Dipoto Grade Sheet

[HaloMagic]

Yeah, AJ's all about stirring things up. Big time troll. He NEVER has respectable or well thought out posts.

Oh, wait...

[Troll Daddy]

Let's just say that I feel sorry for Scoiscia.

[mtangelsfan]

I may not be a fan of aj's posts in the spin forum, but he is a pretty darn thoughtful poster in this forum.  About the farthest thing from a troll there is.

 

Quite honestly, this is the least exciting, least interesting, least compelling angels team I have experienced since the 70's.  Who's fault is it?  Right now I would say everyone from bat boys to the gm.

[Angelsjunky]

Look, we're all upset about how the season has gone so far. And we must remember that two things are true at once:

 

1) It IS still early; there are 152 games to be played.

2) There are some serious red flags to be concerned about, both in terms of individual players and management.

 

I'm not making any final conclusions and have been careful about expressing both of the points above. The point of this thread is not to give Dipoto a final grade, but more as a progress report. Let's revisit in 10 more games, then after 40, etc.

[Angelsjunky]

Thanks mtangelsfan and HaloMagic! Kind words in unkind times (for Angels fans, at least).

 

mt, interesting thought about this team being unexciting. It feels like an all-head, no-heart team. Dipoto seems to get the numbers but might not get the importance of chemistry and the "X-Factor" - which is what Torii brought.

 

Regardless, it will be interesting to see how it plays out. If the Angels get it together and start winning games then our concern was all for naught and we'll all be happy. But if not, it will be interesting to see what happens on the management level.

[Chuck]

The manager and coaching staff is supposed to lead. 

 

You cannot grade the GM decisions ten games in. Period. 

 

Just like you can't call Trout or Hamilton a bust, ten games into the season. 

[sneaky_flute]

as someone who isn't biased, i think the only poor move he made is the hamilton signing. that's 25 million a year that could have gone to keeping hunter and getting some pitching help.

[Angelsjunky]

Chuck, teachers give progress reports. Maybe "Grade Report" sounds too final. Consider this a progress report. And yes, you can give progress reports.

[jshep]

as someone who isn't biased, i think the only poor move he made is the hamilton signing. that's 25 million a year that could have gone to keeping hunter and getting some pitching help.

 

Ya, would have been nice to have that money to spend on pitching.

 

I was/still am fine with letting Hunter walk though.

[Troll Daddy]

The manager and coaching staff is supposed to lead. 

 

You cannot grade the GM decisions ten games in. Period. 

 

Just like you can't call Trout or Hamilton a bust, ten games into the season. 

 

Same rules apply to the manager and coaching staff.

[ten ocho recon scout]

So Angelsjunky would have rather had Wells.

 

They also only had 7 days after the WS to make a decision on Haren and Santana, and financially I can see why they went the direction they did.  

 

Greinke had a choice, and he chose not to come back.  Unless the Angels went 6/$150+ he would not have come here.  Then  people would be here bitching that he's out, and may not be the same pitcher again.

IMO AJ, dipo wasn't the one bwhind pujols or hamilton. I think that was arte, hundred percent. Arte wants to win, badly. And when he sees a name, he opwns the checkbook (wells, pujols, gmj, etc) without worrying about the long term.

I still rate dipo based on frieri (steal), iannetta (steal for chatwood), etc. Sure, we got raped by mill for grienke, but there's is a ton of pressure to win now. (And don't look now, but segura is killing it for them :/)

[JAHV76]

The progress report for this team is below.

Pitching = N

Offense = N

Coaching = N

Defense = N

All NEED IMPROVEMENT!

[Angelsjunky]

I don't know, Ocho - I hear and agree with you but think it is more like Arte says to Jerry: "Do what it takes to win - you have X money to play with." I guess the question that Jerry is going to be second-guessing is whether he should have spent the money on Greinke or Hamilton, or perhaps saved some money and gone after Anibal Sanchez and Edwin Jackson.

 

There's no way to make only good moves, but the key is how it all combines. And we'll just have to see how it all turns out.

[Brent Maguire]

There's nothing wrong with this thread. It's actually kind of a cool idea to see how the team is playing on a 10 game basis. If he does this throughout the year, it could be a very cool thread actually. 

[Chuck]

Chuck, teachers give progress reports. Maybe "Grade Report" sounds too final. Consider this a progress report. And yes, you can give progress reports.

 

Progress reports after two weeks in school? I don't think so. 

 

How about an April Progress report AJ? Wait a couple more weeks. 

[jshep]

IMO AJ, dipo wasn't the one bwhind pujols or hamilton. I think that was arte, hundred percent. Arte wants to win, badly. And when he sees a name, he opwns the checkbook (wells, pujols, gmj, etc) without worrying about the long term.

