Blue Jays are monitoring multiple Angels players

[CanadianHalo]

29 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

@angelsnationtalk

Well considering the Blue Jays have not one, but FOUR top SS prospects in their system, actually in their top 10 prospects list per BA: Austin Martin, Josh Groshans, Orelvis Martinez & Miguel Hiraldo I could see a trade working to acquire Bo Bichette after further review. Bo Bichette is also out until mid September with an injury. They also have Cavan Biggio at 2B who is performing really well (a +.900 OPS). 

Here's how:

The Angels send Simmons, Adell, Heaney and Bundy to the Blue Jays.

The Jays send Bichette, Richardson, Kay & Kirk to the Angels. 

The Jays get a top 5 prospect in all of baseball (per BA) a really good pitcher for this season's run, a decent middle rotation guy in Heaney and next and a defensive specialist to help their left side of the infield which has been a mess defensively for the the playoff push. Bichette could be easily replaced if Simmons doesn't sign an extension there with first round pick Josh Groshans next season, but also have three in the hopper if that doesn't work out. The Jays get two veteran pitchers in Heaney and Bundy and they still have Manoah and Pearson in the hopper as their top pitching prospects.

The Angels can easily replace Adell with Marsh in RF. Better defense, arm, speed & bat control. LF can be a platoon job with Upton/Goodwin until Adams is ready or maybe a FA is signed in the offseason. The Halos get two young arms, Richardson a first round pick who has great control of 4 above average pitches and LHP Kay who at worst is an Andrew Heaney type. 

The prize obviously would be Bo Bichette. Can you imagine an infield of Rendon, Bichette and Fletcher? They all hit .300 and are extraordinary hitters. If the Angels sign La Stella to an extension, they could boast an entire infield of .300.

Probably a pipe dream, but adding Adell to that package along with Bundy and Simmons could get it done. The Blue Jays have ZERO top OF prospects FWIW. 

 

[Stradling]

Just now, Chuckster70 said:

That's the wrong way to look at it. You get way more value out of guys who have a year or two left on their contracts. 

Yes, I know Chuck.  So that list is Goodwin, Bundy, Heaney, Middleton, Rengifo, Fletcher and Adell.  I am sure I am missing a couple.  I don’t see us trading Fletcher or Adell and if we do it will be for a legit top of the rotation arm with 4 plus years of control.  

Personally I don’t see us trading multiple guys with multiple years of control.  Has Eppler traded a major leaguer with multiple years of control?  I am not saying I wouldn’t do it, I just think with the cost certainty of young guys on rookie type deals, we won’t be trading many to fill one need at the top of the rotation.  I could be wrong.  

I am at the point where I would trade anyone on the team not named Trout or Rendon.  But I am not in charge.  

[bloodbrother]

18 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

They’re not trading SWR for Simmons smh

Ok fine I'll settle for Nate Pearson and Adam Kloffenstein

[angelsnationtalk]

29 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

Well considering the Blue Jays have not one, but FOUR top SS prospects in their system, actually in their top 10 prospects list per BA: Austin Martin, Josh Groshans, Orelvis Martinez & Miguel Hiraldo I could see a trade working to acquire Bo Bichette after further review. Bo Bichette is also out until mid September with an injury. They also have Cavan Biggio at 2B who is performing really well (a +.900 OPS). 

Here's how:

The Angels send Simmons, Adell, Heaney and Bundy to the Blue Jays.

The Jays send Bichette, Richardson, Kay & Kirk to the Angels. 

The Jays get a top 5 prospect in all of baseball (per BA) a really good pitcher for this season's run, a decent middle rotation guy in Heaney and next and a defensive specialist to help their left side of the infield which has been a mess defensively for the the playoff push. Bichette could be easily replaced if Simmons doesn't sign an extension there with first round pick Josh Groshans next season, but also have three in the hopper if that doesn't work out. The Jays get two veteran pitchers in Heaney and Bundy and they still have Manoah and Pearson in the hopper as their top pitching prospects.

The Angels can easily replace Adell with Marsh in RF. Better defense, arm, speed & bat control. LF can be a platoon job with Upton/Goodwin until Adams is ready or maybe a FA is signed in the offseason. The Halos get two young arms, Richardson a first round pick who has great control of 4 above average pitches and LHP Kay who at worst is an Andrew Heaney type. 

The prize obviously would be Bo Bichette. Can you imagine an infield of Rendon, Bichette and Fletcher? They all hit .300 and are extraordinary hitters. If the Angels sign La Stella to an extension, they could boast an entire infield of .300.

Probably a pipe dream, but adding Adell to that package along with Bundy and Simmons could get it done. The Blue Jays have ZERO top OF prospects FWIW. 

