tomsred

9 hours ago, ScottSted said:

I know its a dead horse situation but Rendon 60 day IL for a bone bruise is insane

It's more than a bone bruise.  When you have internal bleeding your body has to absorb the lost blood.  Recently I saw a comment from a physician that said it's normally a 6-8 week week process just to have that happen, depending on the severity of course.  It can be a very dangerous situation if it continues.  The idea that he is stealing money from the Angels is absurd. Some of you guys have a twisted mind when it comes to significant injuries, like the person is somewhat inferior, dumb, or is faking it to get something without effort.  A nursing home must be way off limits for you.  

8 minutes ago, stormngt said:

SHANUEL MOVE IS AN ACT OF DESPERATION

So what, got to think out of the box when you suffer these amounts of injuries, and have less than a 1% chance of making the playoffs.  It's best to see what we have at this point in time than shut down completely with recycled veterans.  There is nothing to lose at this time.

Wow, quite the lineup, makes the game really fun to watch tonight.  Any one know what the shortest time a draft pick has taken to get to the MLB.  I( would guess maybe someone went immediately, I just never hear about that being done.

In my opinion, O'Hoppe not getting valuable MLB experience because he wants to be the ROY in 2024 is stupid.  The object of this game is for the team to win, not to collect awards for individual play.  That's the way we should be looking at Ohtani's situation as well.  He's already said that is his No. 1 priority.  If a player achieves greatness based on their individual performance that's wonderful (but secondary), but that's not the ultimate goal of this game.  I wouldn't want players who think otherwise.  All teams are probably infected with players who concentrate too much on personal accomplishments.  Think about it, maybe that's why the Angels aren't winning.  Doing the little things that produce wins are many times not glamorous, but they add up to success by winning when done right.

In this situation, I think O'Hoppe getting MLB experience in September is more important than ROY in 2024.

Personally I am excited about seeing the upside on Detmers.  He just needs to find more consistency  He almost no hit the best American League offense this year while they were hot.  That's pretty amazing!

It's so easy to jump to conclusions when you have limited personal data.  Deters is hot and cold, the consistency is not there - yet!  This is probably the case with most young players.  But I really, really like the potential when he gets on a run.  This is someone they shouldn't give up on.

Let's get hot, 31 wins to glory!

Could the reason be that they announced the decision 5 days ahead of the trade deadline be that it was a distraction to the players and coaching staff at the time. It was becoming a circus of speculation by outsiders to any discussions.  The sooner they put the distractions aside, and tried to get on with supporting the team with the personnel they had in place the better, time may have been of the essence.  Of course now we have the benefit of hind site, the team has lost too many games recently to be a serious contender, therefore it's easier to criticize the urgency of saying formally that they wouldn't trade him.

To me it was more of an effort by Minasian to say to the current staff and players, "Hey, look no one on the major league roster is going anywhere, I'm giving you all the additional help I can by signing veteran players, stay focused on winning games this year".  It's more of a I believe in you moment, not a poor or rash decision. 

42 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

He's been here 6 years, all of them the prime years of Trout and likely himself, too, plus Rendon, and his legacy thus far is "potentially the greatest player ever and the team is such a joke that they can't even make the playoffs". Maybe to actually have a better legacy, he needs to go somewhere else. 

Do you really believe that one player can make a difference, I don't.  Do you think the two players can make a real difference, I don't.  It takes at least 4-5 position players playing at their peak performance without significant injury  to create a successful year.  You also need a much stronger pitching staff (starters and relievers) than we currently have).

2 hours ago, Make Angels Great Again said:

Well. Things changed quickly in 2 weeks.

A trade deadline can do that to you, especially if you are active.

My grades on the players acquired so far (as of today):

Escobar - F

Moustakas - A

Giolito - C

Lopez - A

Cron - C

Grichuk - C+

Leone - B

1 hour ago, Angelsjunky said:

You got to feel for the guy. As much as the last couple weeks have sucked for us, we have (or can have) greater distance from the Angels, and it isn't our livelihood.  Perry lives and breathes the Angels, and really his whole career is riding on what he does in the next year or so. If he can't move the needle at all, I'm not sure he's going to get another GM job, at least not for awhile. Regardless of the various factors involved, the GM is still responsible for building a winning team. He has had three years, and is about to go 0-3, and that last plate appearance is a GIDP with one out and the bases loaded in the bottom of the 8th, down by a couple runs. If he can at least get 82 wins out of this year and break the losing season streak, I suppose we can say he's 0-2 with a walk. But he really needs a "hit" next year - not a great year, but one in which he either consolidates a winning season this year, or actually fields a contender into September.