I still rate dipo based on frieri (steal), iannetta (steal for chatwood), etc. Sure, we got raped by mill for grienke, but there's is a ton of pressure to win now. (And don't look now, but segura is killing it for them :/)

 

I'm not complaining about the Frieri trade by any stretch of the imagination, because I hate to think where our bullpen is without him and he's been legitimately pretty amazing, but I don't know that I would call it a steal at this point.

 

Amarista is pretty whatever. I could see him having a respectable career as a super utility guy, but I don't think he's anyone we'll look back at down the road and regret giving up.

 

Roach looks to be a pretty nice pitching prospect though. He would probably be our system's best, with a chance to contribute before the end of the 2013 season.

[Bashbrothers]

Vernon Wells still sucks.  He has been getting really lucky.  390 BAPIP or so to start this year.

[AZMike]

I'm not complaining about the Frieri trade by any stretch of the imagination, because I hate to think where our bullpen is without him and he's been legitimately pretty amazing, but I don't know that I would call it a steal at this point.

 

Amarista is pretty whatever. I could see him having a respectable career as a super utility guy, but I don't think he's anyone we'll look back at down the road and regret giving up.

 

Roach looks to be a pretty nice pitching prospect though. He would probably be our system's best, with a chance to contribute before the end of the 2013 season.

 

Pretty much this. Roach was the bigger loss considering this teams' pitching depth. Everyone thought the Dan Haren trade was a steal at the time but in the long run the Angels lost that one big time. Corbin and Skaggs are better than 60-80% of the guys in our rotation today.

[Angelsjunky]

Sure, we can do an April progress report.

[Brandon]

I'm more inclined to look at guys that are supposed to produce than the guy that signed them to do what they have always done.

[ispy45]

I don't know, Ocho - I hear and agree with you but think it is more like Arte says to Jerry: "Do what it takes to win - you have X money to play with." I guess the question that Jerry is going to be second-guessing is whether he should have spent the money on Greinke or Hamilton, or perhaps saved some money and gone after Anibal Sanchez and Edwin Jackson.

 

There's no way to make only good moves, but the key is how it all combines. And we'll just have to see how it all turns out.

I think the reason they didn't go for Jackson and Anibal because the Angels knew they would have to sign them for more than 3 years in order to get  the deal done. Instead, they signed Blanton 2 years, Vargas and Hanson expires next year. They are going for 2014-2015 free agents, at least that's the vibe I had from Tim Mead.

[Make Angels Great Again]

I can't help but think of how much Erstad would spark this team.

[HaloMagic]

I'm more inclined to look at guys that are supposed to produce than the guy that signed them to do what they have always done.

That's part of the problem though. Some of these players have always been sub par and Dipoto signed them with a plan that their bad play would improve with better defense behind them or a more structured role . So far, some of those bad players performance hasn't improved. If that continues then it's very reasonable to look to the man who put the overall plan in place. It's quite possible the plan just doesn't work.

[edcoffin]

I'm so seldom active here I have no axe on AJ's posting this question about DiPoto.  But from lengthy experience and seeing lots of outcomes, I'd suggest that you can't 'grade' a GM on (a) short term performance ( until his scouting and staffing org is on the same page, and © he or she is free of difficult contracts and has the system from short season to AAA to MLB in place that the plan calls for.  

 

"All In" never happens unless the owner(s) call for it.  Nobody hired with GM credentials wants deliberately to give up their five year plan for an impulsive 'win it all now' alternative unless they are told to go for it, then do so.  Daniels, among others, was heavily critiqued his first two years (boy wonder and doesn't know the game on the field and you name it).  But he did enough to earn 5+ years of seeing how the plan would work out.  Thus, just MHO, it takes three years to find out what a GM can do, and five years to see if it gets done.  That is, compete but simultaneously structure a solid rebuild.  

[Brandon]

That's part of the problem though. Some of these players have always been sub par and Dipoto signed them with a plan that their bad play would improve with better defense behind them or a more structured role . So far, some of those bad players performance hasn't improved. If that continues then it's very reasonable to look to the man who put the overall plan in place. It's quite possible the plan just doesn't work.

 

No, everyone he brought in has a place and just needed to do what they are capable of. They weren't brought in to over achieve or play above their means. The team is built to where if everyone plays to their capabilities the team will win a lot. No one outside of maybe Pujols, Kendrick, and Richards has played to their average capabilities.

 

That's why this argument is skewed. Are you going to blame Dipoto for the signing or do you blame Hamilton for being a bust?