 

I actually would be okay with adding Adell to this. Only concern I have is I think the Angels will need to add more to the package. Angels would get 3 guys with tons of control and Blue Jays would get substantially less control. They'd likely need to add 2 more prospects or 1 more prospect and 1 MLB ready guy

[Chuck]

22 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

@angelsnationtalk

Well considering the Blue Jays have not one, but FOUR top SS prospects in their system, actually in their top 10 prospects list per BA: Austin Martin, Josh Groshans, Orelvis Martinez & Miguel Hiraldo I could see a trade working to acquire Bo Bichette after further review. Bo Bichette is also out until mid September with an injury. They also have Cavan Biggio at 2B who is performing really well (a +.900 OPS). 

Here's how:

The Angels send Simmons, Adell, Heaney and Bundy to the Blue Jays.

The Jays send Bichette, Richardson, Kay & Kirk to the Angels. 

The Jays get a top 5 prospect in all of baseball (per BA) a really good pitcher for this season's run, a decent middle rotation guy in Heaney and next and a defensive specialist to help their left side of the infield which has been a mess defensively for the the playoff push. Bichette could be easily replaced if Simmons doesn't sign an extension there with first round pick Josh Groshans next season, but also have three in the hopper if that doesn't work out. The Jays get two veteran pitchers in Heaney and Bundy and they still have Manoah and Pearson in the hopper as their top pitching prospects.

The Angels can easily replace Adell with Marsh in RF. Better defense, arm, speed & bat control. LF can be a platoon job with Upton/Goodwin until Adams is ready or maybe a FA is signed in the offseason. The Halos get two young arms, Richardson a first round pick who has great control of 4 above average pitches and LHP Kay who at worst is an Andrew Heaney type. 

The prize obviously would be Bo Bichette. Can you imagine an infield of Rendon, Bichette and Fletcher? They all hit .300 and are extraordinary hitters. If the Angels sign La Stella to an extension, they could boast an entire infield of .300.

Probably a pipe dream, but adding Adell to that package along with Bundy and Simmons could get it done. The Blue Jays have ZERO top OF prospects FWIW. 

 

@angelsnationtalk I actually revised my post right after you replied. I added Heaney to the package. 

[GrittyVeterans]

Someone fill me in here. 

Why would the Blue Jays want Simmons when they have Bichette?

Bichette is better than Simmons already and is 22 years old. I don't get it

[Stradling]

Just now, GrittyVeterans said:

Someone fill me in here. 

Why would the Blue Jays want Simmons when they have Bichette?

He’s injured.  I don’t get it either, unless it is just insurance in case the injury is worse than expected.  Additionally the cost to acquire him won’t be much and they have a deep farm.

[rafibomb]

Guys, we aren't getting any top-100 prospects from the Jays lol

[Chuck]

5 minutes ago, GrittyVeterans said:

Someone fill me in here. 

Why would the Blue Jays want Simmons when they have Bichette?

Bichette is better than Simmons already and is 22 years old. I don't get it

You didn't read my post. 

I doubt something like this gets done, but an org lacking OF prospects that has a plethora of SP and SS prospects that wants to compete this season may pull the trigger on this. 

It may not be Bichette, but they have the depth to make something like this work. 

[GrittyVeterans]

5 minutes ago, rafibomb said:

Guys, we aren't getting any top-100 prospects from the Jays lol

Of course they aren't. But you might as well get what you can. Get the best AA reliever the Jays are willing to give up and call it a day. I don't see Simmons being re-signed at this point anyway. The Angels just can't afford to commit more money to a dude over 30 that's not a pitcher.

[GrittyVeterans]

2 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

You didn't read my post. 

I doubt something like this gets done, but an org lacking OF prospects that has a plethora of SP and SS prospects that wants to compete this season may pull the trigger on this. 

It may not be Bichette, but they have the depth to make something like this work. 

No, I did read the post. I wasn't insinuating we would be getting Bichette back. That's absurd. I was simply wondering why the Jays would even want Simmons at all.

@Stradling answered my question

[Stradling]

There are a few players in this league that will not be traded, Trout, Tatis and Bichette are amongst those players.  

[Stradling]

They would absolutely trade Vladdy Jr before they trade Bichette.  They may have a ton of SS prospects but those could easily turn into 2nd baseman, 3rd baseman, left fielders and center fielders.  

[rafibomb]

2 minutes ago, GrittyVeterans said:

Of course they aren't. But you might as well get what you can. Get the best AA reliever the Jays are willing to give up and call it a day. I don't see Simmons being re-signed at this point anyway. The Angels just can't afford to commit more money to a dude over 30 that's not a pitcher.

I completely agree with you I'm not arguing that we shouldn't trade our players if we can't get a top 100 prospect. I am just tempering expectations so people don't get pissed that if we trade Simmons all we get is an upside bullpen arm when an upside arm in the pen could be extremely beneficial.

