Andrelton Simmons a top 10 SS (by MLB Network)

[eligrba]

It's a ridiculous premise to think Scioscia is telling Arte that left field is fine. I have no idea if Arte would be more aggressive or not. What I do know is managers want the best roster possible. Owners have other things to worry about in addition to the roster.

 

I understand what you are saying.  What I do not understand is why certain ridiculous thoughts enter my head. I have tried to limit their access but the aluminum foil hats don't seem to work. Once the voices stop, I will try really hard to only have non-ridiculous thoughts.

[Stradling]

I understand what you are saying. What I do not understand is why certain ridiculous thoughts enter my head. I have tried to limit their access but the aluminum foil hats don't seem to work. Once the voices stop, I will try really hard to only have non-ridiculous thoughts.

Good luck buddy

[Guest]

You should do something other than making analogies.

Haha, I know. I like choosing dumb analogies, I get that from my pops.

[Second Base]

Wait wait wait, I just surmised that it's possible Andrelton Simmons won't be as good in LA as he was in Atlanta, and hellfire and brimstone wasn't unleashed upon me from trolls and homers alike.  Now somebody tell me, just what the actual f____ is going on here?

[QuinlansMinion]

Wait wait wait, I just surmised that it's possible Andrelton Simmons won't be as good in LA as he was in Atlanta, and hellfire and brimstone wasn't unleashed upon me from trolls and homers alike.  Now somebody tell me, just what the actual f____ is going on here?

Well that would be possible if Simmons played in LA.  Unfortunately I dont think he'll be playing in LA anytime soon.  

[AngelsLakersFan]

Thats more an indictment of the talent evaluation on the Angels part Arte Moreno's part.

 

FIFY

[Guest]

I still contend that is on Arte. I believed he pulled the plug on the off season strategy. Eppler was probably told we would be aggressive for a free agent lf.

I feel that way as well, but I still think Eppler should have had better foresight than that.

[NrM]

I think many here overlook the main issue I have with Simmons trade. It doesn't simply come down to the talent and potential of the players involved. You have to look at things from a bigger picture.

 

The Angels are in desperate need of cheap cost controlled talent. The more barren a farmsystem has become, the more valuable a top prospect is to that farmsystem.

Newcomb should've been worth more to the Angels than any other team.

 

I've made the comparison to the phillies in the past, and eppler hasn't done a damn thing to change my mind so far.

Edited January 17, 2016 by Poozy

[tomsred]

I think many here overlook the main issue I have with Simmons trade. It doesn't simply come down to the talent and potential of the players involved. You have to look at things from a bigger picture.

 

The Angels are in desperate need of cheap cost controlled talent. The more barren a farmsystem has become, the more valuable a top prospect is to that farmsystem.

Newcomb is worth more to the Angels than he would've been on any other team.

 

Or another way to look at that would be that if Newcomb and Ellis have some risk of MLB failure (and they do until proven otherwise), it might be more valuable to have a young MLB proven player(s) who isn't cost prohibitive to avoid the risk of the larger failure if Newcomb and Ellis are ineffective.

[Lou]

Though I've been an outspoken opponent of this trade, I'm excited about Simmons in 2015. What I'm concerned about however, is the relative certainty of Simmons declining skill set. He's elite because of the defense, but as has been reported, that's an inconsistent skill set that declines at a young age and rather quickly, particularly among infielders. There's a very good chance that in 3 years, Simmons will have gone from great to good, which is generally where Aybar's been at in his career. Now obviously Simmons can more than offset this if he starts hitting the ball with a lot more consistent authority. And while I think he'll improve offensively, I don't know if it will be enough to offset a diminishment in defense. I feel he's going to transition from a 4 win player to a 2 win player over the course of his contract, simply because of the one great skill he has.

Now obviously I won't argue about the price we paid, that's been hashed out enough, but I'm concerned we acquired a player who won't be able to he same thing he was in Atlanta. Seems like splitting hairs though, he's good regardless.

3 years from now Simmons will be a better fielding ss than Aybar ever was. He'll still be great.

[Lou]

No im all for giving up prospects for star players.  But in this case, we didnt really improve that much.  I get that Simmons is an upgrade at SS, but our offense desperately needed to be upgraded more, and instead it likely got worse by trading Aybar.  

Simmons had a higher ops than Aybar last year

[Docwaukee]

Though I've been an outspoken opponent of this trade, I'm excited about Simmons in 2015. What I'm concerned about however, is the relative certainty of Simmons declining skill set. He's elite because of the defense, but as has been reported, that's an inconsistent skill set that declines at a young age and rather quickly, particularly among infielders. There's a very good chance that in 3 years, Simmons will have gone from great to good, which is generally where Aybar's been at in his career. Now obviously Simmons can more than offset this if he starts hitting the ball with a lot more consistent authority. And while I think he'll improve offensively, I don't know if it will be enough to offset a diminishment in defense. I feel he's going to transition from a 4 win player to a 2 win player over the course of his contract, simply because of the one great skill he has.

Now obviously I won't argue about the price we paid, that's been hashed out enough, but I'm concerned we acquired a player who won't be able to he same thing he was in Atlanta. Seems like splitting hairs though, he's good regardless.

the natural progression for normal defenders is as you've said.  But Simmons isn't a normal player.  He actually has a chance to be one of the best if not the best defensive SS of all time.  

 

For the early part of his career, Simmons actually has no peer.  

 

The only comps we have are other elite defensive SS.  

Ozzie Smith, Mark Belanger, Omar Vizquel, Cal Ripken.  

 

While it's tough to compare, some interesting things to note about those guys is that their defense didn't really decline until their mid 30's.  

 

Ozzie is his best comp, and his bat improved to where he peaked from age 29-38.  

 

Nothing is for sure, but history tells us that Simmons is going to be a 2-4 WAR defender for the entirety of his contract with the halos and his bat is likely to improve.   

[AngelsLakersFan]

Simmons had a higher ops than Aybar last year

 

Simmons has actually arguably been a better hitter 3 of the last 4 years.