2018-19 Free Agent List.

[AngelsLakersFan]

14 minutes ago, Scotty@AW said:

Arte being Arte is signing a drug addict to suck at baseball, who then takes drugs to cope with the sucking, so you turn on him and make yourself look like a heartless ass to the media and then proceed to explain to them that you don't have any money to spend to improve the team while granting the interview aboard your private effing super-yacht, no more than 2 years after signing a 2 billion dollar TV contract.

That's Arte being Arte.

Savage

[totdprods]

15 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

as an aside, it also tells me we aren't going to wake up tomorrow with an additional 30 mil in payroll.  Arte is actually quite disciplined when it comes to how much he's gonna spend.  His unpredictability comes in the form of what he spends it on.  

So, in hindsight you are saying the Guerrero, Pujols/Wilson, and Hamilton signs were...predictable? And that the amount of money he was going to spend could have been predicted? Glancing at payroll figures since he bought the team, I see pretty wild fluctuation almost year to year, and the last few be years its shot back and forth year to year by $15-20m in both directions. 

The guy dropped like $700m in contracts between 2011-2014. He had never done anything remotely close to that before, even if you factor in inflation for his '04 shopping spree. 

I don't disagree that your prediction for a $165m payroll is off - I think that's fair, prudent, and very realistic, but I disagree that Moreno is incapable of going all Wild Card when he basically has been the most out of nowhere owner with contracts in the last decade.

[Docwaukee]

23 minutes ago, totdprods said:

So, in hindsight you are saying the Guerrero, Pujols/Wilson, and Hamilton signs were...predictable? And that the amount of money he was going to spend could have been predicted? Glancing at payroll figures since he bought the team, I see pretty wild fluctuation almost year to year, and the last few be years its shot back and forth year to year by $15-20m in both directions. 

The guy dropped like $700m in contracts between 2011-2014. He had never done anything remotely close to that before, even if you factor in inflation for his '04 shopping spree. 

I don't disagree that your prediction for a $165m payroll is off - I think that's fair, prudent, and very realistic, but I disagree that Moreno is incapable of going all Wild Card when he basically has been the most out of nowhere owner with contracts in the last decade.

absolutely not.  not then.  but now it is.  We've now seen his threshold.  We now know how much he's willing to spend on payroll per year.  We now have 6 years of payroll precedent set that factors the current revenue from our TV deal.  

143, 160, 143, 164,150, 170.  Those are our payrolls the last six years. All within about 10% of one another.  All within about 5% of total revenue.  We aren't going to see some magic jump because all the money coming in is now set.  

We found it unpredictable at the time because it's not like he announced that he was going to take payroll from 120 to 160 over the course of 3 years.  But in retrospect it's obvious because of the fox deal.  

If you show me some sort of new revenue stream that's gonna bring money to the team, then I'll predict we spend a portion of that on payroll.  

Last year was the litmus.  There was ample opportunity for 'crazy Arte' to come out, but he didn't.  Instead, he cited 'economics' as his main reason.  Let me tell you something.  It was always economics.  His spending was never on a whim.  It was pointed and with purpose.  There's a number and he's gonna be within about 10% of it.  Even if, by the off chance, we sign Turner, all that means is less money for 2019.  

[AngelsLakersFan]

2 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

If you show me some sort of new revenue stream that's gonna bring money to the team, then I'll predict we spend a portion of that on payroll.  

He hasn't seemed to do anything with the MLBAM money, though I suppose it'd be hard to tell. 

[Ohtaniland]

The 2020-2021 free agent list is what we should be worried about.

[Docwaukee]

3 minutes ago, AngelsLakersFan said:

He hasn't seemed to do anything with the MLBAM money, though I suppose it'd be hard to tell. 

um.  I think we know what he's doing with it.  

I think the thing that most of us, as fans, forget is that Arte is running a business.  The Angels are now his primary source of income and long term equity.  As much as we want him to be the guy that says 'f it, let's win', it's just not the case.  Again, Arte's transgression lie in his meddling.  Not in his spending.  

Every dollar he spends on payroll or any other operational item either means he's got to offset it by cutting in another area or it come directly out of his pocket.  

He's basically saying 'Well, I guess Hamilton was a bad choice, but why would I take money out of my own pocket without any potential return?'  

What additional money does he stand to make on a 15mil per year investment in Justin Turner?  He's not butt hurt or angry or shell shocked.  It's just business.  

[Vegas Halo Fan]

8 hours ago, nando714 said:

We can finally sign beltre 

Just as he becomes Pujols II.