[Chuck]

I would honestly be happy getting Groshans instead of Bichette in the same package I posted. 

[GrittyVeterans]

You guys all sure turned on Adell remarkably quickly. Almost everyone was against trading him for 5 years of Yellich at a ridiculously cheap price. And now want him traded for another prospect(Groshans?) that was lower ranked 4 months ago? Seems absurd to me to change your mind that radically based on 20 ballgames

 

 

[rafibomb]

Just now, GrittyVeterans said:

You guys all sure turned on Adell remarkably quickly. Almost everyone was against trading him for 5 years of Yellich at a ridiculously cheap price. And now want him traded for another prospect that was lower ranked 4 months ago? Seems absurd to me to change your mind that radically based on 20 ballgames

Don't they teach you to always sell low?

[Stradling]

12 minutes ago, GrittyVeterans said:

You guys all sure turned on Adell remarkably quickly. Almost everyone was against trading him for 5 years of Yellich at a ridiculously cheap price. And now want him traded for another prospect(Groshans?) that was lower ranked 4 months ago? Seems absurd to me to change your mind that radically based on 20 ballgames

 

 

To our defense Yelich was coming off of a .282 batting average season with 18 homer runs.  He was basically a poor mans Michael Brantley type.  Then he went to the Brewers and blew up.  So find a guy that is a 3 WAR player that is 26 and ask yourself if you would trade Adell for him.  Someone like Verdugo?  He’s actually younger.  Would you trade Adell for Verdugo if he was 26.  

[GrittyVeterans]

6 minutes ago, Stradling said:

To our defense Yelich was coming off of a .282 batting average season with 18 homer runs.  He was basically a poor mans Michael Brantley type.  Then he went to the Brewers and blew up.  So find a guy that is a 3 WAR player that is 26 and ask yourself if you would trade Adell for him.  Someone like Verdugo?  He’s actually younger.  Would you trade Adell for Verdugo if he was 26.  

I understand that. I'm on your side. I'm simply stating that Yelich (even at his Miami level of production -- which was actually about 4 WAR per season the 3 years prior to being traded) would have been a much better return for Adell than a 20 year old SS prospect that was ranked as about the 35th best prospect in the game. 

If I'm trading Adell I better be getting a guaranteed quality major league player under the age of 27 that is under club control for at least 4 years. Yelich fit that bill. I was personally against it at the time also though

In other words, I am not trading him right now. Certainly not selling low right now for some other prospect that was ranked by all the pundits as being worse 5 months ago

[Angels in 2030]

Why would we trade the few trade-able assets we have for a SS prospect?  We need three things: pitchers, pitchers and hmmm what was the 3rd one....oh yeah, PITCHERS!

We have several ML guys who can play SS in place of Simmons in Fletcher and Rengfro.  We also have several really good SS prospects in JJ, Paris, Vera...not to mention guys like Soto, Placentia, etc. Heck, I'd be ok getting a catcher at least; but heck no do we need to get a SS back (whether a ML ready guy or prospect).

[Jay]

49 minutes ago, GrittyVeterans said:

You guys all sure turned on Adell remarkably quickly.

That's the power of groupthink.

 

[totdprods]

I’d think about Marsh for Groshans.

[Duren, Duren]

The Jay's are incredibly hyped up about making the playoffs. A chance to show the successful rebuild is already paying dividends. Their entire marketing campaign has been about promoting this new wave of youth.  Thus they will be aggressive buyers, doing what they could to win now. 

But they have promoted their new young core so much that I doubt they trade any of them. Beyond that they have minor league talent that they may sacrifice to acquire a proven veteran to get them over the hump. Also some youngish veterans who aren't critical to the lineup. 

In other words, they may  possibly over pay for a rental. The Angels should have some leverage. Especially if they can extend negation to the last minutes before the deadline . 

Simmons is the most obvious short term difference maker. And LaStella is also a rental. Not sure how much they'd give up, but try to squeeze them. And maybe make it a bigger deal with Goodwin and almost any pitcher. Even Rengifo because their defensive infield is still inexperienced. By then you might be able to nibble at their best prospects and an established pitcher. I'd like to snare Telieze if possible as a long term power first baseman, but he's part of their regular mix.

 

[Chuck]

2 minutes ago, totdprods said:

I’d think about Marsh for Groshans.

I'd rather keep Marsh over Adell honestly. 

[totdprods]

32 minutes ago, Chuckster70 said:

I'd rather keep Marsh over Adell honestly. 

I like Marsh perhaps more as well, but Adell still has more hype and value I’d guess. Adell is the type of prospect that is involved in a deal for a frontline arm. 

Marsh is the caliber prospect that could be moved for a similar prospect on the other side of the diamond. 

At least in the conventional thinking.