ten ocho recon scout

Agreed. Pujols likely was. Along with just about everyone else. People always forget that pitchers were on the gear just as much. I'm not defending juicers. That said, for every pujols, arod, etc, there's hundred of guys that used the exact same drugs that never got passed triple A.

I personally think that story got blown out of proportion, and his agent is at fault, not the team. (And I'm not saying it to defend the team). I think his agent was more interested in buying a new car than 'taking care of' trout. Pujols had a grudge against st louis for waiting so long to offer him a contract. The reason was because for years he was a beast there, and he was being paid well below his market value. That's because his agent took the first low ball offer that st lou made, which 'underpaid' pujols (per the market), but made his agent very rich. I think trouts agent was doing the same. Lets say the angels said 'here you go kid, 120 million over 7 years! We'll buy out your pre arb years and then some!' 3 years from now, trout is making less than a bunch of other guys and is pissed because he's locked into it. But his agent just made 12 million. Just my two cents.

Here's the thing about rubbing his agent the wrong way. His agent gets paid when trout does. His agent wanted to cash in as much for himself as he did for trout. Just about every first year player knows they have to wait. Its a business. How often have we heard an agent complain to the media about a first year player not getting a big bump? Trout may very well be pissed, who knows. That said, I'm pretty sure the older guys he's been around for two yearsnow (not to mention all the guys he's talked to from other teams) have let him know they had to wait too.

Exactly. As far as dipoto, no one here can say exactly how much influence arte had in the big ticket signings. Everyone wants a scapegoat. The chatwood deal looks bad now, that's probably the worst one. That said, burnett got hurt...that's no ones fault. Aybar was hurt the first month. Weaver broke his arm. Vargas has a blood clot. Bourjos...etc etc. Thats not a bad gm. As far as saying 'sosh can only play what he's got', it works both ways. Dipoto inherited a team with holes, and a very weak farm system. We already had little to trade when he got here. Blanton was horrible. No defending that. santana is horrible now in retrospect. I wanted to keep him, but most here (and I'm sure on the team) thought he was a headcase that was done. I was against hamilton, I wanted anibal sanchez. But nobody saw this coming. And again, I'd say moreno was a lot more behind that (and pujols) than dipoto.

Disagree. (Not thay pujols never juiced). But judging an athlete from his 20's (restosterone peaking) to his 30's (test lowering, metabolism slowing) is just speculative. I still work out religiously, but am nowhere near the shape I was when I was still one of uncle sams misguided children. You don't see the same gains in your later years. If you're gonna look at body shapes, its the opposite. Guys in their late 30's and 40's who still have muscle mass and low body fat....that's usually an indicator (prescribed test)

If you switched cabrera to the angels and trout to detroit, I'm doubting trouts numbers dip. I'm betting cabreras do.

but kaz is making a comeback right now, per the other thread.So the key is to trade for hellikson in 4 years.

I opened this pretty much expecting to see the end of godfather where everyone gets knocked off while al pacino is at his kids baptism. But it would be other teams, not moe green. The heads of the 5 other divisions.

I'm asking because I don't know the answer. But lets say one of these guys gets a prescription for low testosterone? Is he covered in terms of the testing? If so, I would imagine that would be a huge loophole some guys are gonna exploit.

Put it like this, when people get arrested with a crack pipe in their pocket, do you think they started smoking that day?

'H' does more for performance than some of you want to believe. To add to it, its generally not used by itself... HGH is naturally occurring (like test). Your body naturally produces it, which in turn leads to certain functions (like test). Adding more to your body than you are naturally producing (like test) will increase those certain functions... Steroids are still very misunderstood by the majority of the general public. They serve the same purpose as hormone therapy for women. The reason they aren't as accepted (historically) is because women usually got them from a doctor due to menopause and related conditions, where as men got them from some guy at the gym for cosmetic purposes. That said, they do plenty more than simply 'build mass'. This is the part which is misunderstood by the general public. Personally, I agree with the above posyer who said most players have used ay some point. I would alter it a bit though to say maybe its not most (currently), but its FAR more than what we as fans know about. In terms of guys like arod, manny etc.....they were caught twice (or 3 times). Think mlb just got lucky and tested right when they used their first time? Manny didn't even get caught with juice, he got caught post cycling....thay should be a good sign about how on the ball the actual testing was.

I thought this thread was celebrating trout walking?

its because of how smooth the head and shoulders with old spice has made his hair.we should get brut cologne to merge with pert plus, and sign trumbo. Problem solved.

Pittsburg is already very good. Trumbo is flawed, but so is alvarez. But those two and mccutchen in the same lineup, paired up with the pitching they have (at the big league level) could make them a very strong team this october. I don't know as much about their prospects as you giys, but I'm sure they could field better offers for their top arms (prospects). That said, where trumbo becomes enticing is his money/club control. So whereas pittsburg could probably do better, the better but still aggorsable bats probably aren't available (as trumbo probably is). pittsburrg could stand pat, but they also may see how close they are right now, and may figure they could regress a bit next year (if the pitching isn't as good as it is right now).

meg ryan was a filthy hooker in that movie.

yep, been waiting to hear of something like this. Theuve got a bunch of cheap players under control, phenom pitching but still a very weak offense. Theyve got the depth to trade from, and a power bat for them may be all that's needed to guarantee its them and st lou in october, not Cincinnati. If the angels could get back one of their better pitching prospects, this could be a great deal foe both sides.

If the above is true, then the cards owe this to us.

I agree thay some on here overrate him. But you're undervaluing him.Power will always have a market, especially post peds. trumbo is still under club control for two years or so...compare his numbers to jay bruce, then note bruce is making a lot more. If the angels are good with trading trumbo, there's more than a few teams thay will offer something valuable in return.

I'm more with 61 than 73. That said, scotty makes a good point (about competition). People seem to gloss over the fact bonds and company got caught....many more were doing it bit didn't...and they still couldn't keep up. And sure, we can throw out the rave card. But what about the pitchers who were geared up? I imagine the stamina provided through a needle probably added some bite in the second half of the season, not to mention the velocity over the entire 6 months. I hate bonds. But he wasn't some anomoly. The whole league was juicing. It sucks for the historic players, its not fair. But again, its an absolute fact that the modern era is far more competitive, a big part of it being the integration of races.

at least the initial bobble he could have.

bourjos (when playing) has been great. But the majority of those games came in april...when only he and trumbo were hitting. Even trout was pretty 'average' that month. But more importantly, weaver was out, vargas looked horrible, and blanton was....vernon wells on the mound.

Yep, she's a tweak. Weird that a stripper with the sudden spending power of an mlb players bank account would mess with any hard drugs though...weiiiird.

I loved Lack when he was here, was pissed when he left (because of where he went and what he had to say). That said.....who here hates hamilton? Didn't he leave and go to a rival, then trash the fanbase? Its identicle. FWIW, I've run into Lack a few times via mutual friends. I obviously am not friends with the guy, but its been on more than one occasion. My short exposure to him made me quit hating him. He was very friendly fwiw. Through the same mutual friends I was told a little different story about some of the news the media (especially in boston) that's been written (though the people who told me are biased for him). As far as him getting fired up on the mound, and showing his emotions....isn't weaver pretty similar? Weav is our hero, and he's always been a 'good guy'. But if he left somewhere for better money, we'd probably remember that detroit game a little differently. (And for the record, I love weaver). Just my two cents.