Ohtani and cap space.

[Richbert88]

I may be wrong but the sites I've looked at make it seem I am correct. The Angels can resign Ohtani right now to 50m a year and the top 26, the roster, wouldn't pass the 232m cap much less go over 200m.

He should be made the offer immediately IMO.

[Revad]

1 minute ago, Richbert88 said:

I may be wrong but the sites I've looked at make it seem I am correct. The Angels can resign Ohtani right now to 50m a year and the top 26, the roster, wouldn't pass the 232m cap much less go over 200m.

He should be made the offer immediately IMO.

I hope they do sign him, but I also hope Artie approves a budget of $260m.  I imagine they’d try to backload the contract but the luxury tax calculation is what really counts.

[Richbert88]

2 minutes ago, Revad said:

I hope they do sign him, but I also hope Artie approves a budget of $260m.  I imagine they’d try to backload the contract but the luxury tax calculation is what really counts.

Top 26 has them at about 172m. Ohtani is at 30m now. Add 20m to that now. Team goes to 192ish. Cap is 232m. Not sure they need to go to 260.

 

[Revad]

This is from Cot’s Baseball Contracts, which appears to be part of Baseball Prospectus.  It shows about $17m 2023 cap space (not sure how current).  Of course money will be coming off next year so you could give Ohtani $50m and stay under the cap, but could you stay under the cap and be competitive?

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FsmsUpbOz2RsyxdPSM1oXHHuIE33NhIMEN-7bD0J9mg

https://legacy.baseballprospectus.com/compensation/cots/al-west/los-angeles-angels/

 

[Angels 1961]

They can offer him 60 mill and maybe they have offered 50 already. Nobody knows and the biggest factor is what does Ohtani want. I feel he just does not want to DH on days he not on the mound. I think he would really like to play in OF once a week. I know I will take a lot of crap about this. All this upcoming season every place Angel's play the question will come up about where will Ohtani play in 2024.

[Pancake Bear]

20 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

They can offer him 60 mill and maybe they have offered 50 already. Nobody knows and the biggest factor is what does Ohtani want. I feel he just does not want to DH on days he not on the mound. I think he would really like to play in OF once a week. I know I will take a lot of crap about this. All this upcoming season every place Angel's play the question will come up about where will Ohtani play in 2024.

Yes, Ohtani is going to hold out for a team that lets him play outfield once a week.

[BTH]

3 hours ago, Richbert88 said:

I may be wrong but the sites I've looked at make it seem I am correct. The Angels can resign Ohtani right now to 50m a year and the top 26, the roster, wouldn't pass the 232m cap much less go over 200m.

He should be made the offer immediately IMO.

Not sure where you’re getting your numbers, but Roster Resource has the Angels luxury tax payroll at $220M.

Regardless, if they Ohtani to an extension, they can choose to have the extension not factor into the 2023 luxury tax payroll.

So if they signed him to a 10/$500M deal, it could start in 2024 and his $30M 2023 AAV could remain the same.

[TempeAngel]

I am no expert but Spotrac seems reliable to me.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/los-angeles-angels/payroll/

 

[BTH]

7 minutes ago, TempeAngel said:

I am no expert but Spotrac seems reliable to me.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/los-angeles-angels/payroll/

 

It’s not because it doesn’t include the salaries for Urshela, Renfroe, and Rengifo.

Other sites use a projection for those 3.

Edited February 11, 2023 by Trendon

[TempeAngel]

35 minutes ago, Trendon said:

It’s not because it doesn’t include the salaries for Urshela, Renfroe, and Rengifo.

Other sites use a projection for those 3.

I thought they are projected in the $24,024,213 listed as "Est. Arbitration Salaries".

If not, then what is it?

[Docwaukee]

https://www.fangraphs.com/roster-resource/payroll/angels

I've found this one to generally be the most accurate and up to date.  

[Torridd]

3 hours ago, Pancake Bear said:

Yes, Ohtani is going to hold out for a team that lets him play outfield once a week.

I guess I live under a rock. I never heard that he wanted to play the OF. Do you guys have a link? Moreover, I'd be surprised that the Angels wouldn't let him.

