Taylor Ward

[Docwaukee]

2 minutes ago, floplag said:

I found the highlighted interesting based on many recent conversations about prospects and the kids.
As of right now, thats all we have going into 19, is question marks, and our only answers we seem to be considering, are Ward and his peers. 

they don't have to all be lumped into the same group.  

Ward came out of nowhere after pretty poor to mediocre performances for two years.  There's still a fair amount of noise around whether he's a viable option now and even long term.  

Fletcher is what he is I think.  An excellent defender who puts the ball in play and likely hits for a decent average.  Perfect for a util role long term.  

Rengifo is similar to Ward but younger so his breakout isn't nearly as surprising.  

Cozart and Fletcher mitigate some risk as it applies to giving Rengifo and Ward a shot.  Would I prefer one more player for 2019 that is more of a known quantity?  Yes.  Do I think we're going to get it?  I think there's less than a 25% chance based on our budget and Eppler's comments.  

[T.G.]

Ward must be pretty good... he already has his own hat:

[Docwaukee]

10 minutes ago, greginpsca said:

Don't see 4 or 6 . I think Eppler said those would be filled internally.

that's why they're 4 and 6.  

By value play on a pen arm, i meant a free agent that's more than a league min or waiver guy.  He always going to be grabbing a bunch of those.  

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, True Grich said:

Ward must be pretty good... he already has his own hat:

why would they make a Tennessee Williams golf hat?  

[floplag]

1 minute ago, Dochalo said:

they don't have to all be lumped into the same group.  

Ward came out of nowhere after pretty poor to mediocre performances for two years.  There's still a fair amount of noise around whether he's a viable option now and even long term.  

Fletcher is what he is I think.  An excellent defender who puts the ball in play and likely hits for a decent average.  Perfect for a util role long term.  

Rengifo is similar to Ward but younger so his breakout isn't nearly as surprising.  

Cozart and Fletcher mitigate some risk as it applies to giving Rengifo and Ward a shot.  Would I prefer one more player for 2019 that is more of a known quantity?  Yes.  Do I think we're going to get it?  I think there's less than a 25% chance based on our budget and Eppler's comments.  

I kinda thought Rengifos breakout was more surprising actually as he wasnt highly rated going into this last year i dont recall.  Still isnt actually from the end of year articles i read... if anyone has a better view please link it id love to see it.

There is known good, and just... known.  Im expecting nothing offensively aside from maybe a journeyman catcher and a 4th OF type that can maybe play some 1B, nothing thats going to be exciting or significant and probably on rental type 1-2 years deals, your basic mercenaries. 

Honestly, if thats the plan i would almost prefer they just play the kids and let them develop and see realistically exactly what we have.  Give em the jobs, tell them to go do thier best without pressure, and just be honest with us as fans.  If they are legit trying to win in 19, a couple journeyman vets isnt gonna get it, not in this FA class when the real contenders are getting the tier one guys and were getting the 2s and 3s.   If thats the plan, and i can see merit in it Trout not withstanding, then fine, fill out the rotation with a couple mid tier innings eaters and play ball.   Its not what i want, its not what i think this team should be, and the ramifications of it are at best unnerving... but right now, it is what it is if they dont plan to make a legit run at it .

[Stradling]

They are letting the kids play.  They will sign "journeyman" to play the positions where they don't have MLB ready kids.  You'll see Fletcher get plenty of at bats as will Ward and JMF and Ohtani.  You will see the kids in the pen, Anderson, Middleton, Buttrey and Juarez get plenty of reps.  Barria and Pena will get starts along with Skaggs and Heaney who are 26 and 27 years old.  We might see Rengifo get some time this year as well as possibly Adell later in the year if he is ready.  No real reason to rush them or bring them up to sit on the bench if they aren't ready.  

[HaloNArizona]

Not comfortable with Ward as the primary guy at third.  I have no problems with Cozart or Fletch being the 2bman and util guy.  

Still want to see a guy like Mouse playing third next year.

[Dtwncbad]

33 minutes ago, Stradling said:

They are letting the kids play.  They will sign "journeyman" to play the positions where they don't have MLB ready kids.  You'll see Fletcher get plenty of at bats as will Ward and JMF and Ohtani.  You will see the kids in the pen, Anderson, Middleton, Buttrey and Juarez get plenty of reps.  Barria and Pena will get starts along with Skaggs and Heaney who are 26 and 27 years old.  We might see Rengifo get some time this year as well as possibly Adell later in the year if he is ready.  No real reason to rush them or bring them up to sit on the bench if they aren't ready.  

Except. . . You can do MOST of that and still rationally decide to put something proven and reliable at 3B (or "solve" another questionable position instead) because the team does have enough talent to possibly win.

