game. 

With Castro, it at least makes the catching lineup spot potentially useful. A veteran bat with decent power and familiarity with the league. No one expects a great resurgence, but even if he pumps out 12 - 15 homers and does a good defensive job he is a serious upgrade.  Catching was essentially a dead zone most of last year.

Adell is the big unknown. First and second will probably turn out decent enough with rotations and platooning. But Adell is going to be isolated in right field.

Calhoun may have had some issues, but he mostly was a legitimate power hitter. And an excellent fielder. You knew what to expect and he was a known quantity. Adell has the potential to be a much more dynamic hitter and at least a better than average fielder. 

The question is, how long will it take?

With the 2020 line up, will he be a quick learner and positive upgrade on Kole,  or a slower work in progress?

Had Calhoun remained in the 2020 line up he realistically would be counted on for 25 plus homers. Especially with Rendon as an addition. As well as steady defense. If Adell can't match that for power right away he could compensate with better hitting/on base production. And solid defense.

Everywhere else in the batting order we pretty much know what to expect. Adell is the tantalizing unknown.

[Vegas Halo Fan]

49 minutes ago, Drink More Yakult said:

We nearly paid that for Hamilton to play for a different team.

Hamilton didn't have a ten year contract that escalated in pay. We were at least cleared of that disaster during our lifetimes.

[krAbs]

6 minutes ago, Duren, Duren said:

Embrace the bat!

 

I've had it with your god damn batman fetish. This has to stop. Its fucking weird.

[Jay]

1 hour ago, UndertheHalo said:

if Ohtani’s bat continues to develop and specifically gets more efficient at consistently getting more lift the offense is better then Minnesota and Boston.  Imo. And right there with NY and Houston. 

Remind me, how does it work with Ohtani again.

He pitches once a week, and doesn't play the day before or after he pitches, so he DH's what, maybe 3-4 times a week?

 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

3 minutes ago, Jay said:

Remind me, how does it work with Ohtani again.

He pitches once a week, and doesn't play the day before or after he pitches, so he DH's what, maybe 3-4 times a week?

That is essentially it, as I recall. 

[Drink More Yakult]

9 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Hamilton didn't have a ten year contract that escalated in pay. We were at least cleared of that disaster during our liffetimes.

We paid $63 million for Hamilton to play for other teams, so there is precedent for the Angels letting a big chunk of money not contribute.

[UndertheHalo]

Maddon said he might be open to letting him hit on the days he pitches.  So I don’t know.  They need his bat in the line up as often as possible.  Definitely no more kiddie glove stuff.  

[krAbs]

Just now, RBM said:

I think that is how Scioscia/Eppler were managing it in 2018 before the injury. 

I've seen discussion here that Maddon may have Ohtani bat on days he pitches and also DH either the day after or day before he starts.

I don't get this. Its like "hmm, you are doing more than any other player in baseball at the moment. Also, you keep getting injured. What if...hear me out. What if you did more?"

[Pancake Bear]

There are people who think the Angels offense is only top ten (or worse)? Geez...

You guys have gotten so pessimistic you don’t even accept objective third party opinions about the team when they’re positive anymore. 

We are a top offense. Period. Not ‘the’, ‘a’ top offense. We’re in the top five. Injuries or breakout years by someone like Adell could change that but that’s roughly where we are. Anyone who says otherwise, I’ll just repeat @GregAlso‘s challenge: Prove it. Don’t just make idiotic assertions.

[Hubs]

I actually think the Angels could be the best offense in the American League in 2020, but almost certainly will be the top 3. The Yankees and Twins should round out the top 3. Astros are gonna slip a little without their advantage, but should still be in the top 5.

In 2019, we were tied for 7th in the AL. That was missing Trout for a month, and also Upton and Simmons drastically disappointing offensively. I strongly feel Adell is gonna be the RoY, so that will more than compensate for the loss of Calhoun. Catcher and 3rd Base will be better. 1st base will be better too.

[Claude]

[mulwin444]

19 minutes ago, Vladdylonglegs said:

I don’t need algorithms to see that outside of the MOTO this offense is horrid. Just as I didn’t need models to tell me this team was going to blow in 2019 and Goodwin was going to outperform Upton. I’m a realist. 

Last season, Angels were 7th in the AL (15th in the MLB) in runs scored with Trout, Simmons, Ohtani, Upton, and LaStella all missing big chunks of time.  Now, everyone is coming in healthy and the projected line-up is:

1 - Fletcher 2B/LF (.290 .350 OBP)

2 - Trout CF (40 HR 1.000+ OPS)

3 - Ohtani DH (30HR .900 OPS potential)

4 - Rendon 3B (30 HRs .950-1.000 OPS)

5 - Upton LF/DH (30 HRs .250 .800+ OPS)

6 - Pujols/LaStella 1B/DH/2B (Combine for 30 HR with average from .250-.300 .730-.800 OPS)

7 - Simmons SS (.280 .330 OBP 10 HRs)

8 - Goodwin/Adell RF (Goodwin capable of .260 .330 .790 OPS with 15+ HR, Adell is TBD)

9 - Castro C (.230 .330 .750 OPS 10+ HRs)

Bench: Rengifo (.230+ .330+ .700 OPS), 

Outside of the MOTO, this line-up is not "horrid" unless you are unfamiliar with its meaning.  The peaks are obviously high but the drop off after that is not as significant as we saw last season when you had a line-up featuring Taylor Ward, Matt Thaiss, Anthony Bemboom, Michael Hermosillo, Justin Bour and Jared Walsh 

 

 

[Pancake Bear]

41 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

The one unknown in this is how much, and in what situations, Maddon will use Pujols. He isn't completely without value, but his days as an elite hitter are far behind him. Will the Angels really pay $30M per year for a situational pinch hitter, or will he be penciled into the lineup every day?