[BTH]

31 minutes ago, TempeAngel said:

I thought they are projected in the $24,024,213 listed as "Est. Arbitration Salaries".

If not, then what is it?

Ok, you’re right they do.

But with that, the estimated luxury tax payroll is $211M.

And that doesn’t include the salaries for 0-3 players, which Roster Resource estimates to be around $10M.

[BTH]

35 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

https://www.fangraphs.com/roster-resource/payroll/angels

I've found this one to generally be the most accurate and up to date.  

Yep.

But even that isn’t perfect.

They had the Angels final 2022 payroll as $180.4M but the official payroll that the team reported to MLB, per the AP, was actually $174.7M.

Edited February 11, 2023 by Trendon

[Revad]

It’s all estimated until the year is over, more like a running total.  When AO asked (in another thread) if they’re waiting for the exact outcome of the arbitration cases it made sense to me.  It’s complicated and cost certainty is attractive.

Edited February 11, 2023 by Revad

[AngelsLakersFan]

If they give him $50 mil a year they wont be competitive until after the contract expires

[Revad]

1 minute ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

If they give him $50 mil a year they wont be competitive until after the contract expires

Or Artie decides to spend, or sell…

[BTH]

7 minutes ago, Revad said:

It’s all estimated until the year is over, more like a running total.  When AO asked (in another thread) if they’re waiting for the exact outcome of the arbitration cases it made sense to me.  It’s complicated and cost certainty is attractive.

I’m not sure if they’re really waiting for that.

I think the bigger thing is that the lefty reliever market, which they’re likely shopping in, is clogged.

One one signs, I think that market will start moving. Chafin, Moore, Britton, Smith, and Hand are still out there.

[BTH]

5 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

If they give him $50 mil a year they wont be competitive until after the contract expires

If they don’t give him $50 mil a year, will they be competitive?

I understand the concern with committing $50M on top of the Angels current commitments, but they’d then need to figure out how to replace an 8-9 WAR player.

[Pancake Bear]

2 hours ago, Trendon said:

If they don’t give him $50 mil a year, will they be competitive?

I understand the concern with committing $50M on top of the Angels current commitments, but they’d then need to figure out how to replace an 8-9 WAR player.

They're already committing $30, so it isn't adding a total of $50. Additionally, we don't know what the contract will look like, but I'd be surprised if it ends up being quite that high an aav when all is said and done. 

[Pancake Bear]

3 hours ago, Torridd said:

I guess I live under a rock. I never heard that he wanted to play the OF. Do you guys have a link? Moreover, I'd be surprised that the Angels wouldn't let him.

Minasian mentioned in passing that Ohtani floated the idea of playing outfield now and then, but it's not happening. Dude already has enough he's doing without adding more on top of it. 

[AngelsLakersFan]

2 hours ago, Trendon said:

If they don’t give him $50 mil a year, will they be competitive?

I understand the concern with committing $50M on top of the Angels current commitments, but they’d then need to figure out how to replace an 8-9 WAR player.

They were marginally competitive with him at $5 million… They will be marginally competitive with him at $30 million, hopefully. At $50 mil… 

[BTH]

9 hours ago, Pancake Bear said:

They're already committing $30, so it isn't adding a total of $50. Additionally, we don't know what the contract will look like, but I'd be surprised if it ends up being quite that high an aav when all is said and done. 

I’m not the one saying that a $50M contract prevents them from being competitive.

I was asking the person whose post I quoted how they’d be competitive without Ohtani. 

[BTH]

9 hours ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

They were marginally competitive with him at $5 million… They will be marginally competitive with him at $30 million, hopefully. At $50 mil… 

They’re also spending $31M more on payroll with him at $30M than they were with him at $5M.

You’d figure that if they sign Ohtani for $50M per year, they’d spend more than they currently are.

[AngelsLakersFan]

19 minutes ago, Trendon said:

You’d figure that if they sign Ohtani for $50M per year, they’d spend more than they currently are.

Why?

We have been saying that for over a decade now and it's never once been true.