Fangraphs picks Angels and Mariners

[Troll Daddy]

Angels and Mariners will tie for second in the AL West

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/214280074/most-exciting-mlb-division-races-for-2017/

[tdawg87]

Ewww stats are icky poo-poo!

[JustATroutFan]

Don't see the Angels finishing 3rd. Seattle still has better pitching to me because of King Felix and Iwakuma are better than Richards and Shoemaker. They also have a nice #3 starter in Paxton, something I don't see the Angels having. Offense won't be the problem for the Angels, it's their pitching. I guess it's still possible that the Angels prove doubters wrong like in 2014 but that's only if both Richards and Shoemaker puts up ERA's in the 3.00-3.50 range or something like that and have another pitcher coming out of nowhere to put up good numbers.

[gurn67]

If this team gets 90+ starts combined from Richards, Shoe & Skaggs and they get the Nolasco we saw last year, and not the one the Twins saw, this is a playoff team. Major injuries to any of those four and not getting a couple of more arms in the bullpen, they just don't have the pitching.

[Troll Daddy]

53 minutes ago, JustATroutFan said:

Don't see the Angels finishing 3rd. Seattle still has better pitching to me because of King Felix and Iwakuma are better than Richards and Shoemaker. They also have a nice #3 starter in Paxton, something I don't see the Angels having. Offense won't be the problem for the Angels, it's their pitching. I guess it's still possible that the Angels prove doubters wrong like in 2014 but that's only if both Richards and Shoemaker puts up ERA's in the 3.00-3.50 range or something like that and have another pitcher coming out of nowhere to put up good numbers.

You haven't got the memo from here that King Felix is toast?

[Troll Daddy]

I'm not a huge believer in the Astros just yet ... I think all the teams in the West have issues to work out still. I like the Angels chances competing in the West.

One word: Dogfight

[ettin]

2 hours ago, Troll Daddy said:

I'm not a huge believer in the Astros just yet ... I think all the teams in the West have issues to work out still. I like the Angels chances competing in the West.

One word: Dogfight

The Astros weakness still is their rotation. However if they pull off a Jose Quintana trade or something similar prior to starting the season they will be in pretty good shape overall.

[Chuck]

Even Mariners fans up here think Felix is toast.

[totdprods]

1 hour ago, ettin said:

The Astros weakness still is their rotation. However if they pull off a Jose Quintana trade or something similar prior to starting the season they will be in pretty good shape overall.

I bet they don't. Luhnow doesn't have the balls. The Astros were my NL team so I've watched them and still kept an eye on them more than most teams, and I'm not convinced. I think they're going to go down as a squandered team, sort of like the Expos when they had Pedro, Walker, Guerrero, etc but it never came together. 

I actually think if any team was to run away with the division this year, it'll be the Mariners. They're on thin ice, but it everything clicks they're going to be very good. But they could unravel just as quickly too.

[Brent Maguire]

5 hours ago, JustATroutFan said:

Don't see the Angels finishing 3rd. Seattle still has better pitching to me because of King Felix and Iwakuma are better than Richards and Shoemaker. They also have a nice #3 starter in Paxton, something I don't see the Angels having. Offense won't be the problem for the Angels, it's their pitching. I guess it's still possible that the Angels prove doubters wrong like in 2014 but that's only if both Richards and Shoemaker puts up ERA's in the 3.00-3.50 range or something like that and have another pitcher coming out of nowhere to put up good numbers.

Felix and Kuma might be safer bets to give more innings next year but I'd gladly take Richards and Shoemaker over those 2 if they're both healthy. Felix has trended downward for 3 straight years now along with seeing his velo drop. Iwakuma is a solid mid rotation dude still but Shoemaker outperformed him last year and is obviously much younger. Health is obviously an issue but a healthy Richards/Shoemaker is better in 2017.

I would agree that Seattle is better on paper as of now though. Not by much but better. Better offense and bullpen and comparable rotations. Angels will probably run the bases better and play better defense. Seattle's issue, much like the Angels, is they're still awfully top heavy and reliant on particular guys. If Seager/Cano are hurt for an extended period of time, they'll be in a heap of trouble. I think whatever team is healthier will finish higher. Angels need a lot of good luck in the health department to be a playoff contender in 2017. 

[nikkachez]

12 hours ago, JustATroutFan said:

Don't see the Angels finishing 3rd. Seattle still has better pitching to me because of King Felix and Iwakuma are better than Richards and Shoemaker. They also have a nice #3 starter in Paxton, something I don't see the Angels having. Offense won't be the problem for the Angels, it's their pitching. I guess it's still possible that the Angels prove doubters wrong like in 2014 but that's only if both Richards and Shoemaker puts up ERA's in the 3.00-3.50 range or something like that and have another pitcher coming out of nowhere to put up good numbers.

 

Ask Seattle fans how  "secure" they feel about Felix and Iwakuma, health provided, Garrett and Skaggs are currently better. Felix has a ton of mileage on his arm. 

[WeatherWonk]

Has anyone come back from a pure plasma treatment that Richards got and pitched like they were before? Richards threw hard and threw pitches that were hard on the arm. And he still hasn't thrown one pitch that matters since the treatment.

Even a declining Felix is a better bet than Richards. All we know is that his MRIs "look" fine.

[Ohtaniland]

42 minutes ago, WeatherWonk said:

Has anyone come back from a pure plasma treatment that Richards got and pitched like they were before? Richards threw hard and threw pitches that were hard on the arm. And he still hasn't thrown one pitch that matters since the treatment.

Even a declining Felix is a better bet than Richards. All we know is that his MRIs "look" fine.

At this point we have no idea what will happen with Richards or Skaggs. It's very possible that we won't get 100% out of either of them because of health or they will probably both be put on pitch counts. 

[Angel Oracle]

Tanaka looked good in 2016, granted 2015 not so much.

The Astros are an enigma.   They have the talent to acquire a much needed ace pitcher and/or closer, but haven't.

Thus, while 2015 and 2016 were >>>>>>>>> the years before, they haven't taken that next step yet.

In fact, take away their record against the Halos in 2016, and they would be barely over .500.   And the Halos handed them their lunch (with two ridiculous comebacks against a bad bullpen) in that September series in Houston.

[Angels#1Fan]

I think Garrett Richards is a huge question mark. If he returns to form the Angels might be ok, but I just don't see them making the play-offs though I'd be delighted if they did of course. The overall pitching is just too thin and if just a couple of minor things go wrong they'll be in trouble. Worst case would be if Richards has a set back and can't make it to the AS break or earlier..what then? How many innings Richards is able to go will have a big impact on the Angels success this year. I think it's a toss up that he is able make it out of spring training.

Skaggs has a lot to prove imo in terms of his ability to pitch enough innings.

Shoemaker I think will be mentally prepared after he gets his feet wet again, but will the dominate Shoe show up?

Nolasco will likely be up and down throughout the season.

I don't even want to get into the bullpen. 

I think the offense will be ok but the big caveat is how the Angels get out of the gate. If they get off to their usual bad start I don't think they have enough to overcome it.

In the end for the Angels to make a run this year they'll need the breaks to go their way. If a couple of starters can't answer the bell it'll be another long season.