McJobs

[HaloMagic]

The car smelled of raw onions for a week.

How is that worse than the pickle smell you were trying to infuse it with?

[saangels]

There is so much opportunity out there and money to be had. I don't have any sympathy for these folks. 

Shouldn't you take it on a case by case basis?  Are you telling me you have no sympathy for the character TennAngelsfan outlined in his previous post?  Let's stop thinking in terms of stereotypes.  Every McDonald's worker isn't a dumb, fat, illiterate slob, contrary to the way some of you guys portray them.  Sure, there are people out there who lack ambition and are content making peanuts; but there are also people who are brought up in poverty and need to start working ASAP in order to support a family.  They don't have the time or resources for college; they don't have dress clothes to work--let alone even interview--at Nordstrom or Bloomingdales.  They need to put food on the table.  It's hard to save up and prepare for the future when you're making $8 an hour.  

 

Now, is it possible for these people to "make it"?  Yes, it is.  But let's not paint the picture of a one-dimensional idealized society where mere effort translates into immutable success.  Life is a lot more complicated than that.  

Edited December 6, 2013 by saangels

[Caralho]

There was a $15 minimum wage that passed in Seatac, WA, home of the international airport, for the areas around the airport. Since there is no fear of outsourcing there, the arguments against basically said hey higher skilled people will take you jobs. The fast food strikes are a negotiating tactic, your initial position should be a position that the other side won't accept, you want to come down from that. Smaller raises in the minimum wage are really popular when put to a vote, that's a big reason why there is such a push right now for higher wages.

[St1ck]

How is that worse than the pickle smell you were trying to infuse it with?

 

 

Or the natural smell of Blarg? 

[HaloMagic]

Or the natural smell of Blarg?

To be perfectly honest, I've never met an onion that could overpower a well ground-in Blarg smell.

Edited December 6, 2013 by HaloMagic

[Brandon]

Shouldn't you take it on a case by case basis? Are you telling me you have no sympathy for the character TennAngelsfan outlined in his previous post? Let's stop thinking in terms of stereotypes. Every McDonald's worker isn't a dumb, fat, illiterate slob, contrary to the way some of you guys portray them. Sure, there are people out there who lack ambition and are content making peanuts; but there are also people who are brought up in poverty and need to start working ASAP in order to support a family. They don't have the time or resources for college; they don't have dress clothes to work--let alone even interview--at Nordstrom or Bloomingdales. They need to put food on the table. It's hard to save up and prepare for the future when you're making $8 an hour.

Now, is it possible for these people to "make it"? Yes, it is. But let's not paint the picture of a one-dimensional idealized society where mere effort translates into immutable success. Life is a lot more complicated than that.

He's right.

You're trying to pigeon hole him to mean only these people on strike while asserting your point with the small percentage of people that face enormous difficulties.

His point is this is the United States of America. Everyone in this country (within general confines) has the ability to wake up every day and do IR be what they want. This country is founded up the idea that any man can achieve success and a wonderful life....it's why there are so many great and inspirational stories from all walks of life that made it through the worst of conditions. It's also why people eagerly migrate here even knowing the struggles initially simply to have the opportunity to be successful or live a prosperous life.

I also don't feel sorry for people that have a choice everyday but squander or make bad choices for themselves.

I know a lot of people that first worked McDonalds or some fast food spot that went on to do good things, I'm not belittling them or their work.

Adam's point and mine are that these people have the opportunity, no matter how difficult, to succeed. While these people are feeling entitled and wasting their days for an easier income, there is some dude in some third world country that probably can't afford to feed his family today and would kill for their jobs and opportunity.

[Adam]

Pretty much, brah

[mtangelsfan]

I think that point is Chad that, in general, these are entry level positions.  There is no essential training or skill needed to perform these jobs.  That is why the pay is low.  Are there a few sad stories in there?  Of course, but if peeps want to make more money, they may have to invest in themselves a little more along the way.  Work hard and find ways to move up.

 

The real truth is that if you keep moving the minimum wage up, guess who really pays for it.  Right, the lower and middle classes.  McDonalds wont, they will just pass it on to the consumer.  Small businesses and the consumers will be the ones who are impacted.  Not corporations or the rich folk.  That is the fallacy.

[Caralho]

That assumes a lot. Just because you increase costs doesn't necessarily mean that demand for a particular product will increase to cover that cost which is part of the reason that you won't necessarily see a 20 percent price increase if you increase wages by 20 percent. It also ignores the fact that food and housing and clothes have gotten more expensive over the last few years without any minimum wage increases. In my view the biggest problem with the economy is the lack of demand on the lower end and the almost constant downward pressure on wages. The minimum wage increases help fight both. 

[mtangelsfan]

Are you kidding?  The minimum wage has gone up constantly. 

