Mariners check in as Baseball America’s worst farm system

[Inside Pitch]

12 hours ago, Erstad Grit said:

I could totally be wrong.......

but I think I recall having a back and forth with you here about how Dipoto sucks and you thought he was a genius. You kept saying and the end of 2016 how they were only one game out and I kept saying yeah but the core players from that team weren't from him.

Was that you? 

That was Ender..   Cez was more of the belief that Jerry was being targeted by Angels fans as a scapegoat for Arte's misdeeds as had been widely reported in the media.  Props to Jerry and his operatives for getting that narrative out there in their weekly leaks to the media.   One of the more successful aspects of his tenure as GM of the Angels.

[ten ocho recon scout]

The irony for the sosh haters (and i wss team dipoto when it all went down) is that sosh standing up to dipoto likely saved this team from further misery...

How has dipoto drafted in seattle? I dont follow that stuff, but have his picks been roughly the same? High floor, mediocre guys?

It seems hes absolutely running that team into the ground as he did here. Im suprised there isnt more chatter about that from the media pointing that out.

[Second Base]

27 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

The irony for the sosh haters (and i wss team dipoto when it all went down) is that sosh standing up to dipoto likely saved this team from further misery...

How has dipoto drafted in seattle? I dont follow that stuff, but have his picks been roughly the same? High floor, mediocre guys?

It seems hes absolutely running that team into the ground as he did here. Im suprised there isnt more chatter about that from the media pointing that out.

He's only been in Seattle two years. After two years, Angels fans still loved the guy. 

Sure, he'd failed to build a winner after spending like 500 million in free agency, but.....

1. We have Mike Trout! (As irony would have it, he's the result of the Reagins era, and a year after drafting him, Reagins fired anyone that had anything to do with drafting Mike Trout.)

2. Dipoto wasn't a puppet like Reagins. Common knowledge was that Scioscia was the actually GM here.

3. He liked analytics and didn't much care for the archaic ways of scouting.

4. #MediaFriendly

So yeah, after two years there's little doubt that he's mostly beloved in Seattle. But by year 4-5....no he'll be run out of town like Britney Spears at a garage band convention aka AA.

Now as it would be, the man we hired Dipoto over (Billy Eppler) is the anti-Dipoto.

1. Mike Trout became big during Dipoto's tenure, but Eppler's the one that will surround him with talent and sign him to the career long extension that makes him an Angel now and forever.

2. Dipoto spent money and ignored the farm. So far, Eppler has restrained himself from any mega contracts and focused a lot of his efforts on building a very talented a deep farm to sustain the future of the ball club.

2-B Dipoto butted heads with a stubborn and unwilling to change Scioscia. Eppler talks to Scioscia for hours a day and we've seen the shift in Scioscia into a smarter manager.

3. Instead of making appearances at analytic conferences and talking about advanced metrics, Eppler actually uses them and translates them and then discusses with the coaching staff and scouts if this is what they see. Analytics AND scouting.

4. Dipoto had leaks in his front office, which I've come to believe were used to his advantage. Eppler doesn't.

[Ohtani&Trout]

https://www.baseballamerica.com/online/prospects/rankings/organization-talent-rankings/2012/2613151.html

Baseball America had the Marlins as the 3rd worst farm system in 2012. And that was with Yelich, Fernandez (RIP), Ozuna, Realmuto, etc. as their top prospects.

The Mariners may very well have the worst farm system in baseball. But these things can change fast.

[Blarg]

I'm pleased with the direction that the Angels and Mariners are heading.

[Stradling]

10 minutes ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

Jerry  did put together a team that could have gone to the World Series  (should have gone to the World Series)  . He really didn't trade any prospects that were worth a shit. The Angels have never gone through a rebuild season in the last twenty years. He was only here 3 1/2 year's.  He gambled on winning a World Series, he was stuck with Scioscia. 

I quality GM would have drafted better.  The number one quality a GM needs to have is the power to persuade.  He failed at that time and time again.  If he didn’t sign Albert or Josh that means Arte did, it also meant wasn’t able to persuade Arte to not go after those guys.  Because of that the signings are on him.  He also was incapable of getting Arte to get rid of Scioscia. Unfortunately 2014 falls on Albert and Trout for failing to produce. 

[Stradling]

I agree but he’s shown his true colors.  He has complete control, he hand picked his manager and the same result, only quicker. 

[AngelsLakersFan]

1 hour ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

The irony for the sosh haters (and i wss team dipoto when it all went down) is that sosh standing up to dipoto likely saved this team from further misery...

How has dipoto drafted in seattle? I dont follow that stuff, but have his picks been roughly the same? High floor, mediocre guys?

