Who gets fired next?

[failos]

2 hours ago, tomsred said:

I don't know about that.  I think Arte is really trying to stay out of baseball operations, I think it was more of a cursory " whatever you think Perry, it's your decision."  Personally I think Arte has reached the age where he doesn't want to be involved in the day to day mess, he has other things in his life that are more important.

While Arte may or may not be involved in the day to day, he still determines the trajectory of the organization. There’s no way he’s completely hands-off

[Stradling]

18 minutes ago, failos said:

Who do you blame? I mean, I try not to take the easy route of blaming Arte, but he is the owner, and given that the entire organization is in disarray it makes sense to blame the man at the helm. Y’know, “the buck stops here” and all that jazz.

My point is simple, if you want to blame Arte for every decision made by his GM then he’s the only one that can get any blame. 

[Stradling]

20 minutes ago, failos said:

Who do you blame? I mean, I try not to take the easy route of blaming Arte, but he is the owner, and given that the entire organization is in disarray it makes sense to blame the man at the helm. Y’know, “the buck stops here” and all that jazz.

Who do I blame, that’s an incredibly broad question.  I blame the players, I blame, management, I blame Perry, I blame Arte.  Depends on the situation. If I fuck up at work I don’t believe my boss deserves the blame or the owner deserves the blame. 

[T.G.]

6 minutes ago, Stradling said:

My point is simple, if you want to blame Arte for every decision made by his GM then he’s the only one that can get any blame. 

The Angels didn't get to this point over night. This season is the culmination of several bad decisions over a period of years. Arte is ultimately responsible.  "Blame" is too weak of a term. 

[failos]

7 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Who do I blame, that’s an incredibly broad question.  I blame the players, I blame, management, I blame Perry, I blame Arte.  Depends on the situation. If I fuck up at work I don’t believe my boss deserves the blame or the owner deserves the blame. 

Yeah it’s a broad question. I suppose personally, with a client I’m working with—they do things the wrong way. I don’t blame the CEO since it’s a huge corporation, but I do blame the system they’ve put in place to allow failure to occur.

[T.G.]

8 minutes ago, Stradling said:

If I fuck up at work I don’t believe my boss deserves the blame or the owner deserves the blame. 

Not the same thing.  

[Taylor]

4 minutes ago, failos said:

Yeah it’s a broad question. I suppose personally, with a client I’m working with—they do things the wrong way. I don’t blame the CEO since it’s a huge corporation, but I do blame the system they’ve put in place to allow failure to occur.

The Angels should go public then we can fire Arte.

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, True Grich said:

Not the same thing.  

But they put me in this position. Ultimately it’s on them, the buck stops and yada yada yada.  

[T.G.]

Just now, Stradling said:

But they put me in this position. Ultimately it’s on them, the buck stops and yada yada yada.  

If you screw up one time, that's on you. If you continue to screw up over time, it's on them for not taking action. 

[T.G.]

At the end of the day, it's all out of our control. 

I keep watching because I like baseball and the Angels are my favorite team. 

What happens on the field, isn’t going to make or break my day. I enjoy seeing them win, but I know winning is hard and winning it all is even harder.

It's just baseball. 

2002 was great. I feel lucky I was able to experience it. I hope I get to experience that again, but I'm not going to obsess about. 

[Stradling]

4 minutes ago, True Grich said:

If you screw up one time, that's on you. If you continue to screw up over time, it's on them for not taking action. 

Ok perfect. These are actually conversations I like to have. 

[failos]

3 hours ago, Taylor said:

The Angels should go public then we can fire Arte.

I wouldn’t mind just having a good, wealthy owner that knows how to properly delegate.

I just want our organization to have better scouting and a better system so processes don’t break apart so easily.

[Taylor]

7 minutes ago, failos said:

I wouldn’t mind just having a good, wealthy owner that knows how to properly delegate.

I just want our organization to have better scouting and a better system so processes don’t break apart so easily.