I may be wrong and that's fine, but Taylor Ward (to me) is not the level of prospect that you should be willing to suffer through bumpy times to get to his potential.  The ceiling is too low.

We are not pro scouts and even they are often wrong.  But we do see what we see as fans.  I see Ward maybe maybe being a "passable" starter in the majors.

If I could improve my chances of contending by putting something better at third, I do it.  I just really really doubt that Taylor Ward is going to be a player I regret not having.

 

 

[Stradling]

1 minute ago, Dtwncbad said:

Except. . . You can do MOST of that and still rationally decide to put something proven and reliable at 3B (or "solve" another questionable position instead) because the team does have enough talent to possibly win.

I may be wrong and that's fine, but Taylor Ward (to me) is not the level of prospect that you should be willing to suffer through bumpy times to get to his potential.  The ceiling is too low.

We are not pro scouts and even they are often wrong.  But we do see what we see as fans.  I see Ward maybe maybe being a "passable" starter in the majors.

If I could improve my chances of contending by putting something better at third, I do it.  I just really really doubt that Taylor Ward is going to be a player I regret not having.

 

 

Ok, so you are in favor of signing Josh Donaldson?  I am.  

[Dtwncbad]

3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Ok, so you are in favor of signing Josh Donaldson?  I am.  

I wasn't before because i typically reject older players but after taking a closer look I would be stoked.

But hopefully like a 2 year deal, if possible.

[Docwaukee]

54 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

Except. . . You can do MOST of that and still rationally decide to put something proven and reliable at 3B (or "solve" another questionable position instead) because the team does have enough talent to possibly win.

I may be wrong and that's fine, but Taylor Ward (to me) is not the level of prospect that you should be willing to suffer through bumpy times to get to his potential.  The ceiling is too low.

We are not pro scouts and even they are often wrong.  But we do see what we see as fans.  I see Ward maybe maybe being a "passable" starter in the majors.

If I could improve my chances of contending by putting something better at third, I do it.  I just really really doubt that Taylor Ward is going to be a player I regret not having.

 

 

they are going to try to be competitive or at least that will be the claim.  If they think Ward needs more seasoning (or they just don't feel like he can take the starting gig) then you'll see Fletcher and Cozart at 2b and 3b respectively.  I think most would agree about somewhat lukewarm confidence in Taylor Ward.  

But they're going to stay at a certain payroll and Eppler feels pitching is a greater need.  If you pressed him, I bet he would love to have Donaldson or any other legit, solid major league 3b.  

If Eppler went to Arte and told him that if he could just spend X to make the team a contender for the division and it meant going a little over the CBT threshold, I think Arte would consider that.  My guess is that's not part of the internal narrative.  

If they have what they consider to be a very productive off season and get all the pieces they're looking for at the right price then they might rethink their stance if there's a player leftover who they really think could help, but I kinda doubt it.  

What Arte is not going to do is go over the threshold out of hope.  Where he knows that a fair number of things would have to go right for us to win the division and I am sure he's been told the likelihood of that happening.  We also have to keep in mind Arte's financial motivation.  He's gonna draw fans because of his golden goose.  Why would he shell out an additional 10-15 mil and cross his fingers?  So much has gone wrong the last few years.  He's going to need the team to show him something before he goes beyond a certain budget.  

[Second Base]

1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

they are going to try to be competitive or at least that will be the claim.  If they think Ward needs more seasoning (or they just don't feel like he can take the starting gig) then you'll see Fletcher and Cozart at 2b and 3b respectively.  I think most would agree about somewhat lukewarm confidence in Taylor Ward.  

But they're going to stay at a certain payroll and Eppler feels pitching is a greater need.  If you pressed him, I bet he would love to have Donaldson or any other legit, solid major league 3b.  

If Eppler went to Arte and told him that if he could just spend X to make the team a contender for the division and it meant going a little over the CBT threshold, I think Arte would consider that.  My guess is that's not part of the internal narrative.  

If they have what they consider to be a very productive off season and get all the pieces they're looking for at the right price then they might rethink their stance if there's a player leftover who they really think could help, but I kinda doubt it.  

What Arte is not going to do is go over the threshold out of hope.  Where he knows that a fair number of things would have to go right for us to win the division and I am sure he's been told the likelihood of that happening.  We also have to keep in mind Arte's financial motivation.  He's gonna draw fans because of his golden goose.  Why would he shell out an additional 10-15 mil and cross his fingers?  So much has gone wrong the last few years.  He's going to need the team to show him something before he goes beyond a certain budget.  

We haven't had a single unproductive offseason under Eppler yet. So whatever the plan is, I trust him. He's proved that even his more unpopular moves or unhearlded moves have tended to work out. It the ones that got more press that really haven't helped much.