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For those who support the trade


Scott34

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Not to nitpick but he is 30 and will be on opening day. We traded our fourth outfielder and got a serviceable third baseman. I'm ok with it. I highly doubt there were better offers out there, if there were, my guess is he would have taken one of those better offers.

We traded our starting CF not our 4th OF

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Salas was a MLB player, not minor leaguer. Grichuk has not passed AA yet. The point is it was a four player deal, not three or two so there were obviously gaps between perceived values of the main players, Bourjos and Freese that both teams ironed out. Since perceived value of Grichuk is greater than Salas, Freese must have held a higher value than Bourjos.

 

there's plenty of factual basis behind it which has been discussed here several times.

 

both teams essentially gave up a minor league player.

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We traded our starting CF not our 4th OF

No, we traded our fourth outfielder. If you want to be blind to the fact that Trout was going to start in CF this year and Calhoun was going to start ahead of Peter go ahead, but you might be the only one on this board that would agree with that. Now if I wasn't convinced and if the Angels weren't convinced that Calhoun would be a quality major leaguer then I think you would have seen Trumbo traded ahead of Peter.

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Urgency to trade Burjous when they weren't going to get a good return, then that is urgency.  Selling low is bad business.

 

It's not selling low.   Halos are getting a guy who plays 3B and hits for power, coming off a down year.   Borjous was basically blocked in Anaheim, a platoon player at best.   In STL, Freese was in the same boat and getting to pricey for our mid-market team.

 

PB has been on STL's radar for a while, for at least the last year.   No secret to those familiar with the STL front office.    I had a feeling they would find a way to bring him on board.

 

I think this works out for both sides, very little risk.  High upside.

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It's not selling low.   Halos are getting a guy who plays 3B and hits for power, coming off a down year.   Borjous was basically blocked in Anaheim, a platoon player at best.   In STL, Freese was in the same boat and getting to pricey for our mid-market team.

 

PB has been on STL's radar for a while, for at least the last year.   No secret to those familiar with the STL front office.    I had a feeling they would find a way to bring him on board.

 

I think this works out for both sides, very little risk.  High upside.

 

In a nutshell, this is exactly how I view this trade today.

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It's not selling low.   Halos are getting a guy who plays 3B and hits for power, coming off a down year.   Borjous was basically blocked in Anaheim, a platoon player at best.   In STL, Freese was in the same boat and getting to pricey for our mid-market team.

 

PB has been on STL's radar for a while, for at least the last year.   No secret to those familiar with the STL front office.    I had a feeling they would find a way to bring him on board.

 

I think this works out for both sides, very little risk.  High upside.

Voice of reason. If both players stay healthy both teams win.

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As for the trade, I get that the offseason isn't over and that Dipoto can still (hopefully/somehow) pull a rabbit out of a hat and assemble a good pitching staff to complement the strong offense. I'm also happy that this strengthens Calhoun's place on the team; as far as I can tell, I was touting Calhoun back when you and Dave were saying that he wasn't much of a prospect. Whatever. But I see it as a bad trade, at least taken in a vacuum - and as the first move of the offseason. Bourjos and Freese are roughly equal, although Bourjos is three years younger and with more upside. Grichuk has some potential while Salas is another mediocre middle reliever with one good year a couple years ago. This trade could turn out well, but the consensus view of most fans and analysts is that the Angels got taken. This has been par for the course with Dipoto and Reagins, which is very, very discouraging.

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That really does not have anything to do with this thread. But in fairness very little posted has.

Sure it does. The Angels need pitching and traded for hitting. No matter how good Freese is, if the Angels don't get the necessary pitching and miss the playoffs, you would have to question this trade(trading for hitting rather than pitching)

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Trade PB didnt guarantee Calhoun starting. It guarantees we keep Trumbo. Trumbo could have netted us a starting pitcher. Isolated this trades sucks. But maybe it allows us to Trade Aybar or Kendrick. Maybe we sign Tanaka. There is still a lot of time to make moves where thiis trade doesnt blow up on us. However there is still a chance we have Blanton starting for us in April.

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A friend of mine reading the reactions here and someone who is highly respected in the community here sent this to me offline.

Calhoun, Hamilton, Schuck, Trout gives the Angels a contending outfield. Bourjos better than Calhoun and or Schuck? Perhaps, but he was also expendable.

Everyone talks about pitching being a need. Agree, but last I checked Scioscia has to write a 3B on the lineup card 162 games next season. Who will that be? Chris Nelson? I watched the Rockies send him packing because he was not an everyday player. Great utility player, but he is not a 3B on a contending team. The tweet about Freese being no better than Alberto Callaspo was laughable.

The Angels are in the mess they are in right now because, in part, they continued to overestimate their players. Dallas McPherson, Casey Kotchman, Jeff Mathis, Brandon Wood, Nick Gorneault, Terry Evans, and Matt Brown were all thought to be future front line MLB players and there was a point where each of these guys could have been moved for significant return. The front office refused to even listen. Many of the Angelswin.com posters agreed. I'm glad Dipoto isn't repeating past mistakes and holding on to guys like Bourjos when a trade improves the club.

 

Maybe the trade fails. But on 11/22 it was a smart move.

Chuck Gets IT! We had 5 players start at 3rd in 2013. The position needed to be addressed and it was! 

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I'm actually fine with them getting Freese.  Unfortunately for Bourjos, the best player in baseball plays the same position as him and was also on the same team.  I'm fine with Trout wanting to play CF if that is the case.  Bourjos had no position on this team and was most likely going to be a defensive replacement/pinch runner type next year.  I don't think he has as much value as some people hoped he did, but Freese does fill a position of need whether people want to accept that or not.

Edited by Chimi
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Yeah I know I'm stepping into the lions den here, but here's what I was told.

"Freese lost all his ability to drive the ball last year. He was all arms and used absolutely no load. He was already a minimal load hitter in the first place, which our scouts liked because he never threw himself into a funk with moving parts. But when you're neither "stepping into the bucket" or "squashing the bug" you've completely limited yourself. I haven't seen his meds so I can only assume Jerry has and was fine with his back recovering. More importantly, on defense he was trying to make it work at 3B when everything hit to his glove side caused him pain. Every time he fielded a bunt and threw he was either wincing or more out of breath than he should've been, so clearly something was up"

I was also told it was unanimous among those asked within the organization, they all thought Freese was a valuable asset. Personally, I wouldn't have done the trade because of Grichuk and Salas, but I'm also not going to pretend Freese won't be valuable because I'm sour about the past. Freese should give the Angels more production at 3B than they've had since 2009.

Also Scott, for the life of me I'll never understand why you think Lucho is better than Freese but Cron will never be a Major Leaguer. For the record, I think both will be Major Leaguers and Cron will be a starting 1B somewhere, but to value Lucho over Cron seems a bit backwards.

Edited by ScottyA_MWAH
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