It seems hes absolutely running that team into the ground as he did here. Im suprised there isnt more chatter about that from the media pointing that out.

Dipoto's real problem is that he can't draft.

[Second Base]

17 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I quality GM would have drafted better.  The number one quality a GM needs to have is the power to persuade.  He failed at that time and time again.  If he didn’t sign Albert or Josh that means Arte did, it also meant wasn’t able to persuade Arte to not go after those guys.  Because of that the signings are on him.  He also was incapable of getting Arte to get rid of Scioscia. Unfortunately 2014 falls on Albert and Trout for failing to produce. 

Hamilton and Pujols are on Dipoto regardless. Arte Moreno isn't the freakin' GM, Dipoto is. Both of them were Dipoto's idea. The fact that Moreno got involved in both negotiations was simply to help sell the team.

But upon Dipoto's exodus, which was a chickensh__ move, there's suddenly floated this idea to the media that quoted sources in the organization that Moreno was responsible for Pujols and Hamilton. And if you ask some of those same leaks, they'd blame the national cross-checker on all the college SP draft busts.

I mean is it any coincidence that once Eppler was here, that same crosschecker took Thaiss and Marsh?

The draft pick comes down to the GM, plain and simple.

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

Hamilton and Pujols are on Dipoto regardless. Arte Moreno isn't the freakin' GM, Dipoto is. Both of them were Dipoto's idea. The fact that Moreno got involved in both negotiations was simply to help sell the team.

But upon Dipoto's exodus, which was a chickensh__ move, there's suddenly floated this idea to the media that quoted sources in the organization that Moreno was responsible for Pujols and Hamilton. And if you ask some of those same leaks, they'd blame the national cross-checker on all the college SP draft busts.

I mean is it any coincidence that once Eppler was here, that same crosschecker took Thaiss and Marsh?

The draft pick comes down to the GM, plain and simple.

I agree except the Arte signing Albert and Josh narrative pre-dates Dipoto leaving.  Dipoto was the leak in the front office and that’s not a big surprise. 

[101halo]

21 hours ago, Erstad Grit said:

It was Ender!

Don't feel bad. Dipoto presents himself very well and we all drank his koolaide too. 

If M's ever go into sell mode a good GM has lots of pieces to rebuild the farm quickly.  I'm hoping Felix has a bounce back too. Baseball is better when he's an ace. 

 

Full transparency: I was pissed when Dipoto left, thought he was brilliant and the fall guy for Scioscia's defencicies. Also, I texted my Dad earlier today and told him the Vikings game was going to be boring and they were going to blow out the Eagles. Oops. 

In my defense, I was all over Trout being a once in a lifetime player, as early as High A ball. Sat in CF during the Futures game and he tried to throw me a 3rd out. Some asshole jumped in front and got it. I stopped the offer at 200 bucks for the ball, guy wanted 500.  Had this weird feeling I should pay it, but couldn't. First ever ball Trout passed to a fan at Angel Stadium. Wouldn't be worth anything than bragging rights without proof, but a hell of a souvenir. 

[JarsOfClay]

The sad part is many mariner fans are making the same excuses for Jerry that angel fans did....

"Jerry inherited a complete mess","This is all Jeff Z's fault", "Jerry didnt trade any valuable prospects anyways"

lol

[bloodbrother]

22 minutes ago, JarsOfClay said:

The sad part is many mariner fans are making the same excuses for Jerry that angel fans did....

"Jerry inherited a complete mess","This is all Jeff Z's fault", "Jerry didnt trade any valuable prospects anyways"

lol

I've seen that too. I'd feel bad if they weren't a hated rival but they are so lol sucks for them!

[Second Base]

4 hours ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

Jerry  did put together a team that could have gone to the World Series  (should have gone to the World Series)  . He really didn't trade any prospects that were worth a shit. The Angels have never gone through a rebuild season in the last twenty years. He was only here 3 1/2 year's.  He gambled on winning a World Series, he was stuck with Scioscia. 

Dipoto inherited Trout, Trumbo, Kendrick, Aybar, Calhoun, Richards and Weaver.

He bought Albert Pujols for 240 million.

Dipoto built jacks---

[101halo]

7 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

Dipoto inherited Trout, Trumbo, Kendrick, Aybar, Calhoun, Richards and Weaver.

He bought Albert Pujols for 240 million.

Dipoto built jacks---

As a window into the inner workings of modern baseball front office's, I present to you Dipoto's advanced statastical formula for Albert's contract: $400k for every RBI he's expected to produce over the length of contract. Bonuses for every out he runs into on the bases. 

