What Americans don't understand about Nordic countries

[Angelsjunky]

Nordic countries are extremely small (& not diverse); that's why they're able to implement their great social programs. it doesn't make sense to compare them with the US.

 

Yes, this is partially true - but there's no reason why the basic idea couldn't be adapted. It wouldn't be the same as Finland, but it could follow the same basic approach.

 

It is my opinion that it will happen eventually, with or without Bernie, for two reasons: One, the millenials are strongly in favor of it. Some might argue that they'll "grow out of it," but I think we're seeing a generational change. The 20th century is over, yet we're still clinging to 20th century ideologies and approaches.The Nordic countries, due to their smaller populations, are merely paving the way as to what is possible in terms of integrating stronger social programs into a capitalist paradigm.

 

Two, as we become more and more automated through technological advances, there's going to be fewer lower-paying jobs, so we're eventually going to need better social programs for those who are unable to adapt to the newer paradigm. This also applies to renewable energies, to some extent, and we'll see this change more quickly--as older technologies like coal are reduced and even phased out. I think someone on Maher was talking about how you're not going to see your 58-year old coal miner learning to become a solar engineer.

[ten ocho recon scout]

AJ, i usually like reading articles like this. But you cant post something on here with that title and no vikings, man.

I want my last 6 minutes back

[ten ocho recon scout]

LOL. On the other hand, just because one isn't a Christian doesn't mean one is an atheist. I find it unfortunate that many think the choice is between Creationism or Evolution, Christianity or atheism, etc. There are many different belief systems out there, some even of which are entirely individualistic and not connected to an organized religion or written dogma of any kind.

In before Adam says "hippy."

[ABC]

Nothing funnier than an atheist attempting to use scripture.

 

Atheism doesn't have scripture?

[mtangelsfan]

Atheism doesn't have scripture?

 

Does it?  I wouldn't know.  I was clearly referencing biblical scripture.;

[Adam]

I was thinking of buying a Nordic Track trainer

[Guest]

Yes, this is partially true - but there's no reason why the basic idea couldn't be adapted. It wouldn't be the same as Finland, but it could follow the same basic approach.

 

It is my opinion that it will happen eventually, with or without Bernie, for two reasons: One, the millenials are strongly in favor of it. Some might argue that they'll "grow out of it," but I think we're seeing a generational change. The 20th century is over, yet we're still clinging to 20th century ideologies and approaches.The Nordic countries, due to their smaller populations, are merely paving the way as to what is possible in terms of integrating stronger social programs into a capitalist paradigm.

 

Two, as we become more and more automated through technological advances, there's going to be fewer lower-paying jobs, so we're eventually going to need better social programs for those who are unable to adapt to the newer paradigm. This also applies to renewable energies, to some extent, and we'll see this change more quickly--as older technologies like coal are reduced and even phased out. I think someone on Maher was talking about how you're not going to see your 58-year old coal miner learning to become a solar engineer.

AJ, there are quite a few reasons why Nordic countries are able to implement these extensive programs. As I mentioned, they are significantly smaller: adapting some of these social programs in a country as enormous as the US would be difficult logistically and financially.

 

Nordic countries have no problem with taxation, hence how they are able to fund things like guaranteed incomes and high-quality universal healthcare. The US is still being hampered down by Social Security and MediCare as it is––imagine having to implement additional entitlements on a federal scale. Besides having to implement these things, imagine figuring out how to fund it. Americans HATE paying taxes––it was founded because of a hatred for taxes. The political sphere is already poisoned, and people think socialism is a bad word. 

 

Oh, and our government is too incompetent to agree on anything; so there's that. For the record, I'm a big fan of all the Nordic countries. These things might make more sense on the State (small state) or local level.

[ABC]

Does it?  I wouldn't know.  I was clearly referencing biblical scripture.;

 

I was just taking a jab at atheism and how it has become a religion of its own.

[Angelsjunky]

AJ, there are quite a few reasons why Nordic countries are able to implement these extensive programs. As I mentioned, they are significantly smaller: adapting some of these social programs in a country as enormous as the US would be difficult logistically and financially.

 

Nordic countries have no problem with taxation, hence how they are able to fund things like guaranteed incomes and high-quality universal healthcare. The US is still being hampered down by Social Security and MediCare as it is––imagine having to implement additional entitlements on a federal scale. Besides having to implement these things, imagine figuring out how to fund it. Americans HATE paying taxes––it was founded because of a hatred for taxes. The political sphere is already poisoned, and people think socialism is a bad word. 

 

Oh, and our government is too incompetent to agree on anything; so there's that. For the record, I'm a big fan of all the Nordic countries. These things might make more sense on the State (small state) or local level.

 

So basically you're saying Americans are too stupid.

 

But here's the thing: We have a TON of money. What you're saying is akin to saying, "We can't buy anymore furniture for our house because it is already so cluttered." But why not get rid of some of the old, out-dated furniture to make room for new, cleaner stuff? Ikea?

 

But again, I don't see why it can't be adapted to the United States. I think it will over time, but we're probably not quite ready yet.

[Angelsjunky]

I was just taking a jab at atheism and how it has become a religion of its own.

 

Very true. There is an "atheistic fundamentalism."

[mtangelsfan]

So basically you're saying Americans are too stupid.

 

But here's the thing: We have a TON of money. What you're saying is akin to saying, "We can't buy anymore furniture for our house because it is already so cluttered." But why not get rid of some of the old, out-dated furniture to make room for new, cleaner stuff? Ikea?

