floplag

2 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

He didn't want to be known as the guy who traded Shohei.

 

Which is understandable.

 

It's hilarious to find a way to look far worse than that.

No, it isnt understandable at all, its cowardly.
ANY other plater, literally any one on the planet, in a walk year that your not sure you could sign you trade them, it happens every off season how many times?  its what should have been done with him.
Its a 30 second explanation, we werent sure we could resign him so we did what was best for the club.  Period, its over, move on. 
No one would have faulted him for it, no one. 

1 minute ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Was thinking about this over the last few days.

You can't fault Moreno or other owners for not having the money to compete with the Dodgers (and to a lesser extent the Yankees, Mets, etc). Any more than I can compete with people eicher than me.

That being said, if he's unable or unwilling to, he needs to sell to someone who is. Period. 

Merely holding on because you want to own something is fine if it doesn't effect anyone else. But not having rhe ability to compete is shitty for both the fan base and the org.

I was talking to a few Dodger fans the other day, and I hated to admit this (to them or anyone else), but I saw firsthand the transition from the Angels being a team that marquee guys were trying to get traded to to a team that guys weren't interested in coming to. And it wasn't due to money.

It isnt about faulting him for not competing with the Dodgers.. its about not knowing he could or what the situation was and acting accordingly. 
He should have known what it would take
He should have known if he was willing to do that
He should have  made differing choices if he wasnt completely aware of all those things. 
he should have sold the club last off season, he should have traded Ohtani at that same time.
He consistently made the wrong choice at every turn from a baseball perspective.
Yes i 100% can fault him for that. 
Hes the reason people dont want to come here going back to the last dodger trade fiasco.. hes looked like a monkey fucking a football ever since. 

19 hours ago, Stradling said:

No one is going to stop following the team if they sign Bauer. If the Angels sign him and someone on here says they are no longer going to follow the team then they should probably be shown the door here as well. 

This
Itys a virtual guarantee that people/players you like are equally as potentially depraved, the only difference is you dont know about it. 
The man was proven innocent, he deserves a chance, the rest is nonsense. 

so.. he wouldnt trade him, then wouldnt pay what it took?  either he was totally out of touch with the costs or just didnt have the balls 

if they want our money, they owe us something.
Explanation may be b ad word but if your going to hit people up for season seats and tickets sales etc... you kinda do have to sell it a little, eayh. 

Its passed.
Everyone wants pitching, hes arguably maybe the best available and should come cheaper and lower risk. 
Not everyone that plays the game is a great human being in every possible way, i dont care if hes a freak in the bedroom thats not my bussiness. 

On 12/9/2023 at 2:18 PM, stormngt said:

I would blame him.  He signed his contract.  He is getting his money that signed for.

Stop.. this is such a copout... you think he signed expecting this?   

Just now, Stradling said:

And if you were him would you go to the players union asking to restructure your deal so you can be traded?  

I would ask whoever whatever to try to facilitate it, yes. 
Be honest, would you blame him for wanting out?  Would literally anyone in the game?
Were a laughing stock right now, theres no other way to put it. 
 

Well thats madness... as much as i wanted to keep him im glad we didnt do that and i want no part of a contract like that.
Im angry at how badly thing whole thing has been mismanaged, but not that we didnt pay that. I wish him luck.
Now we get to see what Arte and Parry are truly worth over the next couple months. 

Honestly, if im him, i ask for a trade.
If they dont pull miracles out of thier arse for the rest of this off season, come ST im asking out. 
I would not blame him at all for doing so. 

i dont really care.. he failed us.  He came in all talk of taking over LA and in the end put business over results and fucked us out of a once in a lifetime player.
That having been said im glad we didnt do 70M AAV, but IMO it never should have come to that.  He should have been extended or traded a year ago and been done with it.
This embarrasses me as a lifetime fan of this franchise so youll forgive me if i dont care how Arte feels. 

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

Yes of course depth guys move the needle in the standings. Snell, Gray, Yamamoto, are all very good starting pitchers that move the needle.  Burnes, Glasnow, Cease and Bieber are all on the trade block and will move the needle. Even guys like Flaherty and Giolito (with a reasonable bounce back) would be better than starting guys we had starting games at times last year. 
I mean this with all due respect, you tend to discredit good players because they aren’t great or because they are highly paid. 

Strad, Snell, Gray, and Yamamoto are not "depth" guys and not what im talking about.  You know that.  This class is deep with depth, a ton of 3, 4, 5 guys... very few 1s and 2s.   Those 3, 4, 5 arent moving that needle, weve been there done that how many times now?  You are aware of the common definition of insanity yes? 

Do i discredit over payed players, yes i do, especially at positions that continue to lose value year after year in this game as it evolves.   Even moreso when it cripples a team from doing more things it needs to do.  If we didnt let tit do that, i wouldnt care, but we do so it changes everything. 

