It's time to cut our losses with Zack Cozart

[Mark PT]

2 hours ago, Second Base said:

Until this team is positive that Luis Rengifo is ready, I'd hold onto Cozart.  He's still a really good defender at multiple positions.  My problem really isn't in having Cozart on the roster, as much as it's the fact that he's receiving consistent playing time.  He should be a late inning defensive replacement, and backup.  That's it. 

But once Luis Rengifo is ready to play, then it's time to release Cozart, because at that point Rengifo either becomes the utility player, or is the starting 2B at which point either La Stella or Fletcher become the utility players. 

Perfect comment. I had the same opinion about Calhoun several weeks ago but it looks like he in turning things around. With Calhoun batting well, and if they remove Cozart, the Angels will have a very formidable lineup. Now for some starting pitching.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, Tank said:

here's the rub: we're a competitive team this year. if we release bad players like bour and cozart, we'd better have someone better with which to replace them. do we have that now in thaiss, ward, walsh, etc.? can those kids come in and keep this team competitive for a playoff spot? what if those kids are promoted and do worse than those they replace? what if bour and coazrt figure it out in the next three or four weeks?

this is not as simple to do as some here want to portray.

 

And they have to see if they can do it for their first time in the majors oh and their first time not being in the line up every game.  They could absolutely give it a try, send Bour down and call up Thiass or Walsh.  With Cozart, it just kind of sucks to bring up a future piece and sit him 4-5 games a week.  

[T.G.]

You know Cozy will go 4 for 4 in his next game and hit two homers...

And Chuck will take all the credit.

[UndertheHalo]

When a guy has like a .150 OBP there’s nothing complicated about replacing him. 

Rengifo (up for now) or Ward should be up and Cozart should be gone. 

We don’t even have to speculate about Thaiss.  We have other guys ahead of him. 

The money is completely immaterial.  It’s spent.  It doesn’t matter.  When a guy has been as worthless as Zach Cozart for parts of 2 seasons there’s no justification for waiting around.  

Edited May 14, 2019 by UndertheHalo

[totdprods]

2 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Jones, Rojas, Walsh (probably not Walsh).  

Hard to say with Jones...I like him, but I'm starting to lose confidence that he'll pan out. Well aware of his age, his competition, some underlying stats of encouragement.
I'm as optimistic as any, (well except maybe @Second Base haha) but I know some prospects bust and I'm starting to believe there's a chance he's going to fall into that camp. 

Walsh and Rojas I both see paralleling someone like Jefry Marte's career. That doesn't mean I expect them to post an .800 OPS and then flame out sub .600 two years following and wind up in Asia, but I can see both being decent bench bats who have some great years and some crap years.

Hermosillo is very likely to be leapfrogged if he hasn't already, and I doubt he'll get enough playing time here to develop into his skills. I think @Second Base has likened him to an Aaron Hicks-type, and I agree. He might be a similar late-bloomer. 

I think ultimately we won't keep both Ward and Thaiss. Ward's got the better trade value, but also likeliest to stick here or make an impact sooner, as things currently stand.
Really like his offensive skill set, more than Thaiss', and think he'll become a good MLB hitter - just not sure if it'll happen soon enough before they capitalize on any trade value. Lots and lots of variables in play.

[Stradling]

I’d be fine with Ward as long as we are fine with him being a role player and not a starter.  

[UndertheHalo]

Haven’t they given Ward looks at 1B ? How has that gone ? Anyone know ?

[Chuck]

51 minutes ago, True Grich said:

You know Cozy will go 4 for 4 in his next game and hit two homers...

And Chuck will take all the credit.

It's a win/win. 

But I'd be shocked if Cozart got 4 hits for the remainder of the month. 

[totdprods]

58 minutes ago, Tank said:

what if those kids are promoted and do worse than those they replace? what if bour and coazrt figure it out in the next three or four weeks?

Additionally, what if cut Bour/Cozart, the kid struggles, and someone like Pujols or Fletcher or La Stella gets DLed for a long while?

That’s how you wind up with someone dispensable like Ty Kelly or Wilfredo Tovar getting playing time, because they don’t want to burn up a spot on the 40-man for Walsh, Rojas, Thaiss, etc ahead of guys returning. 

[Stradling]

That’s when you pick up Morales. 

[Chuck]

6 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Additionally, what if cut Bour/Cozart, the kid struggles, and someone like Pujols or Fletcher or La Stella gets DLed for a long while?

That’s how you wind up with someone dispensable like Ty Kelly or Wilfredo Tovar getting playing time, because they don’t want to burn up a spot on the 40-man for Walsh, Rojas, Thaiss, etc ahead of guys returning. 

Kelly & Tovar > Cozart. 

I've seen enough of Cozart (and Bour for that matter) to believe that nearly anybody in our AAA depth or FA lurking out there are better than these two guys. Cozart doesn't drive the ball. His last few hits were either seeing eye groundballs or bloops.

Cozart's exit velocity is slower than Morgan Freeman driving Miss Daisy. 

[DMVol]

24 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

Haven’t they given Ward looks at 1B ? How has that gone ? Anyone know ?

1b and LF, if I recall correctly....

[eligrba]

Cut Cozart and just play 8 when he would be scheduled to play.  Coordinate the pitching and infield shifts based on analytics and increase the number of at bats for the remaining Angel players.

