Cobb or Lynn?

[Dtwncbad]

The free agent market is obviously much softer than anyone thought.

It seems like there may be a value deal to be made.

It might be a smart move to land a reliable arm for 4 years between 60 and 70 million.

The Angels have lots of bodies for the 2018 rotation but just as many question marks.

Having Cobb or Lynn would be so stabilizing. . .

 

[tdawg87]

Lynn for the consistency. I like Cobb but I feel like he'd be kind of redundant in our rotation.

[wopphil]

Either one would be a huge help. My concern with Lynn is the bad FIP he put up last year, though perhaps he will improve that being two years removed from TJ.

[totdprods]

I don't think there's much difference between Lynn, Cobb, Garcia, Hellickson, or Vargas in terms of the average production you'd get from any one of them. 

So at that point, I'd just aim to get whoever comes with the best dollar value and maybe whoever has the best GB% and K9 rates.

[DMVol]

Signing one might also open up the possibility of a trade this spring....see how everybody is health wise and we might have some depth to make a trade....

[stanick88]

I say no to anyone attached to a draft pick. And I believe both Lynn and Cobb are. So I say no to both. That is like trading a second round pick, and spending money likely to push us up against the luxury tax. No thank you. But that’s just my opinion though, and I’m not in the front office. 

[stanick88]

But either would help our team. But I just don’t think the second round pick along with spending up to the tax is worth the potential improvement. I’d much rather spend just a bit more and get Darvish (not attached to a pick). As Darvish would put us over the top I think and allow more flexibility in working out our pitching staff, allowing someone to slide into the pen and/or be traded for another piece. 

[VariousCrap]

2 hours ago, totdprods said:

I don't think there's much difference between Lynn, Cobb, Garcia, Hellickson, or Vargas in terms of the average production you'd get from any one of them. 

So at that point, I'd just aim to get whoever comes with the best dollar value and maybe whoever has the best GB% and K9 rates.

 

I think Hellickson or Vargas is the way to go if the Angels want to add an arm.  Neither cost a draft pick and neither should cost much compared to Cobb/Lynn. 

[Angel Oracle]

3 hours ago, totdprods said:

I don't think there's much difference between Lynn, Cobb, Garcia, Hellickson, or Vargas in terms of the average production you'd get from any one of them. 

So at that point, I'd just aim to get whoever comes with the best dollar value and maybe whoever has the best GB% and K9 rates.

FIFY, as Vargas was horrible post-ASB and turns 35. 

[VariousCrap]

4 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

FIFY, as Vargas was horrible post-ASB and turns 35. 

 

If you sign a guy like Vargas, you only sign him to a one year deal.  It is not that big of a risk.

[totdprods]

3 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

FIFY, as Vargas was horrible post-ASB and turns 35. 

Yeah, but he's also probably the cheapest of all the options and least commitment. His first half was also arguably better than anything any of them did last year except for Cobb. 

None of them are fantastic options but all of them could be fairly cheap options. In my eyes, all have around the same level of risk and probably roughly the same shot at putting together a good season. Cobb has the edge, but he'll also get the most money of that group, which sort of negates it. 

I don't think 180 innings of ~4.00 ERA on a cheap deal is a bad thing to consider.

[VariousCrap]

Actually, the more I think about it, the more I'd like to see the Angels sign Cashner to a deal over the rest of them.  He'd be a solid back of the rotation pitcher.

[floplag]

i truthfully don't think i see either as a true upgrade, we have enough SP depth, if we make a move in that direction it needs to be a c;ear unquestionable upgrade/ace.  

[stormngt]

with all our pitching depth why would we want to sign a back end starter?

 

[DMVol]

17 minutes ago, stormngt said:

with all our pitching depth why would we want to sign a back end starter?

 

We wouldn't unless Eppler really likes one of the FA's.....although we have depth, there are a lot of health issues among the starters...lf Eppler thinks one of the FA's has a better track record of staying healthy, there might be some appeal there...

[greginpsca]

Cobb had a k/9 of 6.4.. The pitchers that we have seen Eppler go after are harder throwers with higher k/9 rates. That could be why the Angels don't seem to be interested. Especially for the money involved.

[stormngt]

11 minutes ago, DMVol said:

We wouldn't unless Eppler really likes one of the FA's.....although we have depth, there are a lot of health issues among the starters...lf Eppler thinks one of the FA's has a better track record of staying healthy, there might be some appeal there...

i don't have a problem if we wanted to get a top end starter.  I just believe we have a lot of back end rotation options already.

[totdprods]

16 minutes ago, greginpsca said:

Cobb had a k/9 of 6.4.. The pitchers that we have seen Eppler go after are harder throwers with higher k/9 rates. That could be why the Angels don't seem to be interested. Especially for the money involved.

Couple years before that though it was over 8. Seems to me he may be the type of pitcher that is over/under-using a pitch, which is definitely a big part of Eppler's formula.

