ESPN - how the Angels have failed Trout.

[Duren, Duren]

Painful but pretty accurate recap. Not fun reading.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28577463/ten-reasons-mike-trout-mlb-best-player-2010s-won-playoff-game

[Make Angels Great Again]

Y u do this Alden?

[Angelsjunky]

I just skimmed it and it is  pretty accurate, but the problem is that it isn't weighted at all. some of those reasons were more impactful than others. Namely, the rotation woes that were largely due to terrible, terrible luck.

[Taylor]

I forgot that the Angels had the best record in the MLB in 2014. 

[T.G.]

Alden isn't telling us anything we don't already know. 

This is pretty lazy journalism in my opinion.

[greginpsca]

I'm surprised anyone watches ESPN anymore. What use to be a good channel, has now become such garbage, should be flushed downed the toilet. Don't think i have watched a show on there in at least 3 years.

[ten ocho recon scout]

6 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

I just skimmed it and it is  pretty accurate, but the problem is that it isn't weighted at all. some of those reasons were more impactful than others. Namely, the rotation woes that were largely due to terrible, terrible luck.

This will get ignored by too many on here. Bad enough that it gets ignored by outside fans, but at least its understandable (cant expect casual followers to remember people who werent big names).

In what, 3 years give or take, we lost roughly our whole rotation to TJ. It came on the heels of blowing our wad on pujols, hamilton and wilson. With no farm to supplement.

The only way out of it would have been to trade trout, and tank for a few years.

But people ignore, just as we say today "trout window", there was a pujols window, too..... this is why i keep stressing they need to focus on the adell one rather than the trout one.

[Chuck]

3 minutes ago, True Grich said:

Alden isn't telling us anything we don't already know. 

This is pretty lazy journalism in my opinion.

It's a slow month. 

[Claude]

1 minute ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

This will get ignored by too many on here. Bad enough that it gets ignored by outside fans, but at least its understandable (cant expect casual followers to remember people who werent big names).

In what, 3 years give or take, we lost roughly our whole rotation to TJ. It came on the heels of blowing our wad on pujols, hamilton and wilson. With no farm to supplement.

The only way out of it would have been to trade trout, and tank for a few years.

But people ignore, just as we say today "trout window", there was a pujols window, too..... this is why i keep stressing they need to focus on the adell one rather than the trout one.

I think it’s now the Eppler window. If we don’t win soon they’ll toss him out of one. 

He’s definitely putting the team on Maddon’s back. 

[tdawg87]

Ahh. The Aoki catches, particularly the first one where he literally had no clue where the ball was (he wasn't even looking at the ball). That was the first time since I was a teenager in which I literally screamed at the TV and broke my remote by throwing it at the wall. That's when I knew they weren't winning the series. The luck was so completely on KC's side.

Such a frustrating series. Hamilton phoning it in, Trout popping up on the high fastball every at bat, and of course CJ Wilson doing his thang in game 3. 

But ultimately, this kind of all falls on Arte. He seems willing to bring in a big name, but isn't willing to go beyond that. CJ Wilson was the last big pitching signing we made. And we've been desperate for pitching every year since he left. A lot of it is bad luck, no doubt, but at some point we gotta bring in a pitcher. I don't blame him or Eppler for Cole or any of the other guys. I do blame them for not getting Ryu or Keuchel despite the question marks about them. Also we haven't drafted a legit pitcher since what, Weaver? Does Richards count? Fuck man, this org sucks at pitching from top to bottom.

Rant over.

[T.G.]

3 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

But ultimately, this kind of all falls on Arte.

[Justin]

42 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

In what, 3 years give or take, we lost roughly our whole rotation to TJ. It came on the heels of blowing our wad on pujols, hamilton and wilson. With no farm to supplement.

From the summer of '14 to the summer of '18, Skaggs, Richards, Heaney, Tropeano, Ramirez, Ohtani, Richards (a second time) all tore their UCLs. 

Apart from the starters' UCL tears, there was Richards tearing up his knee at Fenway, Shoemaker almost dying after being hit by a comebacker, and Skaggs actually dying. 

It is staggeringly bad luck.  

[Justin]

41 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Also we haven't drafted a legit pitcher since what, Weaver? 

Canning is going to be great. 

[tdawg87]

4 minutes ago, SoPas Angel said:

Canning is going to be great. 

I think he will be good, but until then....

[DCAngelsFan]

1 hour ago, tdawg87 said:

Ahh. The Aoki catches, particularly the first one where he literally had no clue where the ball was (he wasn't even looking at the ball). That was the first time since I was a teenager in which I literally screamed at the TV and broke my remote by throwing it at the wall. That's when I knew they weren't winning the series. The luck was so completely on KC's side.

