Will we finish above .500 this year?

[notherhalo]

2 hours ago, SoCalDucksFan said:

LOL!!!

It's light years away

[Jason]

The results are the same every single season

[notherhalo]

'No' option is up 9 more votes in the last 24 hours, from its starting position of 1 vote

[AngelsFanSince86]

Not looking good. Nothing to do, but to be hopeful at this point.

However, it's looking like they blew their chance to think about the future for once. Instead of getting at least 2 top prospects they got rid of one in addition to several of their own top guys. 

If they don't re sign Ohtani, the franchise will be set back years. Doesn't mean they won't be able to contend. They have some good young talent still. But having that good young talent, and still having 3+ top ranked guys in their system would potentially mean the start of a large window of contention. 

Instead, the outlook is pretty similar to what it's been for the last 8+years. Enough talent to look decent when healthy, but not enough depth in the farm (due to a weak farm) to sustain a winning roster throughout the season.

Edited August 6, 2023 by AngelsFanSince86

[fan_since79]

If the Angels do go on a major collapse here and finish far out of a playoff spot, the good result might be that Arte finally sells the team. That is assuming Ohtani also moves on to bigger and better things. New owner has an extra $500 million to work with without Ohtani.

Just start over with an owner who wants to win. The profits will always be there. Build the farm, make good player moves, be patient, and a few years down the line we're back in business.

[Stradling]

9 minutes ago, fan_since79 said:

If the Angels do go on a major collapse here and finish far out of a playoff spot, the good result might be that Arte finally sells the team. That is assuming Ohtani also moves on to bigger and better things. New owner has an extra $500 million to work with without Ohtani.

Just start over with an owner who wants to win. The profits will always be there. Build the farm, make good player moves, be patient, and a few years down the line we're back in business.

How will he have an extra $500 million to work with?  It’s not like if you don’t sign him the league or Arte gives you $500 million. 

[fan_since79]

4 minutes ago, Stradling said:

How will he have an extra $500 million to work with?  It’s not like if you don’t sign him the league or Arte gives you $500 million. 

We won't be stuck with paying Ohtani that money if he goes elsewhere. That's all I meant. Phrase it as you will.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, fan_since79 said:

We won't be stuck with paying Ohtani that money if he goes elsewhere. That's all I meant. Phrase it as you will.

I kind of agree. That contract whether it’s the Angels or someone else will be an overpay in a few years 

[LaPalma]

Will Ohtani really be an overpay?  The guy works his tail off and isn’t yet 30.  He’s not a stocky guy like Trout and I can see him holding up and playing strong into his late 30’s.  Total different work ethic.  I lived and worked in Japan for three years and the determination and drive is unmatched.  I say sign him.

[Stradling]

10 minutes ago, LaPalma said:

Will Ohtani really be an overpay?  The guy works his tail off and isn’t yet 30.  He’s not a stocky guy like Trout and I can see him holding up and playing strong into his late 30’s.  Total different work ethic.  I lived and worked in Japan for three years and the determination and drive is unmatched.  I say sign him.

Yes he will by year 4 or so, and I’m one of the few who don’t think he’s getting $600-700 million, wouldn’t shock me if he doesn’t get more than $550 million.   

[LaPalma]

4 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Yes he will by year 3 or so, and I’m one of the few who don’t think he’s getting $600-700 million, wouldn’t shock me if he doesn’t get more than $550 million.   

Eesh he will only be 32!  Big guys break down but he could easily be the next Ichiro.  I see no signs he’s not going to hold up.

But I agree the 700 million contract speculation is just writers trying to get clicks.  At some point he can’t go at this pace both hitting and pitching, and that will be priced in.  This team is in desperate need of a leader and he can be it.  Trout will never fill that role even though he should given what he’s paid.

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, LaPalma said:

Eesh he will only be 32!  Big guys break down but he could easily be the next Ichiro.  I see no signs he’s not going to hold up.

But I agree the 700 million contract speculation is just writers trying to get clicks.  At some point he can’t go at this pace both hitting and pitching, and that will be priced in.  This team is in desperate need of a leader and he can be it.  Trout will never fill that role even though he should given what he’s paid.

It depends on what you consider “a leader”. Not every player has that vocal leadership presence. And if Shohei can be that player then why isn’t he being that player?  The reason it’ll be an overpay at 32 in my opinion is he’s asked to do both. If he’s only capable of hitting no one is worth $45-50 million. Even this year on the mound, he’s been good but not great. I’d love to re-sign him but there’s absolute risk. 

[SoCalDucksFan]

15 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Yes he will by year 4 or so, and I’m one of the few who don’t think he’s getting $600-700 million, wouldn’t shock me if he doesn’t get more than $550 million.   

The difference between $600 Million and $550 Million is less than 10%, so it hardly matters.  He's gonna get a boatload of dough.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, SoCalDucksFan said:

The difference between $600 Million and $550 Million is less than 10%, so it hardly matters.  He's gonna get a boatload of dough.

It’s going to be like the contracts from last year where the total dollars is what matters and not the length of the deal. So sure it could be $550-600 million. But it’s going to be 14 years or some shit like that. 

[SoCalDucksFan]

When he signs elsewhere, the Angels organization and the fans will certainly use that theory as justification and for solace.

"Yeah, he was great and all, but he's being overpaid, and in a few years, the contract will look like an unwise move by the team that signed him for that much."

