Is this a good trade?

[Brent Maguire]

I don't get how some people don't like this trade. 

 

The worst case scenario is Santiago and Skaggs end up being back end guys who are controlled for quite a while. Best case is Skaggs develops into a #2 and Santiago into a #3. Trumbo isn't going to improve at the age of 28. He is what he is. 

 

I'm ecstatic that Jerry got 2 pitchers with huge strikeout ability and are both young. 

[Angelsjunky]

I've been very critical of Jerry's trades in the past, but this is a very good, even excellent, trade.

[DW711]

The Angels won this trade (the most), the D-Backs lost and the White Sox got the best all around player.

Edited December 10, 2013 by DW711

[Lou]

Dipoto: "We're not done with our pitching staff by any stretch."

[Inside Pitch]

I know we need pitching, but Skaggs doesn't look that good to me and Santiago appears mediocre.

 

I know what Trumbo can do and we don't seem to have any impending replacements.

 

For those who like this, please tell me why.

 

If they both end up as nothing better than number fours or league average SPs -- that's still more valuable than a 1B with a sub .300 OBP.

Santiago has his warts, but he's also had success in the AL, and in one of the most homer happy parks in the league.   Like always the sample size has to be taken into consideration but outside of Chicago he's managed a 2,98 ERA overall and his WHIP away from Cellular Field is 1.236.  Maybe he's nibbling a little more at home to avoid giving up a cheap HR, I dunno -- but he's pitched nearly as many innings home and away for his career and all the away numbers are better.

 

He's always walked guys, but he's also limited hits and had the ability to K people.  He's also had success in the minors keeping the ball in the yard.

[Pujols4MVP]

Excited to see Skaggs back. He has #2 or even #1 potential.

At one time people believed Corbin was a #4 starter in the making.

 

The A's have done so well with a bunch of kids in their roster.

Perhaps the Angels should do the same by having guys like Skaggs & Green etc in there.

[RePLAY]

I must say...

 

people in the Angels facebook page are dumbasses.

[Brent Maguire]

I must say...

 

people in the Angels facebook page are dumbasses.

Same with the instagram/twitter pages. 

 

You read some of the comments and think we just traded Trout instead of Trumbo. 

[RePLAY]

half the folks probably just read the first 3 negative comments and piggy backed their opinions. LOL

[Inside Pitch]

The other reason that it's a great trade is that the team now actually has 5 pitchers capable of starting games instead of three.  The Angels won't be negotiating with FA's from a position of weakness and they can continue to look at trade options knowing they actually have a rotation with potential for upside.

 

Angels have gone from a team with three starting pitchers and limited payroll space to one with 5 and more payroll space.  Given the Angels situation, they couldn't have asked for a better turnaround.  I was terrified this team would trade HK and weaken the defense in favor of keeping the .300 OBP and to try to validate the Callaspo trade....   So for me, it's Xmas.

Edited December 10, 2013 by Inside Pitch

[bloodbrother]

The other reason that it's a great trade is that the team now actually has 5 pitchers capable of starting games instead of three.  The Angels won't be negotiating with FA's from a position of weakness and they can continue to look at trade options knowing they actually have a rotation with potential for upside.

 

Angels have gone from a team with three starting pitchers and limited payroll space to one with 5 and more payroll space.  Given the Angels situation, they couldn't have asked for a better turnaround.

 

Exactly this. Deal becomes even more of a slam dunk if Skaggs does live up to his potential.

[DW711]

I've seen Santiago pitch and he looks pretty good. I wouldn't be surprised if he has a 3.5 era next year. He's also a hell of a lot better than Trevor Cahill which would have been a dumb move by the Angels.

Skaggs...don't know

Eaton is solid, but they have Pollock. Which means they'll have Prado at 3rd and Trumbo in left.

Trumbo is the ultimate one-dimensional player and should not be on a national league team. At least it's not Coors.

[Reveille1984]

Most people are morons when it comes to the actual full value of a player, so seeing fans on Twitter and Facebook mouthing off is zero surprise.  My dad is one of those people.  The first thing I know he'll say to me the next time I see him is "can you believe the Angels traded Trumbo for some crappy pitchers!?!?  The guy hits 30 HR and is an RBI machine!"

 

There's also the narrarative of Trumbo growing up in the area and being one of those likeable, quiet, no-nonsense, nose to the grindstone type dudes.  There just comes a point where a guy is what he is, no matter how much you want him to succeed and grow as a player.  I like Mark as much as any Angels fan, but he is a highly replaceable asset that has probably already hit his maximum potential.  Our lineup is still going to consist of a lot of valuable offensive players, and I won't be surprised if we're still a top 5 offensive team.

[rangersfan#1]

Coming from an outside perspective. As a Rangers fan, I see this trade as a big win for you guys. You needed pitching and you just added 2 SP's that are young and under team control. Both Skaggs and Quintana are talented and have the chance to significantly upgrade your rotation. Trumbo is overrated. 

[Jay]

The pitchers we got aren't great but overall it's a good deal in exchange for Trumbo.  We wanted young SP and that's what we got.

[bloodbrother]

Coming from an outside perspective. As a Rangers fan, I see this trade as a big win for you guys. You needed pitching and you just added 2 SP's that are young and under team control. Both Skaggs and Quintana are talented and have the chance to significantly upgrade your rotation. Trumbo is overrated. 

 

They got Santiago, not Quintana. Quintana/Skaggs would have been crazy good, but as it stands, this is still a very good return for a player of Trumbo's caliber

[DW711]

Coming from an outside perspective. As a Rangers fan, I see this trade as a big win for you guys. You needed pitching and you just added 2 SP's that are young and under team control. Both Skaggs and Quintana are talented and have the chance to significantly upgrade your rotation. Trumbo is overrated. 

