Thoughts and Prayers

[tdawg87]

6 minutes ago, wopphil said:

Why not limit all magazines, on any and all guns with magazines, to just a few bullets. I don’t hunt, but isn’t it true that you typically get just one shot with which you (1) hit the animal, (2) or it runs away and you don’t get another shot? And as far as home protection goes, in the typical home protection scenario, how many shots does the homeowner actually take? One or two? So can’t gun owners accomplish the only real tasks guns are good for - hunting and home protection - with a gun that merely shoots a shot or two in quick succession? 

No you need to pepper your house with 30 rounds to make sure you hit your target. 

[wopphil]

4 minutes ago, Jason said:

This is true for a hunting scenario but not for a self defense situation. 

I know it would seem you’d want the ability to fire 20 rounds at a burglar, but I’d bet just about anything that the data would show that in 95+ percent of instances of home gun use, no more than two or three shots are fired. 

[Jason]

14 minutes ago, wopphil said:

I know it would seem you’d want the ability to fire 20 rounds at a burglar, but I’d bet just about anything that the data would show that in 95+ percent of instances of home gun use, no more than two or three shots are fired. 

When it comes to any type of use of force you use what is necessary to stop the threat. Maybe it’s one round, maybe it’s 15? What if you only have a two round magazine and miss? Now what? In a life or death situation I’d rather have too many than not enough 

Edited May 28, 2022 by Jason

[Jason]

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/02/03/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/
 

[UndertheHalo]

9 minutes ago, Jason said:

When it comes to any type of use of force you use what is necessary to stop the threat. Maybe it’s one round, maybe it’s 15? What if you only have a two round magazine and miss? Now what? 

What’s the trade off here tho Jason.  OK, yes you can have a big shoot out at your house should that become necessary.  So that option is out there the downstream consequence is everyone has to deal with mass shootings all the time.  I mean is there any point that this imaginary shoot out for the home invasion returns start diminishing? I’m serious is there anything that can happen that would make you start to wonder about how worthwhile having access to that is ? 

Edited May 28, 2022 by UndertheHalo

[fan_since79]

24 minutes ago, wopphil said:

Why not limit all magazines, on any and all guns with magazines, to just a few bullets. I don’t hunt, but isn’t it true that you typically get just one shot with which you (1) hit the animal, (2) or it runs away and you don’t get another shot? And as far as home protection goes, in the typical home protection scenario, how many shots does the homeowner actually take? One or two? So can’t gun owners accomplish the only real tasks guns are good for - hunting and home protection - with a gun that merely shoots a shot or two in quick succession? 

If you wake up from a deep sleep in the middle of the night in a dark room, will you have enough alertness to accurately hit an intruder with one shot who's already in your bedroom?

How about a hunting scenario where you get your one or two shots at a grizzly and he's still charging? You're out of bullets and in deep trouble.

There was a police situation in Portland about a year ago where a crazed homeless man was running with a large knife towards a cop who had her taser out. It didn't stop him, and her partner emptied his gun into the man who kept charging for a while. He was shot like ten times and finally collapsed.

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, fan_since79 said:

If you wake up from a deep sleep in the middle of the night in a dark room, will you have enough alertness to accurately hit an intruder with one shot who's already in your bedroom?

How about a hunting scenario where you get your one or two shots at a grizzly and he's still charging? You're out of bullets and in deep trouble.

There was a police situation in Portland about a year ago where a crazed homeless man was running with a large knife towards a cop who had her taser out. It didn't stop him, and her partner emptied his gun into the man who kept charging for a while. He was shot like ten times and finally collapsed.

So in the deep sleep scenario are you sleeping with your gun under your pillow or what ? 

[wopphil]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

So in the deep sleep scenario are you sleeping with your gun under your pillow or what ? 

Lol. No, I am sure his gun is locked in a safe because he is a responsible gun owner. 

[wopphil]

6 minutes ago, fan_since79 said:

If you wake up from a deep sleep in the middle of the night in a dark room, will you have enough alertness to accurately hit an intruder with one shot who's already in your bedroom?

How about a hunting scenario where you get your one or two shots at a grizzly and he's still charging? You're out of bullets and in deep trouble.

There was a police situation in Portland about a year ago where a crazed homeless man was running with a large knife towards a cop who had her taser out. It didn't stop him, and her partner emptied his gun into the man who kept charging for a while. He was shot like ten times and finally collapsed.

That’s a really good point, I had forgotten all about the massive threat posed by the grizzly bear. Maybe I should re-think this one. 

[cals]

5 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

So in the deep sleep scenario are you sleeping with your gun under your pillow or what ? 

Why do you even waste your time?  It’s such a retarded argument. 

[UndertheHalo]

Just now, cals said:

Why do you even waste your time?  It’s such a retarded argument. 

It’s funny every time tho. 

[Jason]

3 minutes ago, wopphil said:

Lol. No, I am sure his gun is locked in a safe because he is a responsible gun owner. 

