FabulousFabregas

REPEAL and REPLACE Mike Scioscia.

1 minute ago, fan_since79 said:

FF should be banned for that.

 

Thank you Weave for being the leader of our pitching staff for a decade, and for being a key part of 4 division winners.  I've had your jersey for 7 years, and will proudly continue wearing it to Angels game.  Hope you have a rebound year in San Diego.

Lackey no doubt deserves to be in the Angels Hall of Fame when he retires.  He was the one constant presence (outside of Figgins) during that 2002-2009 Golden Era run, and won the single biggest game in the history of this franchise, and he's continued to be a winner since leaving.  I get that he left here on bad terms and he can be an asshole, but people here are way too hard on him for what he contributed to this franchise.

Hire A-Rod to replace the Fat Man.  He knows what's up.

Sucks.  Love going to games when Shoe is pitching, dude works quick, probably the most enjoyable pitcher to watch this season.

Fat Man's too busy lobbying for the creation of a CERA-VP for Mathis.

Kiss jail goooodbyeeeee!

6 minutes ago, arch stanton said:

That last sentence might be the most asinine one ever written in this forum. 

You don't think Scioscia has had too much influence on this franchise?

3 minutes ago, Stradling said:

I think that 2008 and 2009 we had great teams that should have won, but once again we had Fuentes as the closer.  I personally didn't care for him.  

As for 2015, I can't agree since the team had a below average offense and a below average pitching.  

I don't think 2015 was some incredible team, but they were literally one win away from a Wild Card spot.  If Dipoto had still been GM at the deadline, we could have actually made a real move that would have gotten us over the hump.  Unfortunately Scioscia's meddling didn't allow Dipoto to properly do his job, so he was forced to quit.

7 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Do you honestly believe it is Scioscia's fault they got swept or lost that playoff series?  Understand your memory might not be what you think it is, since you thought Hamilton batted clean up when he actually hit 7th.  Do you give credit Scioscia credit for Mile Trout?  Since you're going to say no, then how can you blame him for being a non factor in the playoffs?

It's the Fat Man's fault Hackilton played all three games.  I don't directly blame him for that series loss though, but I do solely blame him for the Angels missing the playoffs in 2011 and 2012.  Like I've mentioned, he also deserves a share of the blame for 2015 as well.

Going back to 2008 I think he is directly to blame for that ALDS loss for calling for the suicide squeeze.  If he was managing in New York or Boston he might have been fired for that.

I think if Dipoto had been able to name his own manager in 2012 like he would have preferred, we'd have had playoff appearances in 2012 and 2015.

Just now, Stradling said:

Cool I like this version of you where you use facts instead of being wrong and creating facts out of opinion.  This year is the perfect year to look at payroll and understand a team with high payroll can be flawed.  

In 2000 we were 18th, and in 2001 21st payroll wise.  Different expectations.

We've had flawed teams for 6 of the last 7 years with high payrolls, with a very flawed manager.

6 minutes ago, Stradling said:

All teams are at their highest payrolls in franchise history in recent years. 

The Angels are the 7th highest this year, and are one of only 8 teams with a payroll of over 140 million.

In 2011 and 2012 the Angels had the 4th highest payroll.

In 2000 we were 18th, and in 2001 21st.

9 hours ago, Stradling said:

You'll be happy to know in the time frame Jeff pointed out 1990-present the Angels have had six managers.  So they obviously we're also looking for and found their "higher success rate".  

During the Fat Man's time with the Angels the Giants have had 3 managers.

10 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

I used to cover the Giants before the Angels. Take a look at their ups and downs...

1990-96, missed the playoffs 7 years in a row.

1997-03, made playoffs 4 out of 7 years, lost WS to Angels

2004-09, missed playoffs 6 years in a row, had an awful farm system and some awful, old teams which they converted into Tim Lincecum (no 10 pick), Madison Bumgarner (no. 10), Buster Posey (no. 4).

2010-present, won 3 WS

Point is the Angels are going through the same type of thing. It happens. Teams stink sometimes.

The Angels payroll creates different expectations.  Missing the playoffs 6 out of 7 years (and in the only year they made it getting swept) is unacceptable with the highest payroll in franchise history, especially when zero rebuilding has happened during this period to set us up for future success.

Dusty Baker wasn't offered a new contract after the 2002 World Series, and his replacement Felipe Alou was also let go.  Because of this, they got Bochy.  The Angels need a similar type of change at the top.

A-Rod should have had a retirement tour.  Tonight we could have given him a painting of him as a centaur with Scioscia as his ass.

Bring in GA to pitch.  He had better stuff than Nolasco on his ceremonial first pitch.

3 hours ago, Dochalo said:

how many of those 6 other teams should have made the playoffs relative to their talent level and didn't because of MS?  

definitely no for 2010, 2013 and 2016.  

