Weaver is not an ace anymore

[Chuck]

he's not an ace with his 86 mph fastball. You're delusional if you think he is

LOL that the requirement for being an ace is throwing a certain velocity.

Results is what makes a pitcher an ace or not.

Dumb post.

[Angelsjunky]

CaliAngel, the problem is that August 14 was not a "fluke" - or at least its a fluke that happened two years in a row. Last year he had not one but two similarly terrible starts (May 13 and August 17) and it might just be that Jered is prone to have a terrible start every once in a while. If its only once or twice a year I can live with that.

 

As for whether or not Jered is an "ace," I'm probably repeating myself but that depends upon what we mean by "ace." If we define an ace as "someone as good as Clayton Kershaw" then no, Jered is not an ace - but then he never was, nor is almost anyone else in baseball.

 

If we define an ace as "a #1-2 starter who has an outside chance at Cy Young contention every few years" then Weaver fits the bill. I don't think he's one of the ten or so best starters in baseball anymore, but he's probably one of the twenty best and would be the best or second best starter on most major league teams.

[Bruce Nye]

AJ, can you list the ten or so better pitchers?  Be careful if you list Verlander and Felix - they are having up and down years.  What was Greg Maddox' average velocity?  Was he an ace?

[NrM]

This thread and the OP is a joke.

 

Weave hits a bump in the rode for a game or 2 and poozy jumps in to get punches in on a "Weaver is not an ace" thread. Absolute BS.

 

Skip that August 14th fluke, and Jared has allowed 38 earned runs this season in 19 appearances. That's 2 runs per game average.

 

If that's not an ace, I'm not sure what is.

 

Way to try to throw water on one of the only fires left on the team poozy, a guy that goes out there and give 110% every time he takes the mound. Truly not sure what kind of fan you think you are.

dude calls me a joke and not a real fan. I tell him to **** off and my post gets deleted.. makes perfect sense...

 

I didn't know these homers would erupt over me thinking he's a very solid pitcher, just not great(as his numbers have shown)

Edited September 3, 2013 by Poozy

[LBHalos17]

I'm a Weaver fan, but I never really considered him an Ace.  He can put-up Ace-like numbers when he's throwing well (meaning hitting 92, with a 20 mph difference in his change up/curve).  Most of the time, I'm surprised these Major Leaguers aren't teeing-off on him.

 

He continues to be successful, because he changes speed and keeps hitters off-balance.  I thought he was definitely the Angels Ace last season, and was a legitimate Cy Young candidate.

[mtangelsfan]

What if he is successful without hitting 92?

 

What does that have to do with anything?  Is he our best pitcher?  Yes.  Is he one of the ten best starters in the league?

Yes.

 

That is an ace.  

[NrM]

What if he is successful without hitting 92?

 

What does that have to do with anything?  Is he our best pitcher?  Yes.  Is he one of the ten best starters in the league?

Yes.

 

That is an ace.  

I really don't think he's close to a top 10 pitcher and I doubt you'll find many non angels fans who disagree

Edited September 3, 2013 by Poozy

[mtangelsfan]

In the AL?

 

I disagree.

[NrM]

Well we'll have to wait and see next year. I think he'll be a very solid pitcher, but not quit a number 1 type guy on a contender. 

[Catching Trout]

Was he an ace when he had that scoreless streak going? He is easily a top 5-10 pitcher in baseball. Dont forget he won 20 games last year and he could have possibly done the same thing this year had he not gotten injured in the beggining of the season.

[SoWhat]

I think Weaver right now is a top 10 pitcher. I just don't feel comfortable in counting on him being the same pitcher going forward. His velocity keeps dropping every year, sooner or later he won't be able to get by at 85 MPH

[CaliAngel]

dude calls me a joke and not a real fan. I tell him to **** off and my post gets deleted.. makes perfect sense...

 

I didn't know these homers....

 

 

Yeah, it doesn't make sense that we don't take kindly to people who resort to "**** off" in an otherwise civilized conversation. Jeez.

 

If you've watched Jered any length of time during his 6+ years with the Angels, his velocity has never IMO been his strong point. He's able to adapt to situations and make pitches when it counts. He's not going to overpower guys, but he works to their weaknesses and will find ways to get them out. Big game on the line, Jereds probably the only guy on this team for the past 6+ years I'd hand the ball to.

 

 

Well we'll have to wait and see next year. I think he'll be a very solid pitcher, but not quit a number 1 type guy on a contender. 

 

Not even really sure what this means. He's a solid pitcher--but not a top ten--and not a number 1 type guy on a contender...it all comes off like you just don't like the guy.

 

Give credit where credit is due. Weaver has killed it for this team over the course of his career and is no doubt this teams ace.

 

Would he be an ace on a playoff contending team? I think sure as hell he'd try to be. He rises to the occasion and feeds off the success and gets riled when he makes mistakes and put it all out there every single time you hand him the ball. And he'd get pissed when the manager comes out to take it away from him because he wants to keep going. If you've been paying any attention over Jereds career you'd know that's just the way he is. And that's why I think if you actually listen to what people say on these boards, he's one of 2 people on the team that people consistently say they're excited to watch play baseball on this otherwise pathetic team. The other guy is Trout.

 

And if people consistently say Weaver is similar to Trout when it comes to being exciting to watch even though you only see Jered every 4-5 games, that really says something about the type of ballplayer and contender Jered is. And in my books starting pitchers that have those kinds of effects not only on the team but the fans deserves to be called an ace.