Such a frustrating series. Hamilton phoning it in, Trout popping up on the high fastball every at bat, and of course CJ Wilson doing his thang in game 3. 

But ultimately, this kind of all falls on Arte. He seems willing to bring in a big name, but isn't willing to go beyond that. CJ Wilson was the last big pitching signing we made. And we've been desperate for pitching every year since he left. A lot of it is bad luck, no doubt, but at some point we gotta bring in a pitcher. I don't blame him or Eppler for Cole or any of the other guys. I do blame them for not getting Ryu or Keuchel despite the question marks about them. Also we haven't drafted a legit pitcher since what, Weaver? Does Richards count? Fuck man, this org sucks at pitching from top to bottom.

Rant over.

Absolutely.  He's been willing to sign a "big name" - but he didn't seem to invest in the nuts and bolts of the operation, almost from day one.  More interested in marketing (how long can one ride the laurels of reducing the price of beer from outrageous to slightly-less-outrageous?)  than in building an effective operation.   

We completely withdrew from the international market (and DiPoto screwed up historically badly when we returned - Baldoquin was the international equivalent of the Wells trade and the Hamilton signing), we drafted poorly every year except for one magical year, and as an owner, Arte didn't seem to notice.  

He's kind of a bit like a Dan Snyder in that sense - he doesn't tinker as much as Danny boy - just he's happy to grab the shiny object at the expense of running the operation right.   He's not Angelos-level negligent, but he's not run a tight ship, either.  

Not really buying the "lack of revenue streams" argument - the financial records Deadspin published a few years back showed Arte is busy paying himself and investors money.  Not McCourt level ATM, but still.

Speaking of McCourt - after he all-but-demolished the Dodgers, look at their bounce back - they win, and are able to bring up ROY-caliber talent seemingly every year.  

Arte should be embarrassed.  I would be.  

p.s. also, f&^k Aoki 

 

 

 

 

[tdawg87]

To be clear, I believe Arte has been overall a good owner. The best owner we've had. 

My problem is with his apparent apprehension of crossing the "line in the sand". The teams that have all gone over the threshold have found consistent success, and have even won the WS in doing so. The Yankees and Dodgers haven't won the WS but they're in the playoffs basically every year. Houston won in 2017. Boston won in 2018. The Cubs won a WS recently.

I'm not trying to imply that going over the tax threshold is correlated to being successful, but it hasn't hurt the teams who have done it. We're more like the Phillies than the Dodgers. 

Anyway I'm ranting again. I just wish Arte was willing to literally do whatever it took to get these guys to the playoffs again. Apparently he's only willing to take it so far. Since we don't have any legit pitching prospects we kind of needed a big FA signing this winter. Yeah the Ryu contract will likely end up sucking in 2022 but for now it would be pretty fucking good. Same with Keuchel. Also the Dodgers (who have an incomparable scouting department, outside of maybe TB) got Alex Wood for pennies. He'll probably be a nice arm for them.

I'm dribynk

[ScottT]

They've had a lot of bad luck since 2014.   Years or poor drafting is the other main culprit.  You can nitpick here and there with signings and trades, but those things could've been overcome with better luck and better drafts. 

 

[ScottT]

You could say the Angels were fortunate to get Ohtani, but then he throws 50 innings over two years.

The Angels lucked out with La Stella last year, then he got hurt.  Could've possibly traded him even....  nope. 

Even when they've lucked out, they've gotten unlucky.

[Stradling]

Not sure I agree with luck.  When the Dodgers get a guy like Muncy and turn him into the player he is it isn’t luck.  So when the Angels sign Ohtani it isn’t luck, they prepared better than anyone else that Ohtani would consider.  That isn’t luck.  

[Pancake Bear]

Honestly, I could’ve written that article in two words: Jerry Dipoto. His pure ineptitude not only led to selling off the farm, lock, stock, and barrel, but then proceeding to salt it so that it wouldn’t be viable for years. He screwed us over with awful contracts and nothing in the system to fix it. No international presence to speak of. He just left things about as badly as he could’ve. 

I really have no idea to what extent his disaster of a tenure was Arte’s fault. But either way, I can’t imagine a worse 4-5 years of management, regardless of who was making the decisions. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

2 hours ago, RendZone said:

I think it’s now the Eppler window. If we don’t win soon they’ll toss him out of one. 

He’s definitely putting the team on Maddon’s back. 

Ive said it before. Eppler will not be around to see if he was right. And that has nothing to do with this season.

Tony Reagins drafted Trout....