This is correct. Mine is in a quick access, biometric safe 

[tdawg87]

19 minutes ago, Jason said:

When it comes to any type of use of force you use what is necessary to stop the threat. Maybe it’s one round, maybe it’s 15? What if you only have a two round magazine and miss? Now what? In a life or death situation I’d rather have too many than not enough 

Then you probably shouldn't have a gun in the first place.

[UndertheHalo]

There just seems like there are so many negative trade offs.  What if you make a mistake and shoot the wrong person ?  What if a child or someone else who isn’t supposed to have access to the gun somehow gets a hold of it ?  These things probably happen more often then a legitimate self defense use.  Just seems like a lot of bad other possibilities for what is unquestionably an extremely unlikely use case.  

[Jason]

13 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

What’s the trade off here tho Jason.  OK, yes you can have a big shoot out at your house should that become necessary.  So that option is out there the downstream consequence is everyone has to deal with mass shootings all the time.  I mean is there any point that this imaginary shoot out for the home invasion returns start diminishing? I’m serious is there anything that can happen that would make you start to wonder about how worthwhile having access to that is ? 

We live here in Cali and we’ve had magazine capacity restrictions for a while now. Sure doesn’t seem like that makes much of a difference since people that violate those possession laws aren’t held accountable for doing so. 

[Jason]

6 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Then you probably shouldn't have a gun in the first place.

Probably not 

[UndertheHalo]

1 minute ago, Jason said:

We live here in Cali and we’ve had magazine capacity restrictions for a while now. Sure doesn’t seem like that makes much of a difference since people that violate those possession laws aren’t held accountable for doing so. 

You’re talking about gang land guys ?

[cals]

1 minute ago, UndertheHalo said:

There just seems like there are so many negative trade offs.  What if you make a mistake and shoot the wrong person ?  What if a child or someone else who isn’t supposed to have access to the gun somehow gets a hold of it ?  These things probably happen more often then a legitimate self defense use.  Just seems like a lot of bad other possibilities for what is unquestionably an extremely unlikely use case.  

With the amount of home invasions happening to white people in suburbia these days by evil minorities, you take the risk of blowing away one of your kids or your wife getting depressed and offing herself.  These are the trade-offs for being born a fucking dipshit.  

[tdawg87]

You guys act like you're going to get your home invaded by 12 trained assassins who were sent to test your skills to see if you're still a badass after being retired for 5 years. Or maybe a grizzly bear with an AK-47 will come barging into your bedroom while you're bare ass plowing your wife.

In reality, 2 guys who are probably nervous as fuck might try to rob your home in the middle of the night and the second they know you're awake they will flee, and if not they'll flee once they know you have a firearm. Hell, get an alarm system and they'll probably run after it goes off. 

Oh but the government might try to take your guns so you gotta fight back against trained soldiers in which case your house will be blown up. This is just as likely as the grizzly bear scenario.

 

[Jason]

Just now, UndertheHalo said:

There just seems like there are so many negative trade offs.  What if you make a mistake and shoot the wrong person ?  What if a child or someone else who isn’t supposed to have access to the gun somehow gets a hold of it ?  These things probably happen more often then a legitimate self defense use.  Just seems like a lot of bad other possibilities for what is unquestionably an extremely unlikely use case.  

These things absolutely do happen and are preventable. There are a lot of irresponsible gun owners out there. If you do buy one then you should get a lot of training so you become proficient with safety and marksmanship. Remember that cop last year that was shooting at some crook and killed a girl in the dressing room? That was preventable. I don’t believe in gun “accidents”. They are all negligence and preventable. 

[tdawg87]

Just now, Jason said:

These things absolutely do happen and are preventable. There are a lot of irresponsible gun owners out there. If you do buy one then you should get a lot of training so you become proficient with safety and marksmanship. Remember that cop last year that was shooting at some crook and killed a girl in the dressing room? That was preventable. I don’t believe in gun “accidents”. They are all negligence and preventable. 

I know you're a responsible gun owner. I think you take your daughter to the range? That's cool. Teach them early so they know how to protect themselves and also understand the safety required to handle a firearm.

[Jason]

3 minutes ago, UndertheHalo said:

You’re talking about gang land guys ?

Well that’s who is usually breaking laws and murdering people. 

[cals]

I can only imagine the ego stroking some of your poor wives must have to do on a daily basis just.  It must get fucking exhausting.  

I mean, my wife has her own shit she has to deal with with me but my god at least she doesn’t have to tell I’m a big, bad motherfucker daily else I become the next movie theater shooter.

[cals]

1 minute ago, tdawg87 said:

I know you're a responsible gun owner. I think you take your daughter to the range? That's cool. Teach them early so they know how to protect themselves and also understand the safety required to handle a firearm.

Dude, I know you try to be tolerant and understanding but don’t encourage him.  Anything less than shaming him for being a moron is unacceptable.

[UndertheHalo]

3 minutes ago, Jason said:

These things absolutely do happen and are preventable. There are a lot of irresponsible gun owners out there. If you do buy one then you should get a lot of training so you become proficient with safety and marksmanship. Remember that cop last year that was shooting at some crook and killed a girl in the dressing room? That was preventable. I don’t believe in gun “accidents”. They are all negligence and preventable. 

it just seems like it’s not worth it.