Totally forgot about Cashner - he also seems like someone who fits that bill. How else do you go from a career average 7.5 K9 to 4.5 K9 in one year, while still being quasi-effective? Seems like there could be something there Eppler's staff can see for him to revisit.

[Mark68]

Garcia. Career K/9 of 7.3 & 57% ground ball rate (7.4 & 56% last year).

[DMVol]

49 minutes ago, stormngt said:

i don't have a problem if we wanted to get a top end starter.  I just believe we have a lot of back end rotation options already.

Just not sure we are willing to pay Darvish or Arrieta type money this year....

[SlappyUtilityMIF]

Lynn he is a battler! He still started 33 games last year first season back from TJ. His FIP was high but on the flip side I equate that to getting his feet under him POST - TJ... His WHIP was down! Hits per 9 were Down, His HR's were up but that was due to a BAD September & Horrid June (The Pirates hit him well & Baltimore in Baltimore when it heats up 4 HR's allowed in that game) Everyone else was 4 runs or less in his starts. He AVG's 5 2/3rd per start (Quickest exit 2/3 vs Pirates and 3 other games 4 2/3's or less..in these games he gave up 7 of his 27 HR's allowed..) Pull those games out and in his 29 other starts he AVG 6 innings per start and his ERA is 2.55....

 

4 bad games out of 33 starts!!! We aren't talking Nolasco/Chavez type starts here where we've got to really nit pick them!

Pre-TJ he threw pretty hard and struck out more. Post-TJ I watched an interview of him and he said his velo was down a tick so he had to focus on his mechanics and spots and work on getting more ground balls early in the count.

He is also a workhorse Pre -TJ approx 186 innings per year   Post - TJ last year (small sample size) 186.

 

If a Opportunity for a solid Team and player friendly DEAL is there!..... JUMP!~    

[VariousCrap]

On paper this team looks to have a lot of pitching depth, but until they can prove they can stay healthy, I don't think it would be unwise to get one more arm like Cashner.

 

 

[stormngt]

8 hours ago, DMVol said:

Just not sure we are willing to pay Darvish or Arrieta type money this year....

I tend to agree.  I just don't see the benefit of spending tens of millions on the same type of players we already have.

[totdprods]

20 hours ago, Mark68 said:

Garcia. Career K/9 of 7.3 & 57% ground ball rate (7.4 & 56% last year).

I think Garcia would be a great option. We're a little thin on left-handed pitching even with Skaggs and Heaney, and if we wind up needing a mid-season trade, I could see both guys being offered up for an impact player, and having Garcia would give us some LHSP depth still. 

I'd like Lynn if he'd settle for a 1 or 2 year, but I bet someone will still offer him 3-5 years for decent enough money. 

21 hours ago, stormngt said:

with all our pitching depth why would we want to sign a back end starter?

The last two years proved otherwise. Surely, it won't happen a 3rd time, but you never know. Additionally, you can always trade starting pitching during the season - whether it be said FA SP we sign, or depth like Ramirez, Tropeano, Bridwell, or a higher-level guy like Heaney or Skaggs.

Our only SP that is out of options is Ramirez, and he can be used out of the pen, so it isn't like a SLC rotation of Heaney, Tropeano, Bridwell, Barria, etc. is a bad thing. Rotate them up as needed for the 6th SP. Someone will eventually get hurt.

[stormngt]

2 hours ago, totdprods said:

I think Garcia would be a great option. We're a little thin on left-handed pitching even with Skaggs and Heaney, and if we wind up needing a mid-season trade, I could see both guys being offered up for an impact player, and having Garcia would give us some LHSP depth still. 

I'd like Lynn if he'd settle for a 1 or 2 year, but I bet someone will still offer him 3-5 years for decent enough money. 

The last two years proved otherwise. Surely, it won't happen a 3rd time, but you never know. Additionally, you can always trade starting pitching during the season - whether it be said FA SP we sign, or depth like Ramirez, Tropeano, Bridwell, or a higher-level guy like Heaney or Skaggs.

Our only SP that is out of options is Ramirez, and he can be used out of the pen, so it isn't like a SLC rotation of Heaney, Tropeano, Bridwell, Barria, etc. is a bad thing. Rotate them up as needed for the 6th SP. Someone will eventually get hurt.

The lack of depth is front rotation pitchers, not backend rotation.  We have plenty of those.

Probable starters, Ruchards, Heaney,  Skaggs, Ohtani, Shoemaker.

For depth Ramirez in the bullpen

Bridwell, Tropeano both are proven starters in AAA.   That is right deep.  Now let's add Barria (sp?) Who just about everyone says is major league ready.  That's nine deep. We could lose four starters with injuries and still have the depth.

What we don't have is depth as a lock down starter.  Richard's is the only one and we hope Otani.  That's why I would mind Darvish if price is right but it would be a waste of money and stalling the progression of others just to sign another 4th or 5th guy.