Edited September 3, 2013 by CaliAngel

[YouthofToday]

Weaver is one of the best pitchers in Angels history. He is definitely a front of the rotation guy. I don't understand the anger provoked in some to declare he is not a top 10 starter in baseball.

Guys definitely considered aces:

Kershaw, Harvey (yes, even w/ TJ surgery likely), Jose Fernandez, King Felix, Scherzer, Darvish, Verlander, Wainwright.

Weaver is somewhere in the 15-30 range.

[Jay]

"Bell cow"

[Blarg]

In terms of ERA Weaver is 13th in the AL, tied with David Price. For WHIP he is 7th, tied with Felix Hernandez. He is 8th in batting average against.

[nate]

In terms of ERA Weaver is 13th in the AL, tied with David Price. For WHIP he is 7th, tied with Felix Hernandez. He is 8th in batting average against.

 

13th and 7th isn't the same as 1st.  He clearly isn't an ace anymore.

[Glen]

My argument is correct and the only one that matters!

[JB Abell]

CaliAngel, the problem is that August 14 was not a "fluke" - or at least its a fluke that happened two years in a row. Last year he had not one but two similarly terrible starts (May 13 and August 17) and it might just be that Jered is prone to have a terrible start every once in a while. If its only once or twice a year I can live with that.

As for whether or not Jered is an "ace," I'm probably repeating myself but that depends upon what we mean by "ace." If we define an ace as "someone as good as Clayton Kershaw" then no, Jered is not an ace - but then he never was, nor is almost anyone else in baseball.

If we define an ace as "a #1-2 starter who has an outside chance at Cy Young contention every few years" then Weaver fits the bill. I don't think he's one of the ten or so best starters in baseball anymore, but he's probably one of the twenty best and would be the best or second best starter on most major league teams.

If we define an ace as "someone as good as Kershaw", then Kershaw is the only ace in baseball. Nobody is as good as Kershaw, especially this year.

Weaver has been one of the top 5 most dominant pitchers the past 3 years, but has "struggled" a bit this year even though he is still posting good numbers overall. Not to mention he is in the top 10 amongst active pitchers in just about every category for career numbers including ERA, BAA, WHIP, win/loss %.

Felix Hernandez had 5 starts last year where he gave up 4 earned runs, 3 where he gave up 5 ER, 2 where he gave up 6 ER, and 2 where he gave up 7 ER. That's 12/32 times he gave up 4 or more runs. In the past 4 games he's had a game he gave up 8 and a game he gave up 5, while his other two starts were pretty solid, much like weaver over his last 4.

Yet Felix Hernandez is unanimously considered an ace, but weaver is not. OK

[Bruce Nye]

I'm still waiting to see the top ten AL starting pitchers better than Weaver.

[Catching Trout]

If we define an ace as "someone as good as Kershaw", then Kershaw is the only ace in baseball. Nobody is as good as Kershaw, especially this year.

Weaver has been one of the top 5 most dominant pitchers the past 3 years, but has "struggled" a bit this year even though he is still posting good numbers overall. Not to mention he is in the top 10 amongst active pitchers in just about every category for career numbers including ERA, BAA, WHIP, win/loss %.

Felix Hernandez had 5 starts last year where he gave up 4 earned runs, 3 where he gave up 5 ER, 2 where he gave up 6 ER, and 2 where he gave up 7 ER. That's 12/32 times he gave up 4 or more runs. In the past 4 games he's had a game he gave up 8 and a game he gave up 5, while his other two starts were pretty solid, much like weaver over his last 4.

Yet Felix Hernandez is unanimously considered an ace, but weaver is not. OK

Apparently 2 bad starts doesnt make you an ace anymore. Weaver is a top 5-10 pitcher

[FireThemAll]

I laugh at people who call him a top 5 pitcher. You guys think he's better than Kershaw, Harvey, Fernandez, Felix, Price, and Scherzer?? No way. Weaver isn't capable of handling the kind of work load that those pitchers take on. Those guys go 8 innings basically every time out. Weaver is lucky to get into the 7th. I'd say Weaver is a top 15 pitcher. Still a #1 on a lot of teams.

[nate]

I'm still waiting to see the top ten AL starting pitchers better than Weaver.

 

Blanton, Hanson, Williams, Porcello, Hellickson, Demptser, Hughes, Milone, Saunders and Carmona/Hernandez

[Chuck]

I'm still waiting to see the top ten AL starting pitchers better than Weaver.

 

Weaver is easily a top 10 pitcher in the AL. If anyone thinks otherwise they need a glass belly button to see where they're going. 

[tdawg87]

Weaver is a top 10 in the AL for sure. I don't think there can truly be a debate about that. Top 10 in baseball? That's a different story.

[JB Abell]

I laugh at people who call him a top 5 pitcher. You guys think he's better than Kershaw, Harvey, Fernandez, Felix, Price, and Scherzer?? No way. Weaver isn't capable of handling the kind of work load that those pitchers take on. Those guys go 8 innings basically every time out. Weaver is lucky to get into the 7th. I'd say Weaver is a top 15 pitcher. Still a #1 on a lot of teams.

I just laugh at you. Harvey and Fernandez havn't even posted a full season yet so that is ridiculous to even include them in the conversation. Scherzer has never posted an ERA below 3 (career 3.7, putting him at 22 among active starters). And Weaver has thrown more innings then Scherzer every season except for last season by 2 or 3 innings. And he is right around the same number of innings pitched as Price. Felix Hernandez is the only one you named who averages more innings then Weaver.

Have you watched weaver before this year? When he consistently went into the 8th and 9th innings. What someone has done for one season doesn't qualify or disqualify them from being an ace.