Tommy La Stella, David Fletcher & Brian Goodwin appreciation thread.

[eligrba]

18 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

That’s why they got Bour, who still may come around. Remember, he doesn’t need to hit .300 to be what they wanted. I think he’s a .230/.350/.450 kind of guy, which is still within one hot week of being where he is. 

As I say always, you can’t just look at batting average. And if you do, you need to remember the whole league is hitting .245

Should we look at whether he runs after hitting a ball?

Should we look at whether he waits to be called out before abandoning a base?

I think the issue with Bour is not his average, it is with his mental acuity.

[Jeff Fletcher]

25 minutes ago, eligrba said:

Should we look at whether he runs after hitting a ball?

Should we look at whether he waits to be called out before abandoning a base?

I think the issue with Bour is not his average, it is with his mental acuity.

I can’t defend any of that. It certainly doesn’t help. 

He’s right now going to bat 8th maybe 4-5 times a week, so he’s not going to have a huge impact either way while they wait to see which direction he goes. 

[Inside Pitch]

On 4/22/2019 at 3:24 PM, Mark68 said:

Eppler seems to have done OK looking for position players & relievers off the scrapheap.

 

If only the same could be said for starting pitchers...

 

Then again, you usually don't find halfway decent ones on the scrapheap.

Felix Pena has done fine as a scap heap find.

[Claude]

2 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

If that happens at a time when Bour is still slumping and Thaiss is playing well, sure. They aren’t calling him up unless he can play every day. 

If Bour plans on getting his free cheeseburgers at the White House next year he’d better step up his game. 

Edited May 2, 2019 by Calzone 2

[Angel Oracle]

55 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Felix Pena has done fine as a scap heap find.

Just needs to stretch his endurance out now.

[T.G.]

I hope Bour starts to do what they thought he would do... get on base, hit for power.  When he's not doing that - his bonehead mistakes are magnified.  I want him to succeed because I want the Angels to win - but he's tough to cheer for. 

No player is perfect.  I like what La Stella has been doing with the bat and getting on base - but his defense sucks.  It's hard to pick between Renigfo, La Stella and Fletcher.  And then when Cozart comes back it really gets messy.  I know, I know - a lot of fans want to just DFA Cozart, but that's not likely.  So many moving pieces, but no one fits perfectly. 

How would you guys rank Renigfo, La Stella and Fletcher?  Which two do you think should get the most playing time?  Fletcher seems to have the most well rounded game.  Renigfo has the most up side and La Stella is probably having the best season.  Something has to give... I guess it's a nice problem to have.

[Broad Street]

Since Goodwin had an off night last night, should we start an "I miss good Goodwin" thread?

[Jeff Fletcher]

36 minutes ago, True Grich said:

I want him to succeed because I want the Angels to win - but he's tough to cheer for. 

If it matters, he seems like a pretty nice guy. Always friendly. Always accountable. I like him. 

[stormngt]

I am starting to get optimistic with this team.  In the past years what killed us so many guys playing like crap.  This year, Fletcher, La Stella, and Goodwin has provided above average production.  I know they will regress, however, getting just average production out of those positions after years of disaster is hopeful.  We are only 3 games back of the Wild Card right now and only 5.5 games out of first place.  We have Ohtani coming back probably next week.  Canning being added to our starting pitching and with Heaney coming back soon we may actually have some interesting baseball in September.  

[stormngt]

2 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

Felix Pena has done fine as a scap heap find.

Bridwell did really well for one season.  Ramirez?

[T.G.]

5 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

If it matters, he seems like a pretty nice guy. Always friendly. Always accountable. I like him. 

It does matter to me.  And that's good to know.

What makes Bour hard to cheer for are the "stupid" things he does on the field.  It leaves me with the impression that he's not putting in his best effort.  That's just my perception.  So many mental mistakes - makes me think his head isn't in the game.  I don't like that at all.  It's easy for me cut Kole Calhoun some slack - because he's always "in the game" and his effort is always extraordinary.  Again - that's just my perception, but it's all I have to go by.  When a guy isn't performing AND he's making mental mistakes - it makes him hard to cheer for.

[Angel Oracle]

Bour = Marv Throneberry?

[Broad Street]

1 hour ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

If it matters, he seems like a pretty nice guy. Always friendly. Always accountable. I like him. 

I had the pleasure of meeting him when he was with the Marlins, he was a great guy.

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, stormngt said:

Bridwell did really well for one season.  Ramirez?

Bridwell was smoke and mirrors but yeah, he should count as a hit.   JC Ramirez definitely was.    

He's screwed the pooch on some secondary piece type FA's (Cozart/Valbuena), but nobody is perfect.  Adding Simmons and Upton kinda makes the flubs less of a sore thumb IMO.

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, True Grich said:

It does matter to me.  And that's good to know.

What makes Bour hard to cheer for are the "stupid" things he does on the field.  It leaves me with the impression that he's not putting in his best effort.  That's just my perception.  So many mental mistakes - makes me think his head isn't in the game.  I don't like that at all.  It's easy for me cut Kole Calhoun some slack - because he's always "in the game" and his effort is always extraordinary.  Again - that's just my perception, but it's all I have to go by.  When a guy isn't performing AND he's making mental mistakes - it makes him hard to cheer for.