[Brent Maguire]

The biggest hope here is that the team is able to avoid any silly contracts for the next few years, get the rotation healthy again, infuse the farm system with as much talent as possible and spend whatever money they're allowed to spend when this FA class comes around. As others have alluded, I don't envision Arte trying to mess around with the luxury tax much, at least not in a potentially harmful way spread across multiple years. I think they'll be in a position to add 1 nice free agent next winter and potentially one big fish the year after that. Hopefully, the TJ guys have bounced back by then and the upper minors have produced some depth that allows for:

 1) Trades for filling MLB holes

 2) Calling up MiLB players who aren't utterly terrible 

A nice scenario would be the Angels are somewhat competitive in 2017 but not enough to not sell at the deadline. The guys who have 1 year left(Escobar, Maybin, Street, Pennington, Nolasco) are traded for upper minors depth. The Angels sign someone like Mike Moustakas next offseason, who fills a hole for 4-5 years. Heaney and Trop return and fill out a pretty nice rotation. With a young rotation that's dirt cheap, you'll have allotted funds to spend at 2B, LF and in the bullpen. Maybe, the team has a strong year and is a playoff contender that has a slowly growing farm system. Going into 2019, there's some decisions to be made w/ Richards and Calhoun and the inevitable Trout contract extension has to be looming. There's enough payroll flexibility here to add a few nice free agents to fill out the roster. 

[Angel Dog and Beer]

Sign Mathis, Romine, SRod and Ervin and start hanging banners. 

 

[Angel Oracle]

I do wonder, increasingly, if with Arte having turned 70, that he sells the team by about 4-5 years from now?    I'm not aware of any family members that he could bequeath the franchise to.

And with the changes in MLB, it would seem to almost be prudent that multiple persons be the ones purchasing the Halos, if it happens.   Big money is propping up all around MLB.  The Halos are attractive in that they have a good longterm tv deal, and by 2021 the bad contracts will hopefully be minimal.   Downside would of course be the age of Angel Stadium. 

[Docwaukee]

13 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

I do wonder, increasingly, if with Arte having turned 70, that he sells the team by about 4-5 years from now?    I'm not aware of any family members that he could bequeath the franchise to.

And with the changes in MLB, it would seem to almost be prudent that multiple persons be the ones purchasing the Halos, if it happens.   Big money is propping up all around MLB.  The Halos are attractive in that they have a good longterm tv deal, and by 2021 the bad contracts will hopefully be minimal.   Downside would of course be the age of Angel Stadium. 

I really don't see Arte funding a stadium out of his own pocket.  Maybe there's an opportunity with LT global.  Arte has about 2 years before he has to decide whether to opt out of the lease (oct, 2018).  So another thing he could be doing is keeping any additional long term payroll debt off the books in order to sell his primary position.  Makes it more palatable for new ownership to decide how they want to spend their money as opposed to having it predetermined with some bloated contracts.  

Frankly, I'd be ok with that at this point.  Arte has been a solid owner.  His payroll is probably on point relative to revenue.  But he was too involved in actual baseball ops and he created a rudderless management hierarchy.  There is risk of getting a new owner of course.  We would want a new stadium and the check book opened for the 2018-19 free agent class.   But you never know what your gonna get.  

[AngelsLakersFan]

On 12/7/2016 at 10:17 PM, Dochalo said:

um.  I think we know what he's doing with it.  

Yacht fuel?

[nikkachez]

Yes, the name's are cool and all, but also look at the ages next to a lot of them

 

Harper and Machado make this class exciting, Fernandez would have as well, but obviously...

[Troll Daddy]

Good time to shop for a legit Ace

[Angel Oracle]

On ‎12‎/‎7‎/‎2016 at 11:21 PM, Angels_Baseball said:

The biggest hope here is that the team is able to avoid any silly contracts for the next few years, get the rotation healthy again, infuse the farm system with as much talent as possible and spend whatever money they're allowed to spend when this FA class comes around. As others have alluded, I don't envision Arte trying to mess around with the luxury tax much, at least not in a potentially harmful way spread across multiple years. I think they'll be in a position to add 1 nice free agent next winter and potentially one big fish the year after that. Hopefully, the TJ guys have bounced back by then and the upper minors have produced some depth that allows for:

 1) Trades for filling MLB holes

 2) Calling up MiLB players who aren't utterly terrible 

A nice scenario would be the Angels are somewhat competitive in 2017 but not enough to not sell at the deadline. The guys who have 1 year left(Escobar, Maybin, Street, Pennington, Nolasco) are traded for upper minors depth. The Angels sign someone like Mike Moustakas next offseason, who fills a hole for 4-5 years. Heaney and Trop return and fill out a pretty nice rotation. With a young rotation that's dirt cheap, you'll have allotted funds to spend at 2B, LF and in the bullpen. Maybe, the team has a strong year and is a playoff contender that has a slowly growing farm system. Going into 2019, there's some decisions to be made w/ Richards and Calhoun and the inevitable Trout contract extension has to be looming. There's enough payroll flexibility here to add a few nice free agents to fill out the roster. 

Agreed, except I would wait on Nolasco and Maybin.   If they have indeed finally found themselves and the team is close to contending, they could be good candidates to re-sign, to two year contracts anyway.  Maybin would then be a perfect lead-in to Jaimai Jones' eventual promotion by around 2020.  Nolasco pitched like a true #3/#4 after being acquired, albeit turning 34 this month.

[Docwaukee]

1 hour ago, Troll Daddy said:

Good time to shop for a legit Ace

where?  

[Troll Daddy]

2 hours ago, Dochalo said:

where?  

Costco for starters

 

duh