I don’t think you grasp the concept of a sunk cost, which is what the final years of Pujols’ contract were always going to be. Most people understand you don’t give playing time to a bad player just because you’re paying him more money than almost everyone else.

[Pancake Bear]

Also, for you all worrying about Pujols being an everyday player, Fabian Ardaya’s latest article for the Athletic posted a hypothetical lineup which featured Albert sitting and La Stella at 1B. Fletcher suggested that possibility as well some time back. La Stella is substantially superior at this point as a hitter and if two reporters who cover the team are suggesting this as a legit possibility, it isn’t just a far fetched fan idea, it’s probably a likelihood that Pujols will not be an everyday player in 2020 or 2021 unless things are going horribly wrong. 

[Vegas Halo Fan]

11 minutes ago, Pancake Bear said:

I don’t think you grasp the concept of a sunk cost, which is what the final years of Pujols’ contract were always going to be. Most people understand you don’t give playing time to a bad player just because you’re paying him more money than almost everyone else.

Up until now, that has happened. I understand sunk costs, but thus far the field manager hasn't.

[Chuck]

1 hour ago, Vladdylonglegs said:

I don’t need algorithms to see that outside of the MOTO this offense is horrid. Just as I didn’t need models to tell me this team was going to blow in 2019 and Goodwin was going to outperform Upton. I’m a realist. 

[Pancake Bear]

11 minutes ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

Up until now, that has happened. I understand sunk costs, but thus far the field manager hasn't.

Ausmus said prior to last year Albert would have to earn playing time. I contend he did last year relative to alternate options. That will not be the case this year. 

[hangin n wangin]

1 hour ago, GregAlso said:

Based on anyone who can really project next year’s stats we have a top 5 offense. I triple dog dare you to pull up any of the publicly available projection systems, even ZiPs which is notoriously conservative, and find one where your prediction is even close. I mean where we are even 9th in the league in offense. Seriously try that. When you fail, because you will, Come back and apologize for your stupidity. Then strive to be a more realistic person, which I know is a lot to ask of you. 

[hangin n wangin]

1 hour ago, Vegas Halo Fan said:

The one unknown in this is how much, and in what situations, Maddon will use Pujols. He isn't completely without value, but his days as an elite hitter are far behind him. Will the Angels really pay $30M per year for a situational pinch hitter, or will he be penciled into the lineup every day?

I'd even argue that he is completely with out value, numbers wise. He is actually negative value. He does nothing to help this baseball team. As a mentor, sure, fine. But they need to keep his fat ass on the bench where he belongs and only play him when are other guys need rest.

[Vlad27Trout27]

Top 3! and if Adell exceeds top 2.

Also another note i noticed, Rendon is leaving the NL east, where there so many true 1s/ace and coming to the west. it should help.

 

[ettin]

2 hours ago, Glen said:

I tend to think the same.  Still, having a potential top-five offense is sweet.

"I'm not #1! Oh I'm sorry I lied! I'm number 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5!"

[Bronson]

1 hour ago, Chuckster70 said:

I think by 2021 we'll have a top 3 offense. 

Jo Adell would most likely a full to half a year of seeing big league pitching, Ohtani will be in year 4 of the big leagues and I think there's a really good shot at us signing Realmuto at C which will significantly boost our lineup. Also, Pujols will either be retired (hoping) or relegated to pinch hitting which means we'll see more of Thaiss or La Stella (if he's still around), hell anyone at that position.

Maybe Marsh is in LF and Upton gets at bats against just lefties and some work at DH on Ohtani's pitching days.

But yeah, a top 5 offense isn't too shabby.

 

You really think we have a shot at signing Realmuto? That would be insane if we did. 

Maybe that’s why we only gave Castro a 1 year deal. 

[hangin n wangin]

39 minutes ago, Pancake Bear said:

I don’t think you grasp the concept of a sunk cost, which is what the final years of Pujols’ contract were always going to be. Most people understand you don’t give playing time to a bad player just because you’re paying him more money than almost everyone else.

We have given playing time to the bad player, for the last 4 years. I know, I know, we didn't have anyone else, blah blah blah. Well, that's on management for being stupid.

[tdawg87]

On paper this is absolutely a top 5 offense. Obviously we'll see where they end up but this lineup is legit. I expect big things from Fletcher, not to mention Simmons and Upton returning to form. The loss of Kole sucks but I think between Goodwin/Herm/Adell we will easily see that made up.

We also have Marsh who is basically just as close as Adell, and the odds that one of those two breaks out is pretty decent.

Oh and we also have some Rondon hitting behind Trout which will be super neat.

As for the thread topic, I don't see the point in trading from a strength to cover a weakness when the only real tradable assets are Rengifo, Thaiss, and La Stella. Those three alone aren't going to net us anything special. Goodwin could become another asset mid-season if Adell is ready. 

Basically, we have a sick lineup and we have solid depth as well. I think we should keep that intact, sign Alex Wood, and maybe work a trade using prospects not named Marsh or Adell for a decent 4 starter with control.

I'll be in my bunk.

 

[Pancake Bear]

13 minutes ago, hangin n wangin said:

We have given playing time to the bad player, for the last 4 years. I know, I know, we didn't have anyone else, blah blah blah. Well, that's on management for being stupid.

He’s a below average bat, he isn’t Jeff Mathis. If we’d been serious about contending, we would have upgraded 1B. Since we weren’t, why screw with Albert’s pursuit of counting number records?