Do you want Sam Bachman to pitch out of the bullpen this season?

[BTH]

Simple question: do you want Sam Bachman to pitch out of the bullpen this season?

While I understand that he has the stuff to do it and the Angels have the need in the bullpen, my preference would be for him to just develop in the minors as a starter. That's because they need him to be a starter long-term, both organizationally and due to the expectations that come with him being the 9th overall pick drafted right ahead of Kumar Rocker. I think it'd be more difficult for him to go straight into the bullpen and then try to develop him back into a starter. Plus, adding him to the major league roster now would result in him accumulating service time right away and could result in a tricky developmental situation if he ends up out of options while developing as a starter in the minors.

I'm curious how other Angels fans feel about this.

[Angelsjunky]

No way. We want the kid to succeed long-term, and throwing him into the majors right away is very dangerous, with really no upside.

In fact, many college pitchers don't even play in the minors the year they're drafted, considering they're just coming off a college baseball season just a couple weeks ago. I do hope we see him in the minors for a bit, and I think it likely as he only pitched 59 IP in the college season, but I'd be very careful.

Rather, I'd start insert him into the A ball rotation, give him maybe 5 starts, then shut him down for the year. Next year, start him in A+ and go from there.

[totdprods]

If we’re in the race, yes. Worked fine for Crochet and the WS.

The game is changing. Two or three years ago and this would have been nuts. But prospects are jumping to the majors quicker, the minors are being streamlined, the gap is closing.

Edited July 14, 2021 by totdprods

[Capital_Dave]

I have to admit, I'm in the minority on this one.  I voted yes.

The reason is because I feel like the Angels really have to go for it these next few years, including this year.  With Trout and Ohtani both healthy in August/September, I think we'll have a dangerous team, especially if we can trade for a few good starters to pair with Sandoval, Ohtani, and (I hope) Suarez.

I just don't think we can "wait til next year" again because there won't be many next years where we get prime Trout and Ohtani.  Hell, I'm not sure I'd put money on likely getting *one* more year of prime two-way Ohtani... I just really fear that he's going to flame out as a two way player, given the physical demands of it.  There's an Icarus feel to this season...

Let Bachman be Garrett Crochet this fall (or maybe even K-Rod circa 2002).

[Taylor]

Too early to answer. I think it depends on a couple things:

• How he looks in the minors
• If there's a legitimate need for the team to bring him up in September (a la, K-Rod in 2002)

[totdprods]

Like @Capital_Davesaid…time is getting tight for prime Trout/Ohtani. They gotta at least try to go for it if not this year, next. 

[Angelsjunky]

Out of curiosity, I looked at 1st round college starters from the last few drafts, to get a sense of what their team did with them after they were drafted. I also looked at how many minor league innings they pitched before reaching the majors. For sanity's sake, I'm going to only look at top 10-12 picks.

2021

Jack Leiter (2nd, Rangers), Frank Mozzicato (7th, Royals), Sam Bachman (9th, Angels), Kumar Rocker (10th, Mets).

2020 (all did not play in 2020 due to no minors)

Max Meyer (3rd, Marlins): 54 IP in AA so far.

Asa Lacy (4th, Royals): 45.1 IP in A+ so far.

Emerson Hancock (6th, Mariners): 26 IP in A+ so far.

Reid Detmers (10th, Angels): 50 IP in AA so far.

Garrett Crochet (11th, White Sox): Went straight to majors, pitching 6 IP in 2020, 27.1 IP so far this year.

2019

Nick Lodolo (7th, Reds): 8 starts, 18.1 IP in Rk/A after 103 IP in NCAA. Currently in AA.

Alex Manoah (11th, Blue Jays): 6 starts, 17 IP in A- after 108.1 IP in NCAA. Pitched 35 milb innings in 2019/21, reached majors in 2021. 

2018

Casey Mize (1st, Tigers): 5 starts, 13.2 IP in Rk/A+, after pitching 114.2 IP in NCAA. Pitched 123 milb innings in 2018-19, reached majors in 2020.

2017

Kyle Wright (5th, Braves): 9 starts, 17 IP in Rk/A+. About 300 IP in milb. First cup in majors in 2018, but has mostly been in AAA (has struggled in majors, with a 6.56 over 70 IP, including on 6.1 IP this year).