You want to know who i would overpay, easy... trade for Soto.   Make a move like that that helps every night for 9 innings.. not every 5th or 6th for 5. 

49 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I don’t think it’s that bad of a free agent class. I think it has a ton of starting pitching depth. It lacks depth in offensive free agents. 

Also true, but "depth" guys arent moving the needle or the standings are they?  At the top of this class is a very small number of difference makers, the players we actually need, and none of them are free of concerns.  There isnt really a signle guy in the class that was spotless. 
Were in a tough spot, over pay for marginal players and not enough on the farm to make significant trades without taking bad contracts. 
But, we did this to ourselves, no one to blame but the front office lack of intensity in previous years. 

Heres the thing, this is a bad FA class... there isnt a single Guarantee in it including Ohtani.
Its the worst possible time to go ham, but its still also our only option. 
ANY other year i wouldnt want any part of any of these guys, but the fact remains they are the top options at the position so, if not them, who?
I personally still think it would be smarter to go other directions, i just dont think the game justifies over paying or trading on SP anymore, but most here would disagree. 
Heres the thing, youre going to have to choose, you want pitching, great, these are your options as we dont have the farm to pull off too many miracle trades. 

58 minutes ago, Blarg said:

They cannot afford both without sacrificing every other roster spot.  So you have a Cy Young quality pitcher with no bullpen support or defense and a DH with holes in the offense. Sounds like another 75 win season.

It's one or the other and I think Snell moves the Angels toward competitiveness more than the Unicorn. 

Sure they can, its more of a will Arte pay the tax question, as usual, and if hes not willing to then hes wasting everyones time and should rebuild and trade everyone.
The time fore half measures is passed, its go ham or go home 

1 hour ago, jsnpritchett said:

I don't really have a strong feel yet on what they're going to do, but since a few of you have mentioned Candelario, I'll just say that I hope it's not him.  He's a poor man's Drury with less positional flexibility.  If he's the big free agent signing this off-season, that's a bad sign for '24.

I agree, yet so far he and Anderson are the only ones were rumored to have actually spoken with so... make of that what you will. 

As to the actual question... I think Candelario is likely the first, maybe Anderson though im not at all fond of that move... as to the biggest, many right now i just dont know.  Hoskins maybe, someone like that.

Im not super high on our possibilities right now if im being honest.  I think we will struggle to sign top guys i really do they have no reason to want to come here right now so we will have to overpay. 

Part of me still thinks the smart move is a rebuild, but the club says thats not an option so... I think trying to make so bold trades might be the best option... talk to SD about Soto, maybe even Kim.  Take salary that way versus big signings.

I dont think Ohtani would ever be the first... hes going to want to see what else we do before even considering a return. 

13 hours ago, Stradling said:

We have the pieces to go get Burnes but not Cease.  But it really comes down to what do the Brewers want.  If they want guys like Sandoval or Ward or would they rather take some teams legit prospects, I don’t know.  

Would you guys consider trading Shanuel for a guy like Burnes or Soto, guys with only one year worth of control?  

Shanuel right now is a guy that plays a position that you need power from, especially if you are not getting it from other places, and hes lacking in it.  Now he may develop it, but right now its not there.  Especially for Soto who could be a legit difference maker.
I dont think the club would, but i would. 

This was true literally 6 months ago.  We were the only ones that apparently didnt see it... well the front office anyway. 

This feels like the most halo deal ever... a signing a guy that had a worse year than what we already have and paying him more than what we pay the guys we have.
I dont see the sense in this one at all... whatever it is they think they see i hope it works out as thats a large chunk to pay for what could be a downgrade. 

17 hours ago, UndertheHalo said:

Shut up nerd 

This place never fails... lol 

Personally, im mixed.  No question there is a ton of baseball knowledge there and perhaps more importantly the ability to impart it, obviously good things, but also a lot of baggage.  I wasnt psyched about when i read it due to a lot of that the idea but thats moot now so ill support him.
I do think it likely speaks well to the overall direction.
Well see where it goes from here. 
I will say this, those who are ok with some of the baggage issues around him should be the same about other players as well. 

I think this is a subpar class as a whole and the quality will get hugely over paid due to lack of depth. 
Worst possible time to be buyers, and yet thats still our only path. 

Baseball and the MLB media have no one to blame but themselves... the foam at the mouth constantly talking about the same teams while ignoring the bulk of the league so when the also rans have success they generated no interest in them.
MLB network might as well be YES 2 most of the time when it should be going out of its way to talk about the entire league.. but that doesnt help their ratings, and thats all that matters even when they shoot themselves in the foot 

Im glad to see them there if for no other reason than to reward the effort they made and the money they spent. 
It was for them the only path to it in the short term, as is the case for us, and they took it whereas we did not. 
I will pull for them to win it all at this point frankly for that same reason, they deserve it for the effort made.