In other words, I think Perry's bare minimum requirements for continuing his career as a GM beyond 2024 are 82+ wins this year, 87+ wins next. Or maybe <82 wins this year, but 90+ next. Not an easy task.

I think he has a legitimate shot at achieving those goals whether Ohtani stays or goes.  He works hard, seems to be really into into his job, is a good deal maker, and understands legitimate talent when he sees it.

23 hours ago, Chuckster70 said:

I know you're being sarcastic, but I don't think anyone here or on social media would call Neto a pussy.

Don't you know, anyone who gets hurt and doesn't play within 3 days is a pussy.  Just like you are a idiot manager and can't manage a bullpen if your relief pitcher gives up runs that lead to a loss.  Or as an owner you don't know what you are doing and you are a cheap meddler if you suggest signing a player, or won't spend well past the luxury tax.

One thing I don't see discussed enough about a possible Ohtani signing with another ream, players don't seem to build as strong a legacy if they play for multiple teams.  Maybe Trout has pointed this out to Ohtani, as I think this is what Trout believes for himself.  Pujols is an example of bailing out on your first team, and never becoming as established after that.  Examples the other way are Derek Jeter in NY, Garret Anderson (Garret did leave eventually but not until his productive years were done) and Tim Salmon with the Angels, and Ted Williams in Boston.  There are plenty of others to point at both ways.  Ichiro spent most of his productive career in Seattle.  Darvish moved around, now there is no connection to any one team.  Maybe in the end that won't matter to Ohtani, but I have to feeling he wants to build a legacy as much as win a World Series.

Let's hope Ohtani's legacy builds more tonight. 

19 minutes ago, Angelsjunky said:

As for injuries, clearly there's a correlation: More injuries = the worse a team does. Especially when it is two of your three best players, plus everyone else. And the numbers shared show that the Angels - at least right now - are more crippled than any other (good) team, and it isn't particularly close.

But...that doesn't let them off the hook for other things: a bad farm system, poor choices with free agency, etc. 

Your original list is really interesting.  What really sticks out to me is the Atlanta Braves - $182M payroll plus only $8M on the injured list.  No wonder they are so great.  How the hell do they do that?

3 minutes ago, DMVol said:

I don't think you can predict much without knowing what Arte's intentions are going to be regarding any sale....Will a sale back on the table this offseason? Does he want to keep the team indefinitely?  If he is keeping the team, at least for the foreseeable future, I would think Minasian is ok...Eppler got 5 years, just don't think he would axe Perry after 3.....

I agree with that take.  There are so many unknowns going forward, but they all start with what will Ohtani do?  I didn't particularly like Minasian at the beginning, but I've really warmed up to him.  When he got here the pitching was a mess, so he took drastic action by drafting all pitchers.  Then the offense and defense went to hell because of injuries and no depth, so he addressed the depth with veteran position players and trades.  Even though we have overwhelming injuries the offense is way better, particularly when players are healthy.  Now the pitching is back to sucking.  It's like that Whack-A-Mole arcade game where you pound moles into the ground when they pop up, then another one surfaces, and so on.  That's what the team's problems remind me of.  It's hard to be patient when your best player may go elsewhere, but I really believe Minasian is addressing problems as best and expeditiously as a GM can (even given the distraction of possible ownership sale).  There are good things happening, and at some point they will all start to click.  I would hate to start over at this point with a new organization, that would definitely add quite a few years to the process without any guarantee of success, and it could get much worse for a long time.

1 hour ago, Angel Oracle said:

Maybe not a smart defender.

He's whole level down from Taylor Ward on defense.

