This team reflects their leader

[robblin17]

solid argument

 

Pot calling the kettle black. 

[tennischmp]

solid argument

BS

[Lifetime]

Pot calling the kettle black.

not really

[robblin17]

not really

Hey! You got the last word! Or did I?

[Stradling]

I pretty much agree with LT in this thread.

Although I lean slightly more to the "fire Scioscia" side, just because I feel it is time for a change. Not because I feel it is entirely his fault this team is a complete disaster.

Same here.

[tomsred]

There are a lot of interesting points in this thread, but the most interesting question to me is "why do we start seasons so slowly?"  I would say it's because of the type of player personnel we keep injecting into the organization, mainly highly paid free agents from other organizations who have to adjust to system employed by the manager and coaches, and learn to be effective with existing personnel from with our own farm system.  I think it takes far longer to assimilate these type of players than we all think it should.  Look at Toronto, they too were lauded for added some highly regarded talent this off season, and they too are off to a very slow start.  Pumping free agents into an organization year after year of the sort that we have signed (Pujols, Hamilton) is maybe too much of a change to be effective until they learn to play effectively together for possibly many months.  Add to this the personal expectations they carry with them usually results in under performance to their mean to start their run with the Angels.  Autry had this problem, so does Moreno, and possibly both situations could have been avoided had a completely different philosophy been employed where we sunk much higher sums into player development from within.

 

With regard to our pitching issues this year, I believe the problem started as early as two years ago when we traded for pitchers in their prime (example Haren) and gave away promising young pitchers from inside our own organization like Corbin and Skaggs.  The farm system was depleted for immediate possible success, that did not materialize to the extent we all hoped for.  When you lose young pitching from within, then lose free agent pitchers, or trade them to fill position holes, then you are forced to back fill pitching with marginally successful types with higher risk like Blanton, or a host of marginally effective relievers.  And when those marginally effective pitchers fail there is no one in sight to give up any hope of picking up the slack.  Now we are looking at an overhaul, but no one within the organization wants to jump into that wagon, at least not yet.

 

There is no easy fix for the mess we have right now.  I do believe if we enter into the "firing zone" we should make sure we cut deep enough to force some major changes in team philosophies and strategy.  Singling out one or two individuals won't accomplish much as far as I am concerned.  The organization needs to find a way to get strategically out front of the other teams in our league.  I'm rambling, so I will shut up now.

[mp170.6]

There are a lot of interesting points in this thread, but the most interesting question to me is "why do we start seasons so slowly?"  I would say it's because of the type of player personnel we keep injecting into the organization, mainly highly paid free agents from other organizations who have to adjust to system employed by the manager and coaches, and learn to be effective with existing personnel from with our own farm system.  I think it takes far longer to assimilate these type of players than we all think it should.  Look at Toronto, they too were lauded for added some highly regarded talent this off season, and they too are off to a very slow start.  Pumping free agents into an organization year after year of the sort that we have signed (Pujols, Hamilton) is maybe too much of a change to be effective until they learn to play effectively together for possibly many months.  Add to this the personal expectations they carry with them usually results in under performance to their mean to start their run with the Angels.  Autry had this problem, so does Moreno, and possibly both situations could have been avoided had a completely different philosophy been employed where we sunk much higher sums into player development from within.

 

Aside from what I believe are Scioscia's many incompetencies, there's another possibility here that might apply to the team as it does fans. 

 

Scioscia is boring.  He doesn't have anything new to say.  He is stubborn to a fault.  He is predictable to a fault.  He is stoic and emotionless.  There's no passion.  It's almost like a robot is leading the team. 

 

I don't know about you but coming to work everyday subjected to a boss like that would not bring out the best in me.  I would tune him out because he quite literally would put me to sleep if I didn't.  These guys may need a manager who is more animated and "human" to capture their attention. 

[Homebrewer]

There are a lot of interesting points in this thread, but the most interesting question to me is "why do we start seasons so slowly?"  I would say it's because of the type of player personnel we keep injecting into the organization, mainly highly paid free agents from other organizations who have to adjust to system employed by the manager and coaches, and learn to be effective with existing personnel from with our own farm system.  I think it takes far longer to assimilate these type of players than we all think it should.  Look at Toronto, they too were lauded for added some highly regarded talent this off season, and they too are off to a very slow start.  Pumping free agents into an organization year after year of the sort that we have signed (Pujols, Hamilton) is maybe too much of a change to be effective until they learn to play effectively together for possibly many months.  Add to this the personal expectations they carry with them usually results in under performance to their mean to start their run with the Angels.  Autry had this problem, so does Moreno, and possibly both situations could have been avoided had a completely different philosophy been employed where we sunk much higher sums into player development from within.

 

With regard to our pitching issues this year, I believe the problem started as early as two years ago when we traded for pitchers in their prime (example Haren) and gave away promising young pitchers from inside our own organization like Corbin and Skaggs.  The farm system was depleted for immediate possible success, that did not materialize to the extent we all hoped for.  When you lose young pitching from within, then lose free agent pitchers, or trade them to fill position holes, then you are forced to back fill pitching with marginally successful types with higher risk like Blanton, or a host of marginally effective relievers.  And when those marginally effective pitchers fail there is no one in sight to give up any hope of picking up the slack.  Now we are looking at an overhaul, but no one within the organization wants to jump into that wagon, at least not yet.

 

There is no easy fix for the mess we have right now.  I do believe if we enter into the "firing zone" we should make sure we cut deep enough to force some major changes in team philosophies and strategy.  Singling out one or two individuals won't accomplish much as far as I am concerned.  The organization needs to find a way to get strategically out front of the other teams in our league.  I'm rambling, so I will shut up now.

 

 

"I do believe if we enter into the "firing zone" we should make sure we cut deep enough to force some major changes in team philosophies and strategy.  Singling out one or two individuals won't accomplish much as far as I am concerned."

 

You're right. That is why it needed to be done in this past offseason, A lot of us have been screaming this. You can't establish a new and lasting philosophy during a season...but you can show you mean business by firing the manager today, and letting the pieces fall together between now and October. This year is over, as far as this team competing. Arte hamstrung Dipoto when he would have dumped Scioscia 2 years ago, and Arte is going to pay a big price for his stupidity.

Arte has been forced to cut a lot of losses in his tenure as an owner, and this is another bad contract he will be forced to eat.

There is no way around it, so why put it off.

Hire/promote an interim manager and start interviewing.

At least the season will mean something.

The alternative is to stand pat, do nothing, and pretend things are fine.

That has worked well the past few years, right?