Lots of Angels notes in Rosenthal's column

[Blarg]

Trout's arbitration is still over a year away, there is no reason for Rosenthal to post some alarmist story about how it will be difficult to sign him long term. Even if Trout goes to arbition in 2015 they still have two more years of club control and leverage.

[stormngt]

If Rosenthal is right, and I think he probably is.  Trout 2014 ??, 2015 $12 million, 2016 $16 million, 2017 $20 million, 2018 FA.  $48 million for the three arb years.  They should just do a 7/$125 or a 6/$100 and hope he signs.  Would put him right in the 28/29 YO area for his monster contract.

 

Trout should never reach arbitration.  If he does, than the Angels deserve to lose him.  This fall they need to give him an offer he can't refuse.  Forget 7/125, give him 10/170.  Make him an Angel for life with the money too big for Trout to turn down and play for the minimum in 2014.  If they worry about salary cap space than structure the contract accordingly:

 

15 years 200 million with 170 million paid for the first ten years and Trout with a opt out clause after 10 years.  That way average contract would be around 13 million.

 

In other words, the ball is in the Angels court.  Give the man an offer he can't refuse.  AND LOCK HIM UP.

 

As for Dipoto and Scioscia I agree I find it hard for Moreno not to do something after this year.  I have said before it it wasn't for Scioscia's contract I would think he would go, but 25 million is a lot to buy out.  Dipoto may go although canning a GM after only 2 years seems unfair.  However, Dipoto was the one who got the 240 million investment in Pujols, the 125 million investment in Hamilton, and still haven't fixed our bullpen.  Personal is his call.

[mrwicked]

move scioscia into an advisor role.

the team needs a fresh voice. there is zero energy on that bench.

[mtangelsfan]

Dismissing all media reports relying on unnamed or unquoted sources, as you and others (Lifetime, cough, cough) seemingly always do, is rather close minded....I tend to be somewhere in the middle....I don't jump on every media rumor as fact nor do I dismiss them all, particularly if it comes from Rosenthal, who, despite your narrow viewpoint, does have sources and is a credible reporter...same as Olney and others....

 

First of all, nothing good comes from you calling out posters who aren't even in this thread.  Now, I didn't dismiss it out of hand, I said it was conjecture.  Do you disagree with that?  

 

I would also say that your hyperbole is very well done.  

[WallyWorld]

Dismissing all media reports relying on unnamed or unquoted sources, as you and others (Lifetime, cough, cough) seemingly always do, is rather close minded....I tend to be somewhere in the middle....I don't jump on every media rumor as fact nor do I dismiss them all, particularly if it comes from Rosenthal, who, despite your narrow viewpoint, does have sources and is a credible reporter...same as Olney and others....

 

and even apart from this article and what MT claims is just conjecture, there have been plenty of indications the past couple of seasons that the powers that be - Moreno, Dipoto, Scioscia - aren't on the same page.  You've got the Hatcher firing and subsequent fallout, the signing of two aging offensive players to mega contracts despite the club needing pitching, fewer Scioscia-type ballplayers being kept around.  

 

*****Mod Edit*****   knock off the personal attacks.

[RePLAY]

I say we give scioscia 3 more years to fail...just to make sure we're making the right decision.

[DMVol]

First of all, nothing good comes from you calling out posters who aren't even in this thread.  Now, I didn't dismiss it out of hand, I said it was conjecture.  Do you disagree with that?  

 

I would also say that your hyperbole is very well done.  

Hyperbole?  I suggest taking a middle ground and it's hyperbole?  Conjecture? Didn't see you say that...you dismissed it, period...which is your MO on anything you disagree with....

[Angel Oracle]

I'm still waiting for Pujols to pay dividends. 

 

I give up on Hackilton.

 

Stay out of initiating future negotiations, Arte!   Your eye for talent at the right age leaves a lot to be desired.

[tomsred]

I say we shut up and let the owner and the GM do their jobs, whatever that is defined to be.

[Angel Oracle]

After this season, 8 years/$160 million for Trout:

$7m, $12m, $15m, $18m, $24m, $26m, $28m, $30m

[tomsred]

I'm still waiting for Pujols to pay dividends. 

 

I give up on Hackilton.

 

Stay out of initiating future negotiations, Arte!   Your eye for talent at the right age leaves a lot to be desired.

No owner should stay out of a contract discussion when he's spending $100M plus.

[nate]

move scioscia into an advisor role.

the team needs a fresh voice. there is zero energy on that bench.

