Guys like Weaver

[eaterfan]

Found the lurking Boston fan

Boston is actually my most hated team. More than anyone in the division, more than the Dodgers, and more than the Yankees. But try again.

Or just keep denying objective facts and continue the ad hominem attacks because your argument was wrong.

No one is arguing that TW is a HoF pitcher, but he accumulated a decade and a half of above average pitching in the bigs. That's more than 99% of pitchers can say.

[Mark68]

For the era and the park in which he (mostly) pitched, Tim Wakefield was a serviceable pitcher for the majority of his career. You have to remember that he pitched during the height of the Steroid Era.

[Stradling]

Found the lurking Boston fan

No he was responding to a ridiculous post you made.

[laagamer]

Boston is actually my most hated team. More than anyone in the division, more than the Dodgers, and more than the Yankees. But try again.

Or just keep denying objective facts and continue the ad hominem attacks because your argument was wrong.

No one is arguing that TW is a HoF pitcher, but he accumulated a decade and a half of above average pitching in the bigs. That's more than 99% of pitchers can say.

 

No he was responding to a ridiculous post you made.

 

Just joking fellas. Jeez. Apologies. 

 

And I realize my apparently ridiculous opinion is unpopular but I think Tim Wakefield was garbage.

 

Sue me. 

[Erstad Grit]

Fresh new topic!

[Ohtaniland]

I don't believe that Weaver's style of delivery will work well with a knuckleball. His knuckleball would probably get shelled worse than his 80 mph fastball. Anyways I thought he was stretching in his final season of his MLB career.

[Angel Oracle]

And it's a pain for catchers to work with too.

[Angel Oracle]

Didn't the better knuckleballers like the Niekros still have at least mid 80s heat?

[Second Base]

why can't Pujols be in his early 20's again. It's working pretty well for Trout. It might extend his career a lot longer than being in his mid-30's.

[disarcina]

I gotta believe that Jered Weaver has something left -- even if his fast ball has lost (significant) velocity.

I don't think converting to a knuckleball makes any sense for Weaver.

the knuckleball guys mentioned in the thread, were knuckerballers all their careers.

Niekro brothers, Wakefield, Hough. Wilhelm.

As for Weaver and some folks knocking him here because he's not the ace pitcher he once was for the Halos -- well, he's pitched well for us and has been a mainstay in the rotation for a number of years now, signed an extension with a hometown discount proving with action his loyalty to the Halos organization.......if his fastball has lost so much velocity that he can't pitch competitively in MLB and his days with the Halos are numbered (and this is a big IF) --well, in my book he still goes down as a great Halo who pitched well for the Angels during his time here. I'm hoping he's able to contribute as a solid member of the rotation, even if he's no longer the ace of the staff.

[Ohtaniland]

If he can't increase his velocity he's going to get shelled but no one on the Angels management team will ask him to retire or accept a buyout. Both he and Wilson (starters) are eating $36M while neither is healthy makes it tough to compete. Every time Arte opens up his wallet on players he ends up getting shafted at some point.

[Stradling]

If he can't increase his velocity he's going to get shelled but no one on the Angels management team will ask him to retire or accept a buyout. Both he and Wilson (starters) are eating $36M while neither is healthy makes it tough to compete. Every time Arte opens up his wallet on players he ends up getting shafted at some point.

If only it happened to other teams and wasn't just isolated to the Angels.

[Ohtaniland]

If only it happened to other teams and wasn't just isolated to the Angels.

Strad, we all love Weaver and we were all on board for Wilson (we didn't have any lefty starters at the time) but guys like Weaver and Wilson in their current situations can derail a season because what it cost to let them walk. There's no way Arte pays them both out if they suck this year.

[Stradling]

CJ will be here all year if he isn't traded. Weaver will be the one that will be gone, one way or another.

[tdawg87]

Given how both Weaver and Wilson pitched over the course of their contracts I'd say they were both well worth it. I'm going to guess Arte feels the same.

[eaterfan]

Given how both Weaver and Wilson pitched over the course of their contracts I'd say they were both well worth it. I'm going to guess Arte feels the same.

Why do you say Wilson was well worth it? His WAR over the course of his whole contract has been about 4. That's really terrible compared to the market rate. Even if you don't like WAR he's had a below league average ERA plus in all but one year with the Angels. Add to that the lack of innings he's pitched when healthy and how often he's been injured I don't think it's easy to make that case.

[tdawg87]

Why do you say Wilson was well worth it? His WAR over the course of his whole contract has been about 4. That's really terrible compared to the market rate. Even if you don't like WAR he's had a below league average ERA plus in all but one year with the Angels. Add to that the lack of innings he's pitched when healthy and how often he's been injured I don't think it's easy to make that case.

Considering the "market rate" as you mentioned it $15 million per for an average lefty is about right. Certainly not a disaster.

He also hasn't been injured as much as you think. He made 31+ starts in each of his first 3 years here.

[zenmaster]

Regarding Weavers decline in MPH, what do pitching experts out there say about his mechanics? You'd think if he lost such velocity, someone would be able to point out a physical reason he lost so much. Is he doing something differently? Or same mechanics as always just no ooomph?

[AngelsLakersFan]

Why do you say Wilson was well worth it? His WAR over the course of his whole contract has been about 4. That's really terrible compared to the market rate. Even if you don't like WAR he's had a below league average ERA plus in all but one year with the Angels. Add to that the lack of innings he's pitched when healthy and how often he's been injured I don't think it's easy to make that case.

 

What are you looking at? fWar has him at 7.5 and RA9-War at about 7. He's been worth about $50 million, and if he has a good year he could approach the total value of his contract. Obviously he has not worked out well, but far from a disaster. 

[linedriver]

Or he can collect 18 million and ride the pine, then retire in luxury.  Hmmm hard choice.