 

But again, I don't see why it can't be adapted to the United States. I think it will over time, but we're probably not quite ready yet.

 

No, he's saying Americans are very American.  There is a reason this country was started and why it draws people who are inspired by the ability to make it on their own.  Only those who think too highly of their own position would equate culture to intelligence.

[Adam]

Time to take your ball home, AJ

[Angelsjunky]

No, he's saying Americans are very American.  There is a reason this country was started and why it draws people who are inspired by the ability to make it on their own.  Only those who think too highly of their own position would equate culture to intelligence.

 

LOL. Someone's been drinking Uncle Sam brand koolaid.

 

Time to take your ball home, AJ

 

Ooh, you got me, Adam. that zinger was worthy of calscuf.

[mtangelsfan]

LOL. Someone's been drinking Uncle Sam brand koolaid.

 

Sorry, but this has to be one of your worst responses ever.  From a ton of my previous posts you know I am no flag waiver.  You have clearly missed my point entirely.

[Guest]

So basically you're saying Americans are too stupid.

 

But here's the thing: We have a TON of money. What you're saying is akin to saying, "We can't buy anymore furniture for our house because it is already so cluttered." But why not get rid of some of the old, out-dated furniture to make room for new, cleaner stuff? Ikea?

 

But again, I don't see why it can't be adapted to the United States. I think it will over time, but we're probably not quite ready yet.

I never alluded to Americans being "stupid." I think you're really stupid, though. 

[Adam]

[GrittyVeterans]

LOL. Someone's been drinking Uncle Sam brand koolaid.

 

See I just don't understand when this became a bad thing. Can someone fill me in here?

 

You'd think we're Russia with the way you talk about the United States

Edited March 21, 2016 by GrittyVeterans

[Spirit]

So basically you're saying Americans are too stupid.

 

But here's the thing: We have a TON of money. What you're saying is akin to saying, "We can't buy anymore furniture for our house because it is already so cluttered." But why not get rid of some of the old, out-dated furniture to make room for new, cleaner stuff? Ikea?

 

But again, I don't see why it can't be adapted to the United States. I think it will over time, but we're probably not quite ready yet.

 

 

We don't have a ton of money.  We just have no limit on our credit card.

 

 

 

[Angelsjunky]

LOL. Someone's been drinking Uncle Sam brand koolaid.

 

Sorry, but this has to be one of your worst responses ever.  From a ton of my previous posts you know I am no flag waiver.  You have clearly missed my point entirely.

 

Thoughtful response, thanks.

 

I never alluded to Americans being "stupid." I think you're really stupid, though. 

 

Another one - good stuff, failos. Thanks for continuing the reasoned dialogue.

[nate]

Scandinavian countries also have very strict immigration laws to where it is almost impossible to immigrate.  They do not have any minorities, the cost of living outside of the capital cities is very low because there is so much land and so sparse a population.  The VAT aka sales tax is very high so it disproportionately affects those who do not have much money.

 

The title of the link should be "What Socialist Americans Think They Know About Scandinavian Countries But Couldn't Be More Wrong About"

[Tank]

Scandinavian countries also have very strict immigration laws to where it is almost impossible to immigrate.  They do not have any minorities, the cost of living outside of the capital cities is very low because there is so much land and so sparse a population.  The VAT aka sales tax is very high so it disproportionately affects those who do not have much money.

 

The title of the link should be "What Socialist Americans Think They Know About Scandinavian Countries But Couldn't Be More Wrong About"

 

*** caveat emptor ***

 

there's a meme on facebook right about some danish teacher who makes $61k a year. she (and i think everyone else) is taxed at 68%. cars come with a tax rate of 120% so very few people can afford them (which might explain the bicycling meme above). sure, health care and college are free, but at a pretty significant cost (IF THESE NUMBERS ARE CORRECT).

[Guest]

*** caveat emptor ***

 

there's a meme on facebook right about some danish teacher who makes $61k a year. she (and i think everyone else) is taxed at 68%. cars come with a tax rate of 120% so very few people can afford them (which might explain the bicycling meme above). sure, health care and college are free, but at a pretty significant cost (IF THESE NUMBERS ARE CORRECT).

http://www.snopes.com/denmark-socialism-brutal-meme/

[Adam]

Sell more Budweiser and have nicer lawns

[Blarg]

http://www.snopes.com/denmark-socialism-brutal-meme/

Your Snopes article pretty much confirmed every statement in the meme. Shifting gas prices only means that at any given time gasoline is a volitile market, here it dropped to under $2 per gallon but now is over $3.

But the core facts are there like a 40%+ tax rate, a 25%+ goods tax rate, a 180%+ tax rate on autos. Basicly a crushing consumer debt for way too few social services. Even Snopes had to admit their health care is neither free or without a large deductable.

So, yeah, thanks for debunking socialism.

[Angelsjunky]

Somehow, despite all that tax-raping, the Danish are pretty happy:

 

https://disinfo.com/2016/03/world-happiness-report-who-is-the-happiest-of-them-all/

 

 

Guess who's not even in the top 10:

 

1. Denmark
2. Switzerland
3. Iceland
4. Norway
5. Finland
6. Canada
7. Netherlands
8. New Zealand
9. Australia
10. Sweden

Look at all those commie countries, all happy and shit.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Angelsjunky