 

Exactly, regardless of who is to blame, having one leader for so long is almost always detrimental to development.

[Docwaukee]

I'm not saying this isn't true, but it's certainly not clear by any means.  Looking from the outside, I see that Dipoto did not put a team together that works with Mike's strengths. 

Agree.  Successful MS seasons were a string of years bucking the typical pythag.  Several years in a row the team outperformed the number of wins they should have had and they had a terrific winning % in close games.  The MS mo was to scrap across a couple of runs and hand the game over to the pen.  Get a lead and keep it. 

 

I don't mind the theory of letting the offense carry the team.  I don't prefer it, but it's reasonable.  I get that the intent was to counteract deficiencies on the pitching side with offense.  With that said, you can do that on the SP side of things but not with the bullpen.  Trying to replace 3 starters in one offseason with limited resources and no farm is tough and I understand that.  Putting together a subpar and inadequate pen for the second year in a row is unacceptable.  They need to essentially allow around 1 run on average over the last three innings or close to it. 

 

At the end of games, most good teams have good bullpens that make a team built on offense less effective so you need to match that with a quality pen of your own.  If they are going to keep virtually the same team intact on offense and sign Vargas, get another starter via trade then they still need to shore up the pen first and foremost. 

[fan_since79]

I can't imagine Scioscia being gone anytime soon with five years left on his contract.  I just don't see it.  I can maybe see Butcher being relieved as a scapegoat, or possibly someone else on the staff.  

 

 

 

Are you sure it's five more years? I thought it was up at the end of the 2017 season.

 

But I would agree with you that he's not going anywhere. I wouldn't be surprised if we're stuck with him until the bitter end.

 

Butcher and some other coaches will be gone long before that. 

[gotbeer]

Are you sure it's five more years? I thought it was up at the end of the 2017 season.

 

But I would agree with you that he's not going anywhere. I wouldn't be surprised if we're stuck with him until the bitter end.

 

Butcher and some other coaches will be gone long before that. 

 

Goes through 2018.

[fan_since79]

Yikes.

[nate]

I'm not saying this isn't true, but it's certainly not clear by any means.  Looking from the outside, I see that Dipoto did not put a team together that works with Mike's strengths. 

 

So what is his excuse the first two years they missed the playoffs when Reagins built the exact team Scioscia asked for?

[ettin]

There is always the possibility that S-C-I-O-S-C-I-A could be traded to another team. There are some teams that would jump at the opportunity and it could help restock our farm system.

 

Not sure it would or could happen but maybe the team needs a new voice sending the message and maybe Mike needs to reboot his system too.

[xboom28x]

So what is his excuse the first two years they missed the playoffs when Reagins built the exact team Scioscia asked for?

 

The team didn't have veteran hitters in the lineup? lol

[Homebrewer]

MS drives home to Thousand Oaks 1/2 the season. He has lived there forever. I think it might be that picking up and moving to another city, in another state, is not on Mikes list of things he wants to do.

My guess is that is one of the main reasons he got the ridiculous contract extension from Arte in the first place.

[DMVol]

There is always the possibility that S-C-I-O-S-C-I-A could be traded to another team. There are some teams that would jump at the opportunity and it could help restock our farm system.

 

Not sure it would or could happen but maybe the team needs a new voice sending the message and maybe Mike needs to reboot his system too.

I think that is a real possibility...not sure it would be a straight trade or more of a salary dump but something like that...I like Scioscia and I'm not sure we'll do better (tend to think we won't)....but I think that is how this thing could very well play out....

[Jay]

Agree with Rosenthal that 14 years is a long time, especially when things are not going well.

[mtangelsfan]

Hyperbole?  I suggest taking a middle ground and it's hyperbole?  Conjecture? Didn't see you say that...you dismissed it, period...which is your MO on anything you disagree with....

 

"All the time"  "It's what you do"

 

Relax, I'm just another poster expressing my opinion.  No need to get all upset about it.  It is conjecture, I'm not saying it isn't true, I'm just saying at this point all we have is third (or fourth) person testimony. 

[mtangelsfan]

So what is his excuse the first two years they missed the playoffs when Reagins built the exact team Scioscia asked for?

 

I don't know that he has one Nate.  But what was his excuse in 2003?  Or Francona's excuse the years the Sox didn't make it.  Sometimes your team doesn't play well enough to win. 

[Angel Oracle]

No owner should stay out of a contract discussion when he's spending $100M plus.

Even if he's already made two monumental boo-boos with Pujols and Hackilton?