 

If costs goes up, you must raise prices, or you will lose margin, and lose money.  It would be foolish to do business any other way.  The only other way is to lay off employees to balance the cost.  Most costs are fixed.  Wages are one of the few that are not.

[Caralho]

Losing margin is not the same as losing money. You can definitely make up for it with higher volume. The minimum wage hasn't gone up for 5 years federally, in California almost 6. Prices did not stop increasing on basics because the minimum hasn't gone up. Inflation has also been muted for a long time and that's only because the Fed kept the US from entering a Japan-like deflationary spiral. 

[Adam]

Rob is ready for Washington, folks! We'll be seeing him on C-Span one day with a flag pin and some fancy black folks behind him

[Caralho]

Haha highly doubtful. The only way I would ever run for office is something like city council and that's only if there is a city of Bell situation. 

[TobiasFunke]

Go into my store in Downey and you woudln't say that. Go into my store in Southgate, or Lakewood, or Santa Fe Springs, or Pico Rivera, or Norwalk and you will see that is pretty false. But we do attract a different applicant than say McDonalds.

You wouldn't happen to know a Cody Murray by any chance?

[Adam]

Well, you'll certainly be one of the fancy black folks then

[mtangelsfan]

Losing margin is not the same as losing money. You can definitely make up for it with higher volume. The minimum wage hasn't gone up for 5 years federally, in California almost 6. Prices did not stop increasing on basics because the minimum hasn't gone up. Inflation has also been muted for a long time and that's only because the Fed kept the US from entering a Japan-like deflationary spiral. 

 

Losing margin is losing money.  Higher volume is not nearly as controllable.  I work every day in retail  This is a no brainer.  I want to be able to pay my employees great money, but I have to convince the upper management that I can get higher margin or it wont fly.  Why?  Because I can't control volume nearly as much.  I can't control who opens up next to me or what they decide to charge for their stuff.

[Jay]

In order to maintain the margin, you must reduce costs, i.e. reduce head count.

[Adam]

That isn't altruistic enough, guys. 

[Catwhoshatinthehat]

Make up for it with higher volume LOL.  Reminds me of an Ali G skit from years ago when he sat down with Donald Trump and said something to the effect of "we need to make something that everyone needs so we can sell 6 billion of them" at which point Trump realizes it's a joke and walks out.

[mtangelsfan]

Sorry, by nature business isn't altruistic.  Doesn't mean you can't treat your employees well and try to pay them as best you can.

[Caralho]

Those businesses will adjust or perish just like they do with all sorts of regulations, I'm not that concerned with them. What concerns me is that the minimum wage if it had kept up with inflation since the 60's would be 10 dollars an hour, or if it had kept up with productivity 15 dollars an hour. The race to the bottom mentality has not worked out too well in America. 

[mtangelsfan]

Those businesses will adjust or perish just like they do with all sorts of regulations, I'm not that concerned with them. What concerns me is that the minimum wage if it had kept up with inflation since the 60's would be 10 dollars an hour, or if it had kept up with productivity 15 dollars an hour. The race to the bottom mentality has not worked out too well in America. 

 

LOL, you should be.  They are the ones giving people those entry level positions.  Without those kind of jobs kids don't earn extra money for college, spouses don't earn an extra few bucks etc.

 

I love libs, they say they hate corporate america and want to stand up for the little guy but pretty much everything they do ends up sticking a big, giant dildo right up the middle class' ass.

[Caralho]

Yup like Social Security, Medicare, those really hurt low-income people. Food stamps hurt low-income people and so does subsidizing insurance. Conservatives think that if they deregulated polluting industries (mostly located in low-income areas), destroyed the safety net and allowed companies to pay whatever pittance they please would actually help low-income people. Let's examine the lack of a minimum wage combined with the very weak government that conservatives favor. Businesses would be able to screw these people without remedy because lawyer and court costs would be much higher than any potential award from a breach of contract suit. That of course doesn't mention mandatory binding arbitration, the arbitrator being paid by the company of course. Go ahead and pretend that conservatives would be better for low-income folks. 

[Jay]

Under Obama the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer.  More people on food stamps than ever.  Thanks Libs!

[mtangelsfan]

You are talking low income and I am talking middle class.  You guys are just as big of lackeys to big corporate america as the idiotic republicans are.  Both favor immigration (cheap labor), both bend over to big pharm, both cow tow to special interests and the middle class is left holding the bag.  That is why the gap between rich and poor keeps getting wider and wider, because you two groups of peeps are eliminating the middle altogether.

 

all of your fees, taxes, liscenses and regulations.  Who do you think those hurt?  The rich?  The corporations?  Nope, the middle class and to a lesser extent the lower class.

 

Brilliant.