 

[floplag]

1 hour ago, RBM said:

Rengifo was called up yesterday when Calhoun moved to the paternity list. I'm guessing/hoping tonight against RHP Gibson that Cozart is on the bench, La Stella to 3B, Rengifo to 2B, Fletcher to LF and Goodwin to RF. Rengifo could also play LF.

 Im sure thats how they will play it tonight, at least it makes sense, but we now have 2 guys down on the farm that can play the OF with an OPS over 1000 that i would call before i call Rengifo to play the OF in anything other than a pinch situation.  

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, floplag said:

 Im sure thats how they will play it tonight, at least it makes sense, but we now have 2 guys down on the farm that can play the OF with an OPS over 1000 that i would call before i call Rengifo to play the OF in anything other than a pinch situation.  

Are either on the 40 man roster?  I honestly don’t know.  Walsh isn’t. 

[Second Base]

52 minutes ago, totdprods said:

Hard to say with Jones...I like him, but I'm starting to lose confidence that he'll pan out. Well aware of his age, his competition, some underlying stats of encouragement.
I'm as optimistic as any, (well except maybe @Second Base haha) but I know some prospects bust and I'm starting to believe there's a chance he's going to fall into that camp. 

Walsh and Rojas I both see paralleling someone like Jefry Marte's career. That doesn't mean I expect them to post an .800 OPS and then flame out sub .600 two years following and wind up in Asia, but I can see both being decent bench bats who have some great years and some crap years.

Hermosillo is very likely to be leapfrogged if he hasn't already, and I doubt he'll get enough playing time here to develop into his skills. I think @Second Base has likened him to an Aaron Hicks-type, and I agree. He might be a similar late-bloomer. 

I think ultimately we won't keep both Ward and Thaiss. Ward's got the better trade value, but also likeliest to stick here or make an impact sooner, as things currently stand.
Really like his offensive skill set, more than Thaiss', and think he'll become a good MLB hitter - just not sure if it'll happen soon enough before they capitalize on any trade value. Lots and lots of variables in play.

Meh.  Hicks is more like Hermosillo's ceiling.  He's more athletic and stronger than Hicks, but Hicks was always much more of a ball player, even as a prospect.  Hicks' numbers are hyper-inflated by playing in Yankee Stadium.  But Hermosillo, I think his ceiling would be someone that gets on base 35% of the time, hits 15 Hr and a year and steals 30 bases.  

The realistic outcome here is that Hermosillo becomes a dynamic 4th OF.  He'll be the sort of player you bring in as a pinch runner, pinch hitter or as a defensive replacement and because of his athleticism, he pulls off something dazzling every once in a while that reminds you just how valuable he is. 

Again, I know I have this reputation for optimism, but believing Michael Hermosillo becomes a better than average 4th OF doesn't seem all that optimistic to me.  His upside is as an everyday player but the realistic outcome is something slightly less. 

[Angel Oracle]

7 minutes ago, RBM said:

I think the Angels like the defensive flexibility of Fletcher and La Stella with Cozart as a utility guy and spot starter versus LHP's. Rengifo has the same flexibility if he sticks later this year.

I don't see Cozart getting DFA'd at this time.

I think Walsh and Parker stay in AAA for now.

Upton may be back in 2-3 weeks.

Speaking of Upton, interesting to see what happens a year from now, if Marsh is also ready.    Only place Upton can move to then is 1B/a little DHing when Ohtani pitches.   And that assumes that Pujols is retired.

[Jay]

I really hate those "beating a dead horse" memes but this would be the time to post one.

 

 

[Stradling]

9 minutes ago, RBM said:

There are 38 on the 40 man right now and Upton, Middleton and Ramirez are due back in June. 

So we still have to release someone in the next month or so.   

[T.G.]

11 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Speaking of Upton, interesting to see what happens a year from now, if Marsh is also ready.    Only place Upton can move to then is 1B/a little DHing when Ohtani pitches.   And that assumes that Pujols is retired.

This is AW in a nut shell... the next narrative will be what to do with Upton. 

[T.G.]

13 minutes ago, Jay said:

I really hate those "beating a dead horse" memes but this would be the time to post one.

 

[floplag]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

Are either on the 40 man roster?  I honestly don’t know.  Walsh isn’t. 

Im assuming thats why Rengifo is up, but if Cozart was removed a spot would be available was my thinking. 

[floplag]

2 hours ago, RBM said:

I think the Angels like the defensive flexibility of Fletcher and La Stella with Cozart as a utility guy and spot starter versus LHP's. Rengifo has the same flexibility if he sticks later this year.

I don't see Cozart getting DFA'd at this time.

I think Walsh and Parker stay in AAA for now.

Upton may be back in 2-3 weeks.

Short term you are probably right assuming Upton is back on time.  No roster shuffling required and simply tread water.  
But if Rengifo start to hit and Cozart becomes dead weight, the discussion changes, alas that didnt happen on his last callup which is probably why it hasnt happened already. 

[DMVol]

I don’t think Cozart is going anywhere this year....he sticks around, even if it’s strictly as a utility guy...next year could be different.

[Second Base]

8 hours ago, Kevinb said:

When will Rengifo be ready to play full time?

I will say this though, Rengifo is making consistent hard contact against Major League pitching so far.  The hits aren't falling but they will eventually.  So he might be ready right now, though I do think next Spring at the latest.  This July/Auguest comes right after the trade deadline, and I figure right around then, if they Angels haven't promoted most of the kids in AAA, they would soon.

So I do think that at any rate, Rengifo's probably ready this year, and Cozart should be out of a job at that point.