Of course, they wouldn't be saying that if he signs in Anaheim for $550 Million, they'd be talking about how happy they are that he's going to be here for the next 10 years.

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, SoCalDucksFan said:

When he signs elsewhere, the Angels organization and the fans will certainly use that theory as justification and for solace.

"Yeah, he was great and all, but he's being overpaid, and in a few years, the contract will look like an unwise move by the team that signed him for that much."

Of course, they wouldn't be saying that if he signs in Anaheim for $550 Million, they'd be talking about how happy they are that he's going to be here for the next 10 years.

Bullshit, on AngelsWin we have all acknowledged the backend of contracts would be bad once they were signed. We did it with Albert we did it with Upton we did it with Trout we did it with Rendon. So yea, bullshit. 

[Stradling]

Also we should be able to be excited to have him for the next ten years and acknowledge it’s going to be a bad contract. 

[Slegnaac]

47 minutes ago, LaPalma said:

Will Ohtani really be an overpay?  The guy works his tail off and isn’t yet 30.  He’s not a stocky guy like Trout and I can see him holding up and playing strong into his late 30’s.  Total different work ethic.  I lived and worked in Japan for three years and the determination and drive is unmatched.  I say sign him.

It just takes one 98 MPH FB slipping out of the pitchers hand  or a 113 MPH hit back up the middle.

 

[HeavenlyHalos]

I really thought they'd be playing meaningful games throughout the month of August, at the very least. Fast forward just one week and it's been an unmitigated disaster. They are barely barely hanging on by a thread but it is likely over. This franchise is such a s**t show.

[UndertheHalo]

2 hours ago, HeavenlyHalos said:

I really thought they'd be playing meaningful games throughout the month of August, at the very least. Fast forward just one week and it's been an unmitigated disaster. They are barely barely hanging on by a thread but it is likely over. This franchise is such a s**t show.

I think it’s hard to be too mad at them this season.  The team is obviously playing hard, the management is trying to put a winner out there. All of that is plain to see.  It’s just been one real tough break after another.  That ground rule double yesterday was such terrible luck.  Sure, they shouldn’t need things like that to go their way.  But it would be nice if once and while they did.  It just feels like they hardly ever do.  Anyway.  Obviously it’s all very disappointing.  But just speaking for myself.  I can’t say I’m mad.  I think they were right to go for it.  However it winds up.  Looking pretty bleak right now. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by UndertheHalo

[HeavenlyHalos]

8 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

I think it’s hard to be too mad at them this season.  The team is obviously playing hard, the management is trying to put a winner out there. All of that is plain to see.  It’s just been one real tough break after another.  That ground rule double yesterday was such terrible luck.  Sure, we shouldn’t need things like that to go their way.  But it would be nice if once and while they did.  It just feels like they hardly ever do.  Anyway.  Obviously it’s all very disappointing.  But just speaking for myself.  I can’t say I’m mad.  I think they were right to go for it.  However it winds up.  Looking pretty bleak right now. 

I agree with all of this but it doesn't lessen the frustration. I have said in other threads that, had they had the amount of injuries as say Toronto, they would likely be competing for the division, and while I stand by that, the pitching inconsistency has been a major issue and the rotation has been healthy outside of Suarez and, now, Canning. 

This season has been one kick to the bollocks after another. We get to 8 games over .500 - 3/4 of the infield gets injured. We get Drury back - Neto hits the IL. Silseth has a few nice starts in a row - Canning to the IL. One hit after another, not to mention the multitude of blows leads despite having a closer with only one Blown Save. Just a bummer that is exacerbated by the fact that Ohtani is a FA. 

[LaPalma]

1 hour ago, Slegnaac said:

It just takes one 98 MPH FB slipping out of the pitchers hand  or a 113 MPH hit back up the middle.

 

You could say this about any player.  Ohtani has proven his toughness and I’d rather have him than another Trout or Rendon.  For the second year in a row his WAR beats those two combined.

[Stradling]

2 minutes ago, LaPalma said:

You could say this about any player.  Ohtani has proven his toughness and I’d rather have him than another Trout or Rendon.  For the second year in a row his WAR beats those two combined.

Yep proven his toughness. He certainly wasn’t pinch hit for because he had cramps in the 9th inning with the game on the line. 

[LaPalma]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

It depends on what you consider “a leader”. Not every player has that vocal leadership presence. And if Shohei can be that player then why isn’t he being that player?  The reason it’ll be an overpay at 32 in my opinion is he’s asked to do both. If he’s only capable of hitting no one is worth $45-50 million. Even this year on the mound, he’s been good but not great. I’d love to re-sign him but there’s absolute risk. 

Trout is in no way shape or form a leader and doesn’t seem to even try.  I was one of the very few who thought we shouldn’t sign him and I was right so far, and it only gets worse.  When you get the biggest contact ever (at the time) you have a responsibility to either A) be extremely competitive and tough and durable B) lead vocally and bring fire to the team or C) be clutch.  He’s none of the above.

 

 At least he’s not Rendon.

[LaPalma]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

Yep proven his toughness. He certainly wasn’t pinch hit for because he had cramps in the 9th inning with the game on the line. 

He’s there game after game which is a lot more than you can say for Trout or Rendon.  When’s the last time they played with any grit or injured?