2016

AJ Puk (6th, Athletics): 10 starts, 32.2 IP in A-. Overall 183 IP in minors in 2016-19 before reaching majors in 2019. Returned to AAA in 2021, struggling, although has also pitched 3.1 IP in the majors this year.

Cal Quantrill (8th, Padres): 12 starts, 37 IP in Rk/A/A+. Pitched 336 IP in the minors in 2016-19, before reaching majors in 2019. 

_________________

That's just six years, but it is interesting to note the higher number of college pitchers taken in the first 12 picks. It was 1-2 from 2016-19, was 5 in 2020 and 4 this year.

Notice also, as @totdprods pointed out, the number of minor league innings before reaching the majors seems to be diminishing (and Mize probably would have started 2020 in AAA if not for covid). Manoah only pitched 35 minor league innings and has done really well this year.

It seems likely that both Meyer and Detmers reach the majors this year. Probably not Lacy or Hancock.

That said, only Crochet reached the majors in the same year he was drafted. That's one pitcher in five years (2016-20). Not sure about the years before, or lower draft picks.

[Angelsjunky]

It also seems like a common pattern is to give them one start in Rookie or low A, then promoting them to A+. But they usually don't pitch that much in their first year - only Puk and Quantrill pitched over 20 innings in the year they were drafted.

[TooCool]

Couldn't hurt, everyone else sucks anyway.

[Vlad27Trout27]

I wouldn't do it. There's a lot of risk invovled, even when Crochet was called up he through a few innings and than had to go on the Il. 

I think you put him in AA and let him start. 

We tried the same thing with Rodriguez and it wasn't really worth it.  

[Jason]

If he’s ready then sure

[greginpsca]

They may shut him down for the summer to rest his arm. Then possibly have him go to AZ Instructs.

[Chuck]

[Lou]

41 minutes ago, greginpsca said:

They may shut him down for the summer to rest his arm. Then possibly have him go to AZ Instructs.

He's only pitch 83 innings over the last 2 years.

[Dtwncbad]

The question is do you WANT him to. . .

I guess my answer is yes because if he is pitching out of the bullpen for the Angels, it probably means they are contending.

[Angel Oracle]

17 hours ago, Capital_Dave said:

I have to admit, I'm in the minority on this one.  I voted yes.

The reason is because I feel like the Angels really have to go for it these next few years, including this year.  With Trout and Ohtani both healthy in August/September, I think we'll have a dangerous team, especially if we can trade for a few good starters to pair with Sandoval, Ohtani, and (I hope) Suarez.

I just don't think we can "wait til next year" again because there won't be many next years where we get prime Trout and Ohtani.  Hell, I'm not sure I'd put money on likely getting *one* more year of prime two-way Ohtani... I just really fear that he's going to flame out as a two way player, given the physical demands of it.  There's an Icarus feel to this season...

Let Bachman be Garrett Crochet this fall (or maybe even K-Rod circa 2002).

Can’t forget Cobb.

Since May 1:

49.2 innings, 3.25 ERA, 1.05 WHIP, 51/16 Ks/BBs, TWO HRs allowed 

Ohtani, Sandoval, Cobb, Suarez, and maybe Heaney (if not being bad in half of his starts) leaves only one spot in the rotation.

The overworked pen needs reinforcements.   And they need to let Wantz pitch.

Edited July 15, 2021 by Angel Oracle

[Torridd]

18 hours ago, Angelsjunky said:

No way. We want the kid to succeed long-term, and throwing him into the majors right away is very dangerous, with really no upside.

In fact, many college pitchers don't even play in the minors the year they're drafted, considering they're just coming off a college baseball season just a couple weeks ago. I do hope we see him in the minors for a bit, and I think it likely as he only pitched 59 IP in the college season, but I'd be very careful.

Rather, I'd start insert him into the A ball rotation, give him maybe 5 starts, then shut him down for the year. Next year, start him in A+ and go from there.

My caveat is if he excelled wherever they put him and management thought he could be someone to put us over the top during a playoff push a la FRod.