Jeremy Berg update

[Angel Oracle]

63.1 innings at SLC so far in 2013: 57 hits, 54/13 Ks/BBs, only 3 HRs, 1.10 WHIP, 2.27 ERA 

 

So, how are Gutierrez and Stange getting chances here, but not a guy having a kick a__ season so far?

 

Darren O'Day, Chaz Bradford and Brad Ziegler didn't throw hard either, but they had success as submariners at the MLB level.

Did we not learn our lesson when leaving O'Day as a rule 5, and then his making the AL All-Star team?

 

Is Dipoto hung up on having every reliever touch at least mid-90s?   Doesn't do any good when they only have one pitch.   Dipoto, meet Billy Koch, the king of the 100mph failures.

[Stradling]

Because they want to lose, duh!

[tomsred]

Ever heard the term "Sacrificial Lambs."

[Angel Oracle]

They do come in handy when trying for a top 10 draft pick.

[ettin]

63.1 innings at SLC so far in 2013: 57 hits, 54/13 Ks/BBs, only 3 HRs, 1.10 WHIP, 2.27 ERA 

 

So, how are Gutierrez and Stange getting chances here, but not a guy having a kick a__ season so far?

 

Darren O'Day, Chaz Bradford and Brad Ziegler didn't throw hard either, but they had success as submariners at the MLB level.

Did we not learn our lesson when leaving O'Day as a rule 5, and then his making the AL All-Star team?

Is Dipoto hung up on having every reliever touch at least mid-90s?

 

Is there a reason to start his service clock to come up to the Majors on a team that is out of contention?

[Angel Oracle]

Except that why would it start his clock, when the first season being partial doesn't count towards the clock anyway?

Trout was called up in 2011, yet his clock wasn't affected.   He's still arb eligible after 2014, and FA eligible after 2017. 

 

Maybe he isn't what this makes it out to be.   They won't know unless they give him a chance.

He is 27 with 4 years minor league experience plus 4 years of college ball.

[gotbeer]

I find it funny that AO blaming Dipoto for not calling up someone that isn't a flamethrower, when all season he's been complaining that Weaver among others don't throw hard enough and we need more flamethrowers.

[Scott34]

Is there a reason to start his service clock to come up to the Majors on a team that is out of contention?

 

I thought it didn't matter once you were past May?

[m0nkey]

I doubt service time has anything to do with it. Why even bother with service time with a reliever?

[ettin]

I thought it didn't matter once you were past May?

 

Players accumulate service time every single day they are in the Major Leagues. Here is a link: http://www.fangraphs.com/library/principles/contract-details/service-time-super-two/

[Stradling]

They are trying to tank so they can draft Wiggins.

[m0nkey]

Players accumulate service time every single day they are in the Major Leagues. Here is a link: http://www.fangraphs.com/library/principles/contract-details/service-time-super-two/

He's talking about service time impacting free agency

[Angel Oracle]

I find it funny that AO blaming Dipoto for not calling up someone that isn't a flamethrower, when all season he's been complaining that Weaver among others don't throw hard enough and we need more flamethrowers.

Only when Weaver was touching 85, once he was back up to 87-90, he was back to his dominant self.

It's not good having a bunch of soft tossers in the pen, just as it's not good having just flamethrowers especially when they don't have a 2nd pitch.

 

Balance is always a good idea, to keep the batters off balance.

It just seems that Dipoto ONLY wants flamethrowers in his pen, without taking into account if they have a solid 2nd pitch.

Teams will just sit back and wait for fast ball after fast ball if that's all the bullpen generally throws.

Imagine facing a crafty submariner guy like a Berg one inning, then someone like Morin the next inning with his heat and changeup. 

[Mark68]

Is there a reason to start his service clock to come up to the Majors on a team that is out of contention?

Nope. Invite him to spring training and see if he sticks.

[jsnpritchett]

I doubt service time has anything to do with it. Why even bother with service time with a reliever?

 

Exactly.  Especially a 27-year old one.

[ettin]

Exactly.  Especially a 27-year old one.

 

Considering that the budget is tight I see no reason to start his service clock, pay him the big league miinimum simply to pitch when we are out of contention. It all adds up, even the little stuff.

[monkeywithahalo]

Service clock? Really? How about finding out if he can get big league hitters out? In case you haven't noticed, the Angels don't have many relievers that can do that right now. If they are desperate enough to call up no names like Stange, what is the harm in seeing what Berg can bring?

 

He has a different style than the rest of the relievers which can actually be a good thing since it forced opposing lineups to adjust instead of facing a parade of guys with iffy control who through 95 MPH with a lousy slider. Maybe Berg sucks. Maybe he doesn't. The games now are meaningless so there is no better time to audition him or anyone else with even a hint of being big league ready relievers. Considering Dipoto's philosophy on not paying premiums for relief pitching, you'd think he'd be more eager to see what these cheap sources of bullpen help can do.