Seeing Eppler say the dude will hold himself accountable actually scores points with me as well.  But yeah -- he's done some dopey things that make you question his intelligence.

[Mark68]

4 hours ago, Inside Pitch said:

Felix Pena has done fine as a scap heap find.

Eh...get back to me when he can get through 5 innings without having the wheels completely disintegrate...

[Inside Pitch]

1 hour ago, Mark68 said:

Eh...get back to me when he can get through 5 innings without having the wheels completely disintegrate...

If that's the route you want to take -- get back to me when you come to the realization that the game is changing and the team is operating differently than in the past.  While I agree it would be nice if he could consistently work into the 6th inning it's possible the plan may have always been to turn him into a 5 inning pitcher.   

They may be putting a lot more value into 150 innings of 110 ERA+ ball than fans do.

Or he's a stopgap until they develop/sign someone better.

Edited May 2, 2019 by Inside Pitch

[Docwaukee]

1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

If that's the route you want to take -- get back to me when you come to the realization that the game is changing and the team is operating differently than in the past.  While I agree it would be nice if he could consistently work into the 6th inning but the plan may have always been to turn him into a 5 inning pitcher.   

They may be putting a lot more value into 150 innings of 110 ERA+ ball than fans do.

Or he's a stopgap until they develop/sign someone better.

than 180 ip of 90 ERA+

[AngelsLakersFan]

On 4/22/2019 at 12:20 PM, Mark68 said:

Is this the same Chuck who hated La Stella a mere two weeks ago?

Come on it was AT LEAST three weeks ago.

[Jay]

Speaking of ERA+

Houston = 127

 

 

Angels = 96
Oakland = 93
Seattle = 93
Texas = 92

 

[GrittyVeterans]

4 minutes ago, Jay said:

Speaking of ERA+

Houston = 127

 

 

Angels = 96
Oakland = 93
Seattle = 93
Texas = 92

 

We knew this would be the case in the AL West all along. 4 pretty mediocre teams and one really good team

[AngelsLakersFan]

2 hours ago, True Grich said:

It does matter to me.  And that's good to know.

What makes Bour hard to cheer for are the "stupid" things he does on the field.  It leaves me with the impression that he's not putting in his best effort.  That's just my perception.  So many mental mistakes - makes me think his head isn't in the game.  I don't like that at all.  It's easy for me cut Kole Calhoun some slack - because he's always "in the game" and his effort is always extraordinary.  Again - that's just my perception, but it's all I have to go by.  When a guy isn't performing AND he's making mental mistakes - it makes him hard to cheer for.

It doesn't help that he's fat too... 

[Docwaukee]

It's almost impossible to take a team with no farm system and overcome substantial rotation injuries to the point that your top innings guy over the last 3.2 seasons has averaged 90 per year.  

people talk about depth but there just no amount of depth that can cover that without some semblance of it coming from appropriate player development.  

the fact that Eppler has been able to get guys like Ramirez, Pena and Bridwell to actually perform decently is actually quite impressive.  There aren't a lot of (if any) legit free agents that would be willing to come to a team where they could end up as a 6th starter should everyone else end up healthy.  

While guys like Madero, Bradish, Brady, Hernandez, Jake Lee, Isaac Mattson, Oliver Ortega, Joe Gatto, Travis Herrin,, Cooper Criswell, Matt Ball, Jeremy Beasley, Adrian DeHorta, Patrick Sandoval, Jaime Barria, and others aren't headed to the top of the rotation, having four or five of those guys at each level and progressing give you much better options than David Huff, Odrisamer Despaigne, Troy Scribner, Daniel Wright, Deck McGuire or from having to pay Harvey or Cahill 10+m per season. 

A few of those guys will end up as legit 4/5's and probably a couple of 3's.  

But a very important part is having this huge stable of redundancy allows you to get those 4-5 innings per start and optimize them while playing the option game over the course of a season.  Not just for relievers but ultimately to where it could be a piggy back start situation.  

[totdprods]

5 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

While guys like Madero, Bradish, Brady, Hernandez, Jake Lee, Isaac Mattson, Oliver Ortega, Joe Gatto, Travis Herrin,, Cooper Criswell, Matt Ball, Jeremy Beasley, Adrian DeHorta, Patrick Sandoval, Jaime Barria, and others aren't headed to the top of the rotation, having four or five of those guys at each level and progressing give you much better options than David Huff, Odrisamer Despaigne, Troy Scribner, Daniel Wright, Deck McGuire or from having to pay Harvey or Cahill 10+m per season. 

A well of pitching that is as deep as that, even if not high-end talent, is not only incredibly valuable for our own rotation and bullpen depth, but very attractive on the trade market. 

You also left off Molina, Pina, Soriano, Yan, Duensing, Warren, Wantz, Aquino, and Swanda.

O_O

[Docwaukee]

11 minutes ago, totdprods said:

A well of pitching that is as deep as that, even if not high-end talent, is not only incredibly valuable for our own rotation and bullpen depth, but very attractive on the trade market. 

You also left off Molina, Pina, Soriano, Yan, Duensing, Warren, Wantz, Aquino, and Swanda.

O_O

agree on the trade value thing and that is another area where the Angels have lost a ton of value by not having healthy arms.  Guys like Richards and Shoe would have given us additional prospects.  

and I only included A+ and above who really have a chance to contribute by next year.