JcHc3in1

TJ Simers has moved his venom down the coast a bit.........
 
not sure why Simons always has to be so snarky and nasty.......
 
Arte Moreno is truly one of this world's good guys -- even if some of us disagree with some of the ownership/management decisions from time to time -- and I find his decisions to be usually right and almost always well thought out......
 
Simers -- consider the source.

Lol Simers

Seriously, this reeks of TJ being not asked to the prom...what a douchebag

Simers seems like a psycho ex girlfriend. Let it go man what is your beef with Arte. He wants nothing to do with you it's his choice.

It's interesting that, for all the grousing about the writers' vote, we would have elected the same three men they did, and no more.

happybat4 -- yep, you are absolutely correct and I am completed wrong on that.
 
see, I told you the guys with Maddux got over-looked.........yeah, I was referencing Smoltz accomplishments not Glavine.
 
Maddux, Glavine and Smoltz all deserve to be in.......
 
thanks for pointing out my stupid mistake there.

Saw Jeff Fletcher's comments re Biggio........
 
Obviously, I disagree........name another player who made the ALL STAR team at THREE different positions (and had 3,000 hits and Biggio had something like 300 stolen bases plus fell just short of 250 HRs).
 
He's a first ballot guy in my book -- then there was his team leadership skills as well..........
 
Hope he makes it next year.

Glavine was never a closer. You are confused with Smoltz.

Just look at the voting for the All Star Game. That isn't a process I want for deciding who is enshrined at Cooperstown. Every Yankee of any significance would make the HOF.

The individual fan my be a sober thinking person but fans in general are idiots tied to the logo on their team gear and have no business making any decisions about who the best players are. The All Star game is a prime example of that.

If you need to reduce the impact of the fans, that tells you everything you need to know.  80% of the fans only vote for the uniform just like most political voters only vote for the letter after the politician's name. 

No way fans should get any touch of the vote.  Look at the All star game every year. 

I tend to disagree that the fans should have any say in this.  It's wrought with potential for manipulation and would be very difficult to police.  Doing away with the ten pick max and having some sort of oversight of the voters would be enough.  Perhaps make those honored to vote provide explanations as to why or why not they felt a player worthy of their vote.  If those explanations don't make sense to the powers that be at the HOF, then those people don't get to vote anymore.  I don't think the vote need be limited to the BBWA per se as well.  There are many ways to skin this cat and make it better so why not at least try. 

Absolutely.  I agree that there are most likely just a handful of outliers and I don't blame the BBWA whatsoever.  This is all on the HOF.  I actually have no problem with the BBWA being those that cast the votes but I would like to see the hall take a more active and ever evolving role in determining who gets to vote and who doesn't.  Hold the outliers accountable if possible.  Set the system up so there is as little room for error as possible. 
 
We have already seen potentially worth guys drop off the ballot so it may have already affected the intended outcome.  So I personally feel that changing the process or at least looking into it is worthwhile in order to minimize any further potential damage.  Just a bit more stringency would be welcomed and create a worthy corollary to the honor of being inducted.

And one more point... The Hall of Fame decides who votes and what the criteria are. Not the BBWAA.
We are doing this because they ask us to.
If they wanted anyone else to vote, they could have invited them at any point in the last 75 years.

What bugs me is the constant focus on the few outliers.
There were 571 voters and people are griping about 5 or 6 of them.
My guesstimate...
70 percent do an awesome job and put a lot of thought into it
25 percent are old timers who go too much by the "eye" and "feel" tests for my tastes but still mostly produce thoughtful ballots
5 percent have no business voting
There are plenty of ways you could tweak it and make it better but I don't think any of them will change the end result of who gets in the HOF because the biggest issue in that respect now is PEDs, and that will be divisive no matter who votes.

Those in charge of the Hall of Fame have to ask themselves what the ultimate goal is here. 
 
Is it that they want to ensure that all those worthy of being inducted get inducted?
 
Is the process by which this occurs important?  ie, is the history and tradition behind how this happens an important part of the process?  
 
To me, the first question is the most important.  You have to get it right.  
 
Jeff - you seem frustrated with the incessant complaining (and I am sympathetic of that), but most of those complaining just want all the right players to get in and they want the process to make that possible.  Right now, it doesn't seem optimized for that.  I think being able to vote for the hall members is a great honor and a privilege and it's a disservice to the fans, the hall of fame itself, the players, and in fact the other conscientious members of the bbwa that someone could cast their vote relative to the length of the ceremony.  
 
If everything remained as is, perhaps 10 years from now, it will all get ironed out, but with the way things are currently set, it may not and that would be unfortunate for a worthy player to be collateral damage of such. 
 
If the hall of fame values the tradition of the process as much as the players being inducted then so be it and I will move on, but my guess is that the purpose of this honor was never meant to be contingent on that. 

Jeff, your list looks pretty damn good.
Glad we have some smart writers covering our team. Not easy to say that for a lot of other teams.

Glavine undoubtedly got some bounce from pitching during the period when the Braves won 14 consecutive division titles and had one of the best starting staffs ever assembled. I believe that John Smoltz will get the same benefit next year - plus some of his most clutch performances came in October.

I'd say that's a pretty good list.

I think the 75 percent rule is sufficient to limit too many people getting in.

I'm all for including lots of other people in the decision so they can share some of the ridicule.
There will be questionable decisions by any group. Period.

I don't think there's any reason to have a limit of 10. I wanted to vote for 12. Those two lost votes could have made a difference to the outcome. In fact some people's lost votes would have gone to Craig Biggio. He only needed 2.

Ha.  Good.

I think there should be a mixture of those who cover baseball on a full-time basis, writers, broadcasters (Vin Scully doesn't get a vote, but then again neither does Hawk...so I guess that's a wash?), and maybe even those who work for baseball sites like BP, BB Ref, etc.