23 minutes ago, VladdyforHOF said:

I think a lot of fans would agree Estevez is not a lights-out closer. I’m not simply proposing this thought over 2 blown saves. His command is shaky outing to outing with that gorilla looking delivery. His mechanics look bad. Colorado didn’t want him closing. He fell into the closer role with this team when Quijada went down. Maybe Q wasn’t the guy either. Estevez had a nice run and we got the most out of him.

This bullpen changed more than we’ve seen a bullpen change in 100 games. But Estevez has kept the closer role through it all because of a perfect saves ratio, ignoring everything else. Why? It’s caught up to him and suddenly he’s a mediocre 23/25.

I think it’s not only better for the remainder of this season, whatever it means, but also going forward into 2024 to develop a new closer. 

Soriano could be an option. He’s got nasty stuff. His command is better. He’s tougher to homer off of. Just get it done.

Why not Matt Moore?

12 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

Pretty clear we're done. I think we have a few players that make enough money on expiring contracts that bad teams wouldn't claim. 

Who would be the first team to claim Ohtani? 

Sigh

Oakland, don't they have the worst record?

Oh, and I understand that you are done, but the team is not done.

5 minutes ago, ELEVEN said:

I would like for a professional pitching coach to work with him.

Sigh... there's always next year.

Maybe we'll hire one.

Like Micky Callaway, lol.

23 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

So, keep letting him give up leads in the 9th?

Meanwhile, Loup has become Poup again.

Loup's a free agent at season end, he won't be coming back.  Moore and Lopez are free agents as well, we want them both to come back.  With regard to Estevez, the next time put him in a non-stressful situation and see how he does.  He's a grownup person, he can understand the logic in that, I don't think it would be permanent.

11 hours ago, cjcinec said:

Moose is worth 20 Rendon’s which doesn’t add up to much. He at least shows up to work everyday while Rendon is limited to paydays. Good player but nothing that you should have in a complete rebuild which is what the next manager is facing. Why not use the roster spot for someone younger because nothing is going to happen overnight. 2024 is looking like an epic battle with the Athletics to stay out of the basement of the AL West. That’s not even close to an exaggeration.

You are living in a fantasy world if you really think the Angels will do a complete rebuild.  The only way that happens is if we get completely new ownership, and they want to take that on.  If that would happen (I don't think it will), I would think they would want to try a year of seeing what they have and how well they compete before going that route.  They would probably make baseball operations changes, and coaching changes first.

10 hours ago, DMVol said:

Played pretty well for Colorado in a limited number of games too....if he finishes strong, he's got a solid case for a decent one year deal, but I doubt he gets 2 years....if somebody offers him 2, you move on to somebody else, maybe Urshela, if he is healthy....

Regarding Urshella, when he went down that really hurt us in retrospect.  He was a good situational hitter.  I just don't know how impactful his injury will be on the rest of his career.  I haven't heard of that one happening much before.  I agree that a Moustakas deal should be for one year, and Urshella as well on a one year deal.  All that said, it assumes that we are going for it next year and not rebuilding.  Thirteen guys are on the free agent list for the Angels, some are easy discards, but how the ones that we want to keep get resolved will set up lot about what really happens to the 2024 roster.   

15 minutes ago, Mark68 said:

For those who had Estevez in your top 3. how do you feel about him now?

 

My 3 are Canning, Moore, Moniak

I feel terrible, this game was very, very depressing.  After reading what everyone else thinks, I would change mine today to Moniak, Moore and Neto.

25 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

The MINUTE Lopez returns!

Demote Choke Estevez the batting practice pitcher, and make Lopez the closer.

THREE FOUR run innings in TWO weeks!

Disgraceful!!!!

I don't think Nevin will do this, but he could move him as a setup guy for awhile as I think his confidence may be down and he may be tired.  He has thrown a lot of stressful pitches this year.  Before I would use him again, I would like a multi run lead, not in a one run situation.

Moore has been spectacular, use him as a closer for a bit, at least until Lopez returns.    I would want to see if he can handle closing effectively.  There is nothing to lose at this point.    

22 minutes ago, Skankhunt42 said:

I didn't see it, but "bloops" don't roll to the warning track.

It wasn't a bloop, kind of a soft line drive and Grichuk was too far towards center field going for a diving catch.  It zipped by him and got to the wall scoring two runs.