Sounds like we need a female billionaire. Women are way better at multitasking and delegating.

Maybe Bezos' ex-wife is interested in buying a team.

[Tank]

It’s hard to blame players who don’t perform well when they aren’t terribly talented in the first place. 
 

I’d do a clean sweep of the dead weight on the roster, the coaching staff, and the front office. Hire someone with a 5 year plan to bring the talent back up to where it should be to return to being a yearly contender. 

[gotbeer]

26 minutes ago, Tank said:

It’s hard to blame players who don’t perform well when they aren’t terribly talented in the first place. 
 

I’d do a clean sweep of the dead weight on the roster, the coaching staff, and the front office. Hire someone with a 5 year plan to bring the talent back up to where it should be to return to being a yearly contender. 

 

And the sad thing is, it means a 35 year old Trout and a 33 year old Ohtani.  If they are even still around.  But hey, maybe they find the fountain of youth like Bonds did.

[Taylor]

Just overheard at the Irvine Spectrum. 20-something woman walking by the Basballism store said, "I wanted to get a baseball shirt, so I thought maybe I'll get an Angels shirt. But then I realized, the Angels are tanking their season again, so what would be the point?"

Very sad.

[Duren, Duren]

What they should during the all star break is hold a mini hitting camp. Firing assistants mid season becomes too convoluted.

Without a permanent manager no one knows what direction will be taken next year. And new managers often bring in 'their guys' as assistants. There is no certainty that the current interim  manager becomes permanent. So any new hitting coach may only have a short time anyhow.

I would hire a respected professional hitting specialist unaffiliated with any team now to use the all star break for teaching and motivation. Clearly he can't accomplish miracles in a few days. But he can focus on fundamentals, explain hitting philosophy and identify obvious flaws. 

He (and possibly others in his circle) would be hired in advance and have time to study videos and focus on key points. So by the time he arrives he would have some background on the individual players. 

It would be an insult to the status quo coaching staff, but admitting help is needed is a pragmatic step to solving problems. And not necessarily a threat for the future. 

Candidates could be from various sources. Even outside the major league environment. There are good technical teachers in colleges, the minors, internationally, and the ranks of the retired. But teaching is a priority. 

Practically, there is not a lot of time to the break. But circumstances are bad and getting worse. If the current staff had solutions the team wouldn't be getting worse. And taking such a step may spark the pride of the players. 

I know this is a wild, off the wall thought, but desperate times call for radical measures.  

[Tank]

4 hours ago, gotbeer said:

 

And the sad thing is, it means a 35 year old Trout and a 33 year old Ohtani.  If they are even still around.  But hey, maybe they find the fountain of youth like Bonds did.

Yep, a catch-22. 
 

At this point, I’d rather they develop the right kind of longer term plan than repeating the terrible cycle they’ve been stuck in for a while now. 

[tdawg87]

Lol

[Taylor]

24 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Lol

Amazing. We should recruit someone from the Braves' front office to be our new GM.

[Stradling]

3 minutes ago, Taylor said:

Amazing. We should recruit someone from the Braves' front office to be our new GM.

Smart.  Then that guy can fill the front office with guys from other successful organizations. 

[angelsnationtalk]

23 hours ago, Stradling said:

Then the problem would be the players. Maddon was supposed to be a motivator. 

And if it's the players then what is there to do? 
Do the unthinkable and trade Ohtani and allow Trout the chance to look at a trade?

[Stradling]

5 minutes ago, angelsnationtalk said:

And if it's the players then what is there to do? 
Do the unthinkable and trade Ohtani and allow Trout the chance to look at a trade?

No, surround them with better players.

[angelsnationtalk]

1 minute ago, Stradling said:

No, surround them with better players.

Agreed, but we've all been saying this for years with the front office falling short on guys that could have drastically improved the roster.

[Jay]

If it were up to me I would let Minasian go.

Or maybe keep him but bump him down to an assistant GM and bring somebody else in.

He's not ready IMO.