[Second Base]

Jerry Dipoto inherited an 86 win team with Mike Trout, Kendrys Morales, Howie Kendrick, Erick Aybar, Torii Hunter, Jered Weaver, and Dan Haren in the majors....

And a farm system with Mike Trout, Garrett Richards, Jean Segura, CJ Cron, John Hellweg, Kole Calhoun, Randal Grichuk, Ariel Pena and Cam Bedrosian in the minor leagues.

He could have literally sat on his worthless butt and twiddled his thumbs and built a perennial contender.

Jerry Dipoto proceeded to trade prospects, inflate payroll and show extremely poor communication and judgment in his time with the Angels.

He's the worst GM in baseball and one of the biggest a--holes too.

[101halo]

12 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

Jerry Dipoto inherited an 86 win team with Mike Trout, Kendrys Morales, Howie Kendrick, Erick Aybar, Torii Hunter, Jered Weaver, and Dan Haren in the majors....

And a farm system with Mike Trout, Garrett Richards, Jean Segura, CJ Cron, John Hellweg, Kole Calhoun, Randal Grichuk, Ariel Pena and Cam Bedrosian in the minor leagues.

He could have literally sat on his worthless butt and twiddled his thumbs and built a perennial contender.

Jerry Dipoto proceeded to trade prospects, inflate payroll and show extremely poor communication and judgment in his time with the Angels.

He's the worst GM in baseball and one of the biggest a--holes too.

I think the biggest eye opener to me was when Scioscia spoke to how good it was to work with Eppler, with us knowing Eppler was presenting likely similar sabremetrics to Sosh that Dipoto was. Dipoto is smart, but seems to want it acknowledged that he's the smartest guy in the room, while Eppler has the same knowledge but can acknowledge the value of Scioscia's experience. Very minor difference that makes for a massive difference in the way it's received. 

For those that met Dipoto, please feel free to disagree, I loved him for a while, this is just my perspective in retrospect. 

Edit: just fixing bad grammar. 

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, JarsOfClay said:

The sad part is many mariner fans are making the same excuses for Jerry that angel fans did....

"Jerry inherited a complete mess","This is all Jeff Z's fault", "Jerry didnt trade any valuable prospects anyways"

lol

Jerry knows how to pick his spots...   I'm sure he's got lackeys leaking info up there absolving him of everything.   

[Inside Pitch]

27 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

Jerry Dipoto inherited an 86 win team with Mike Trout, Kendrys Morales, Howie Kendrick, Erick Aybar, Torii Hunter, Jered Weaver, and Dan Haren in the majors....

And a farm system with Mike Trout, Garrett Richards, Jean Segura, CJ Cron, John Hellweg, Kole Calhoun, Randal Grichuk, Ariel Pena and Cam Bedrosian in the minor leagues.

He could have literally sat on his worthless butt and twiddled his thumbs and built a perennial contender.

Jerry Dipoto proceeded to trade prospects, inflate payroll and show extremely poor communication and judgment in his time with the Angels.

He's the worst GM in baseball and one of the biggest a--holes too.

People used to always yammer away at how bad the farm system and team were when he took over..   

He inherited a rotation that had three guys 30 or younger all of them having topped at least 220 innings with ERAs below 3.37.   The offense had 5 guys age 28 or younger who posted OPS+ figures of 110 or better...  They also had three players in BBA Top 100 in 2011, the year before Jerry got here; Trout, Chatwood (57), and Segura (76).    

He traded two of them away almost as soon as he got here...

 

[tdawg87]

I count my blessings every day that Dipoto didn't trade Trout. I'm certain he considered it.

[ten ocho recon scout]

1 hour ago, ANAHEIMBOB said:

He brought in Huston Street and Joe Smith. The only player from the farm system  that has done anything is Mike Trout. Richards might pan out. Calhoun has been ok. The rest haven't done shit. Gas can Bedrosian has been great. He did get stuck with Scioscia.

He traded segura, right? Grichuk is still far better than anyone dipoto drafted. Which brings up the next point. In the 3 or so drafts dipoto headed up, who did he draft that matters?

Either here or Seattle....

[ten ocho recon scout]

1 hour ago, tdawg87 said:

I count my blessings every day that Dipoto didn't trade Trout. I'm certain he considered it.

For Stanton in 2013...

[Stradling]

2 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

He traded segura, right? Grichuk is still far better than anyone dipoto drafted. Which brings up the next point. In the 3 or so drafts dipoto headed up, who did he draft that matters?

Either here or Seattle....

Newcomb and Jam Jones. 

[AngelArcher]

Not to make excuses for Dipoto, but he didn't have a 1st round pick for a few years.

 

[Blarg]

That happens when you give them away signing Pujols and Hamilbum.