 

They got Quintana, too?!

[rangersfan#1]

They got Santiago, not Quintana. Quintana/Skaggs would have been crazy good, but as it stands, this is still a very good return for a player of Trumbo's caliber

Lol ohhh my mistake. 

 

Sorry to disappoint!

[dimitrig]

Was it a good trade? Not really. Yes, Angels needed pitching so it was good in that sense, but Trumbo will have a long career and it is not clear if either of these pitchers will ever pan out. The Vernon Wells trade keeps paying dividends!

[Torridd]

Thanks I appreciate the insights and feel better about this. I guess my main concern is not so much what we received but what we lost.

[Ohtaniland]

Is this a good trade? I believe it is a good trade for Trumbo. I think he will do great in the NL now that he's left Scioscia's island of misfit toys. Napoli 2.0

[bloodbrother]

Day later and more and more people are praising this move by the Halos

 

here's what BP said

 

Acquired LHP Tyler Skaggs from the Diamondbacks and LHP Hector Santiago from the White Sox as part of a three-team trade. [12/10]

The most pressing matter facing Jerry Dipoto this offseason was rebuilding a broken rotation. Spending more money seemed like an obvious—and, for poorer teams with the same needs—envious solution. But Dipoto unveiled his grand plan on Tuesday, and it was surprisingly cost efficient. Rather than pouring more funds into the free-agent market, he acquired two pre-arbitration starters for his first baseman and a minor-league starter with back-end aspirations.

Skaggs is the bigger name of the two heading to Anaheim, but to date Santiago has enjoyed more success in the majors. The squat left-hander doesn't look like an effective starting pitcher; however, he profiles as a no. 4 starter due to a deep arsenal. In addition to a low-to-mid-90s fastball, Santiago throws a changeup, curveball, cutter, and oft-referenced screwball, which he learned during winter league a few years ago. Quirky and deceptive mechanics improve his pitches—he lands closed and his arm works quick—but impact batters and Santiago alike. Given his wildness, it's possible he might fall out of the rotation over the long term. If so, Santiago's experience in the bullpen, including the ninth inning, could come in handy.

Now onto the headliner. Skaggs joins a Dipoto-run team for the second time in a trade involving the Angels and Diamondbacks. (The first time being 2010's Dan Haren trade.) His present stock is lower than it was then, and even lower than it was entering the season, when he was billed as a potential no. 2 starter. Skaggs struggled throughout the year and earned a spot in our Prospects Who Disappointed Ten Pack. It was there the since-departed Jason Cole wrote:

Despite Skaggs’ 4.73

ERA

between Reno and Arizona this season, none of the evaluators I’ve spoken with is worried about him over the long haul; most still peg him as a mid-rotation starter. Skaggs still flashed good stuff this season, including an upper-80s/low-90s fastball, swing-and-miss curveball, and average-or-better changeup. His fastball command was inconsistent, however, and multiple scouts noted that he wasn’t being aggressive enough with the pitch.

Skaggs relied more heavily (too heavily, according to the scouts) on his off-speed stuff and didn’t attack like he has in the past. While his fastball isn’t a knockout pitch, his usage and location of it early in counts is key to setting up his quality secondaries. It’s not a complex adjustment to make in the grand scheme, and given the fact that Skaggs still shows a clean delivery and strong command profile, there isn’t much reason worry about his overall future.

Dipoto doesn't seem too worried about Skaggs' overall future, and maybe he shouldn't be. After all, Skaggs is a tallish southpaw who turned 22 a few months ago; history is littered with examples of that kind developing at a slower pace. Cynics might remember the reported makeup issues surrounding another traded D'Backs pitcher but, if there are character issues here, then they've been well cloaked. Skaggs disappointed in 2013, yet he has the size, arsenal, and time to develop into a solid piece of the Angels rotation—just as we expected he would four years ago.

 

Tyler Skaggs

2013 was an improvement over 2012 at the major league level for Skaggs, but the improvement wasn’t enough to put him back on non-keeper/dynasty radars. This trade, however, does just that. A soft-tosser (at least as far as highly-rated pitching prospects go), he is far better equipped to pitch in a strong home run suppressing park rather than one that gives them away quicker than Derek Jeter gives out signed baseballs. If he can nail down a rotation spot out of Spring Training, he should be on medium-sized mixed league radars as a late upside play.

 

Hector Santiago

Another player moving to a place that is a perfect match for his skill set (this trade is just awesome). Santiago has a bit of an issue with the long ball—he’s given up 27 in 220 innings over the past two years—but the difference between U.S. Cellular and Angel Stadium is fierce. The WHIP is always going to be an issue since he’s walked 11.5 percent of the batters he’s faced in his career, but he can sustain that mid-3’s ERA even if his underlying skills face some regression

Edited December 11, 2013 by bloodbrother

[fatkook]

for me. today. the answer is yes. yesterday it would have been no. Trumbo was and is one of my favorite players along with Bourjos and Trout. 2 of them are gone now but it has made this team better. sad and happy at the same time.

 

[bloodbrother]

None of us are happy that Trumbo is gone but IMO it helped the team for the present and future, which is all that matters to me. We all have our favorite players but unless they are a Mike Trout type...they are expendable as long as it helps the team

[eaterfan]

Was it a good trade? Not really. Yes, Angels needed pitching so it was good in that sense, but Trumbo will have a long career and it is not clear if either of these pitchers will ever pan out. The Vernon Wells trade keeps paying dividends!

 

Trumbo had 3 years left of club control. How long his career lasts is irrelevant.