[ettin]

Service clock? Really? How about finding out if he can get big league hitters out? In case you haven't noticed, the Angels don't have many relievers that can do that right now. If they are desperate enough to call up no names like Stange, what is the harm in seeing what Berg can bring?

 

He has a different style than the rest of the relievers which can actually be a good thing since it forced opposing lineups to adjust instead of facing a parade of guys with iffy control who through 95 MPH with a lousy slider. Maybe Berg sucks. Maybe he doesn't. The games now are meaningless so there is no better time to audition him or anyone else with even a hint of being big league ready relievers. Considering Dipoto's philosophy on not paying premiums for relief pitching, you'd think he'd be more eager to see what these cheap sources of bullpen help can do.

 

I'm not sure why you are so indignant on the idea that a Major League Baseball team has a budget to manage? They could call him up for the normal cup of coffee but that means he might not be on the roster to start the season.

 

Just because he's a reliever doesn't mean that the front office doesn't want to keep him around as long as they are able too. In fact if he is that good then they DEFINITELY want to retain his services as long as possible.

 

You never know which reliever is the next Rivera/Papelbon/Shields type that stays with the club for multiple years because they have reliable, healthy arms.

 

In case you haven't noticed the season is over. If they call him up for a look, great! If not I TOTALLY understand and appreciate that we are saving him for the full season next year.

[Scott34]

I get and respect the point, Ettin, but are we really worried about Jeremy Berg's 34-year-old season?

[austin724]

Let him come up in Sept and see what he has. Then make a decision for next season.

[Second Base]

Berg would need to be added to the 40-man, but I'd be willing to give it a shot.  I mean 92 mph over the top isn't working, why not try a guy throwing 85 from the side?

[jsnpritchett]

Dump Stange or Brasier, then there's room on the 40-man.

[ettin]

I get and respect the point, Ettin, but are we really worried about Jeremy Berg's 34-year-old season?

 

To be honest I really don't care personally but to suggest, as monkeywithahalo did, that service time and team budget doesn't matter because Berg is a reliever is just not realistic. Every player matters.

[monkeywithahalo]

I'm not sure why you are so indignant on the idea that a Major League Baseball team has a budget to manage? They could call him up for the normal cup of coffee but that means he might not be on the roster to start the season.

 

Just because he's a reliever doesn't mean that the front office doesn't want to keep him around as long as they are able too. In fact if he is that good then they DEFINITELY want to retain his services as long as possible.

 

You never know which reliever is the next Rivera/Papelbon/Shields type that stays with the club for multiple years because they have reliable, healthy arms.

 

In case you haven't noticed the season is over. If they call him up for a look, great! If not I TOTALLY understand and appreciate that we are saving him for the full season next year.

 

Set aside the fact that I'm fairly certain that calling him up now actually has no impact on his service time (I believe that is why the Rays called up Myers when they did as the cutoff had already passed). I'm indignant because you are pinching pennies on one of the most fungible assets in baseball. Berg has a low ceiling. At best, he becomes Darren O'Day and makes $4 million per year in free agency when he is 34 FREAKING YEARS OLD!

 

The line that you never know which reliever is the next Rivera/Papelbon/Shields is patently false. These aren't guys that just fall out of trees. Pedestrian minor league relievers don't become elite relievers for years on end. So why worry about saving one or two million bucks over his arbitration years which won't start until three year from now when you are trying to win a World Series in the immediate future? That is pocket change to a team with the spending power of the Angels. The odds of a guy like Berg even being in the majors long enough to see his arbitration years are small to begin with. But on the off chance he turns out to be decent, the Angels will have figured it out now during a period where it doesn't hurt them if he turns out to be awful. That has value in its own right. If that costs them an extra two or three million in a few years, then I would argue that it is more than worth it (and again, I don't think there are service clock repercussions this late in the season). The same goes for just about any other of their fringe prospect guys. Call up Shoemaker. Recall Roth. Keep Green in the lineup somewhere when Howie gets healthy. Start Calhoun every single day. Call up anybody that they think might be able to help the 2014 team now and see if they can hack it. The only good thing about the Angels being horrible is that it has granted them two months of free evaluation time for their young players.

 

Now, if we were talking about a high end talent like Cron (not that he's ready, just an example) then maybe you have a point because the future money it costs is several times higher. But even then, for a team that intends to contend in 2014, it should be a minor concern. Budget control is great, but flags fly forever.

[Angel Oracle]

I get it, he's not one of Dipoto's guys.

Come on Dipoto, swallow the da_n pride!