Last year we were 85-77.  6 games better than our run differential.  The team overachieved last year in my opinion.  Last year was painful in that it was a massive tease, but they weren't very talented and their GM quit mid season.  

2011 - We had 86 wins finishing 2nd by 10 games and out of the WC by 5 games.  About even with our run differential and a terrible bullpen.  Not sure if another manager makes up 5 wins.  

2012 - 89 wins.  Finished 3rd.  5 game back of the division and 4 of the wild card.  Another awful bullpen.  To me, this was the 2nd best team in the last 7 years.  They had a real chance and I think they make it with a good pen.  Does giving Wells 262 plate appearances over an untested Calhoun make the difference?  Was it Trout missing the first 20 games due to his spring illness?  Or not letting richards start over a terrible Ervin Santana? Maybe.  If there was a year where one could argue the effect of MS on the team, this is it, but I still don't think he means the difference.  

 

2012 we would have made the playoffs with another manager.  We ultimately never got to see what Dipoto's vision would have fully been for the Angels since he never got to put in his own manager.  It was completely inexcusable to miss the playoffs with that roster, any other manager would have been fired.  Scioscia's bullpen management was terrible, as was him sitting Trumbo so much in the first month.  I remember going to a game where he brought in Scott Downs for 4 pitches, next pitcher blew the game.  I don't see how anyone can defend Scioscia keeping his job after 2012.  Trout, Pujols, Hunter, Weaver, Morales, Trumbo, etc.

2011 without Scioscia we would have had Napoli, and he wouldn't have been on Texas killing us.  Could have won the Wild Card.

Scioscia's ego and refusing to adapt to what Jerry wanted implemented in regards to analytics in 2015 led to a clash with Diptoto that led to Dipoto quitting, which hurt us at the trade deadline.  If we had gotten a legitimate left fielder at the deadline, we win a Wild Card spot.

2013 was just a shitty team, 2016 same deal.  But I just can't comprehend how anybody thinks he should keep his job after 1 playoff appearance (where we got swept) in 7 years with our payroll.

5 minutes ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

You missed the point. The point is that, although it's meaningless in the sense that the Angels have no chance to make the playoffs, it's still a Major League Baseball game that counts, players are still getting paid, fans are still paying to watch and they are still handling themselves like professionals. They aren't mailing it in or worrying about their own stats. (Wouldn't it have been better for Kole Calhoun if he'd just swung the bat and tried to pick up a hit and an RBI for himself, instead of walking?)

They are still playing the game right and that's a reflection mostly on them but also on the manager. 

The reason they stink is not because of Scioscia or any intangible "message" that people like to throw around. 

Its because all of their best pitchers are hurt. Period. 

The Angels have made the playoffs one time in the last 7 years.  That is completely unacceptable.

34 minutes ago, Stradling said:

Hey @FabulousFabregas when was the last time he stuck with a veteran too long when we had a better young option available in your eyes?

Josh Hamilton in the 2014 ALDS.

9 hours ago, Jeff Fletcher said:

Tonight in the 8th inning did you notice how hard Jett Bandy ran on a single? He had to slam on the brakes because he wanted a double. 

And did you notice in that same inning Kole Calhoun working a walk with 2 guys on, to load the bases for Trout?

They were down 7-0.

i notice this stuff all the time because my particular interest is always in getting the game over as soon as possible once the outcome is decided. So when some guy draws a 10-pitch walk at the end of a blowout (Andrelton Simmons on Saturday) I notice that stuff. 

It happens all the damn time. Trust me on this. 

To me, that is a team that still cares, is still trying and has not "tuned out" it's manager. They know Scioscia won't put up with that crap. 

Carry on....

The events of a meaningless game like last night mean nothing.  Games in Williamsport have more stakes than in Anaheim right now.  Like I've mentioned on here, The Fat Man has had a terrible track record in this decade of awful bullpen management and sticking with veterans too long when the games actually matter and we have competitive teams.  These techniques without a doubt cost us a trip to the playoffs in 2012, and I believe last year as well.  Hitting Josh Hamilton cleanup in the playoffs in 2014 was inexcusable as well.  Going back to 2011, his hard on for Mathis and hatred for Napoli may have cost us a playoff appearance that year as well.

He needs to be fired so that if we actually do have a contending team in the next couple of years, we don't have a manager with antiquated techniques and awful judgment.  Scioscia was once a good manager, but his time here should have run its course years ago.

He should stay as a broadcaster.  If he's a coach he'll get fired after a few years like most of Scioscia's recent staff.

4 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Don't we want them to lose at this point? 

Yes.  I'm in favor of the Fat Man staying on for the rest of the season because I think he can help us get to 100 losses.  After that he can be shitcanned.

Just now, Stradling said:

FF, what did Scioscia do wrong tonight?  Or yesterday?  Or the day before?  

The problems with Scioscia have dated back for at least 6-7 years now.  He has played a huge part in the downfall of this organization in the 2010's.