Arte has an answer for your critics.

[Ohtaniland]

Gone are the days where almost ever player was a superstar because of PED's. There are only a handful of superstar players left today so it's not easy for just one team to sign them all.

We have Pujols, Trout, Hamilton, Weaver and Wilson all on the books. The last team to sign them all and win it all was the Yankees with Tex, Sabathia and Burnett. They produced one championship. Now look at the mess the Yankees are in payroll wise.

Arte has learned the hard way that paying someone for their past doesn't mean squat for the future.

[tdawg87]

The Yankees are in much better shape than the Angels.

And Arte hasn't learned anything no matter how many times you say it. Once Weaver, Wilson, and Hamilton are off the books you can bet your ass he's going to try to bring in Harper or Arrenado.

[Ohtaniland]

The Yankees are in much better shape than the Angels.

And Arte hasn't learned anything no matter how many times you say it. Once Weaver, Wilson, and Hamilton are off the books you can bet your ass he's going to try to bring in Harper or Arrenado.

Well you mentioned the names of three top paid superstars that Arte paid good money to but didn't deliver him a championship. Jason Heyward wouldn't have either and Arte knew that.

[Docwaukee]

Well you mentioned the names of three top paid superstars that Arte paid good money to but didn't deliver him a championship. Jason Heyward wouldn't have either and Arte knew that.

that would be relevant if Arte's goal was to win a championship.  He spends money in anticipation that it will make him money.  

 

When you have Mike Trout, there really isn't much you can add to a team that would lure more fans as long as the team has a chance to compete.  In 2013, they drew over 3 million fans during a 78 win season.  

 

They won 98 games the following year and drew an additional 75k fans.  

 

So why add 20mil to payroll per season when it isn't going to net you additional revenue?  

[Amazing Larry]

The Yankees are in much better shape than the Angels.

And Arte hasn't learned anything no matter how many times you say it. Once Weaver, Wilson, and Hamilton are off the books you can bet your ass he's going to try to bring in Harper or Arrenado.

I would go from 6:00 to midnight if Arte signed Arrenado.

[ukyah]

this topic is about to piss me off. that's all i can add to this thread. i'm really not that interested when an owner starts spinning numbers and talking about profit. my eyes go to the wall like forrest gump.

[Docwaukee]

mlb has something called the debt service rule which limits the amount of debt a team can have relative to their EBITDA.  Arte has zero debt right now, but in anticipation of taking on some new stadium debt, maybe he's trying to keep his books in order.  The multiplier for a team building a new stadium is 12x EBITDA.  

[Lou]

mlb has something called the debt service rule which limits the amount of debt a team can have relative to their EBITDA.  Arte has zero debt right now, but in anticipation of taking on some new stadium debt, maybe he's trying to keep his books in order.  The multiplier for a team building a new stadium is 12x EBITDA.  

 

exactly,  doc

 

this is just another example of how 99% of those upset at Arte for not spending his money or taking on debt have absolutely no idea what they are talking about.  Arte is playing high-stakes chess while those people are playing checkers  hey, look what I found in my nose!

[ABC]

so...Arte doesn't have enough cash to run the team AND qualify for a stadium. Time to sell.

[tdawg87]

Well you mentioned the names of three top paid superstars that Arte paid good money to but didn't deliver him a championship. Jason Heyward wouldn't have either and Arte knew that.

Trout hasn't delivered a championship since signing an extension. Hopefully Arte can trade him or let him walk in 5 years.

[Ohtaniland]

People here forget that Arte has had a top 7 ranked MLB payroll since 2004. He's spent tons of money but it will never be enough.

Now that the overpaid underachievers can't get it done (they never did) the fans want Arte to spend more money to help subsidize and mask the failing players.

[Stradling]

Well a top 7 payroll means he's 7th. So last year the 6 ahead of him failed too. Once again Claude you ignore that he ignores the development side of building an organization. If you ignore that completely then you have to spend to compete. Top 7 payroll to go with a top 2 TV contract annually. Seems about right to me.

[nate]

Top 2 TV contract?  Where do you get that from?

[Stradling]

I'll find the article, but they bring in $147 million annually. The Dodgers were well above that. All the teams that own their networks get around $100 million annually but they also get commercial revenue that is classified differently if I recall correctly.

[Stradling]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/dodgers-could-be-last-team-to-strike-gold-with-local-tv-deal/

Tied with the Rangers. Dodgers are at $340 million annually.

[nate]

That is a little misleading.  The Yankees get way more from their deal because YES is much more valuable than FSW.

[tdawg87]

Most of us respect Arte Moreno for what he has been willing to do and spend. But he doesn't spend money out of the goodness of his heart. He does it because he wants to ultimately turn a profit. This offseason has made it abundantly clear that winning is no longer the main priority for Arte. He wants to spend enough to keep the team profitable, but not enough to put them over the top. Would getting Heyward or Cespedes or Upton have put them over the top? Maybe. Maybe not. But using the funds that would have been allocated towards those guys to bring in 2 or 3 solid players definitely would have. Hell, they could have gotten Denard Span, Howie Kendrick and Antonio Bastardo for essentially what Heyward got. But we didn't bother with those guys because "economics".

 

We have no minor league system, no international signing budget, and an owner who has put a hard cap on the payroll. So basically we have to sit in limbo while Mike Trout's contract runs out.

[Stradling]

That is a little misleading. The Yankees get way more from their deal because YES is much more valuable than FSW.

I'm sure they do just like I'm sure Arte gets more than $150 because of part ownership of FOX. I can only assume those extra dollars that the Yanks and teams like that bring in aren't part of the monies they share with the league.

[VariousCrap]

word has it that they never intended to sign Greinke and that Hamilton was the target all along.  That's how I heard it.  

 

 

That is how everyone remembers it except for Strad.  I remember the Angels were never considered serious players in Greinke because they knew he was out of their price range.

[VariousCrap]

If Arte wants to spend enough money to put together a team that is consistently a winning team, but does not want to spend enough to compete for the WS and go in "debt", I personally find that to be acceptable.  It is better than what Disney and Autry did.

 

My only wish is if he is going to limit the team by keeping the payroll at 140-150 million, he needs to invest in the Latin and Asian markets.  Keeping the payroll at that level without investing in those foreign markets will hurt the team in the long run.

[Mark68]

That is how everyone remembers it except for Strad.  I remember the Angels were never considered serious players in Greinke because they knew he was out of their price range.

I think that Greinke was always on record as preferring the NL.

[Mark68]

If Arte doesn't want to spend any more money on impact free agents, fine. But he has to follow that up by investing in the international market and on the talent evaluation, because he's pretty much painted the team into a corner. Right now, the only way to improve the team, given limited tradeable assets and no legitimate talent on the farm, is fork over the money for free agents.

[Stradling]

I think the Angels set aside the money for Greinke and when it because apparent that he was going to the highest bidder the team decided to go a different direction. Remember all the talk about Greinke not being able to handle the pressure of a big city because of his social anxiety issues before he signed with the Dodgers. We dicussed that at length on here. At that point Greinke was gone Hunter was off the table because he had already signed with Detroit.

[VariousCrap]

I think that Greinke was always on record as preferring the NL.

 

 

 

No, he was on record that whoever offered the most $$$ was going to get him.

[VariousCrap]

If Arte doesn't want to spend any more money on impact free agents, fine. But he has to follow that up by investing in the international market and on the talent evaluation, because he's pretty much painted the team into a corner. Right now, the only way to improve the team, given limited tradeable assets and no legitimate talent on the farm, is fork over the money for free agents.

 

 

 

Exactly.  Agreed 100%.