This will be a good team next year

[SoWhat]

I hope we get some depth, I wouldn't even mind signing a guy like Freddy Garcia. Hopefully next year we won't have to use guys Enright or Buckner

[YouthofToday]

What's your take on the japanese pitcher and the cuban YOT?

Haven't had a chance to review anything yet on them.

[Brent Maguire]

This team needs to find a solid #3 type of guy. Lance Lynn is a guy I keep thinking of. Good K/9 and gives you good innings but comes with some erratic control. 

[SoWhat]

I kinda like Lance Lynn, I think he can be a poor man's Matt Garza. If the Cards would do a straight up trade of Aybar for Lynn, Dipoto should pull the trigger. Another trade I'd do would be packaging Trumbo to AZ for Archie Bradley. That'd be a solid rotation

SP:

Weaver

Wilson

Lynn

Bradley

Richards

Without spending anything on starting pitching, sign three BP arms like Javier Lopez, Joaquin Benoit, and Joe Smith.

BP:

Frieri

Benoit

Smith

Lopez

Burnett

De La Rosa

Edited September 16, 2013 by SoWhat

[tdawg87]

Archie Bradley has become one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. I really don't think AZ would give him up period, let alone for Mark Trumbo. Also, even if they DID you can't rely on a guy who has never pitched a MLB game as your number 4 starter, regardless of how much potential he may have.

[tdawg87]

Although I don't mind the idea of Lance Lynn. He's a solid pitcher and likely wouldn't cost a ton in terms of trade value.

[SoWhat]

Archie Bradley has become one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. I really don't think AZ would give him up period, let alone for Mark Trumbo. Also, even if they DID you can't rely on a guy who has never pitched a MLB game as your number 4 starter, regardless of how much potential he may have.

I didn't say straight up, I said package Trumbo. Kevin Towers isn't the brightest GM, so I wouldn't put a deal like this past him and his love for "gritty" players. I think whatever young arm we acquire will be in fourth slot. I mean if Dipoto would have acquired Zach Lee like he wanted to do, then which spot in the rotation would he have slot into? It's either Richards or whichever young SP we acquire in the fourth and fifth spots

Btw, I'm not trying to sound like a dick if it seems that way

Edited September 16, 2013 by SoWhat

[tdawg87]

Well you're forgetting Vargas, who I am guessing the Angels try hard to re-sign this offseason. A young pitcher like that would likely start at AAA and fill the 6th man role, getting spot starts here and there while the Angels slot Vargas and Richards in the 4th and 5th spots. They then either try to sign another starter or trade for a number 3.

[SoWhat]

Dipoto was looking to acquire MLB-ready arms and went after Zach Lee and one of Wacha or Martinez. I don't think he'd deal someone like Aybar or Kendrick who contribute alot to the big league club for someone who'd spend a majority of the season in minors

[tdawg87]

It isn't just about who will contribute now, but about who will contribute in the future. The Angels have pretty much no SP prospects who stand out to contribute in 2014 and even 2015. Wacha and Martinez are certainly MLB ready, but Lee is a guy who would be making a huge jump since he has never pitched a single game above AA. Archie Bradley started the year in the California League (High A ball). Those guys may be great pitching prospects, but if you're a team looking to win now, you don't go into the year expecting them to start smack dab in the middle of the rotation. If the scouts and coaches feel they are ready to make that jump, then so be it, but my guess is they would want to take it slow and give them their first taste of big-league competition later in the year (as what happened with Michael Wacha). It gives the team a good look at them going into next season and THAT's when you look to slot them into the rotation.

[Brent Maguire]

Dipoto was looking to acquire MLB-ready arms and went after Zach Lee and one of Wacha or Martinez. I don't think he'd deal someone like Aybar or Kendrick who contribute alot to the big league club for someone who'd spend a majority of the season in minors

Lee+Withrow for Howie would be a good deal if we could pull that off. Young bullpen arm with huge strikeout ability and a future starter would be a heck of a haul for us. 

[SoWhat]

You forgot to add that he had 21 starts in Double-A. Michael Wacha is 11 months older than him with and has only started 17 games throughout his ENTIRE minor league career. Making a jump from Double-A to the bigs isn't unheard of, especially with a pitcher of his caliber, Jose Fernandez made the jump from High-A to the bigs and btw, I'm not saying he'll have the same success as him. Anyway, I think an ERA of 4.23 and WHIP of 1.436 which Vargas has posted this year can be matched or outdone by a young arm we acquire

[YouthofToday]

Most top prospects jump from AA to MLB.

AAA is more for MLB depth.

[Docwaukee]

Bringing Zach lee in is good for the team long term, but I agree of limited help next year.

The rotation wasn't weaver, Wilson, Vargas. It was those two plus a couple of guys that were supposed to give you 200ip and a 4.5 era. Those two were complete disasters and that along with a lack of depth and injury really killed this team. If those two do the above, we might have a chance at the wc right now. Look how the team has played with those two not bringing them down.

They had other issues but two decent back end starters would have changed this season. Not saying to just leave it as is and hope for the best as they need to fill several holes.

Depth was a major issue as well, but even getting the disasters out and replacing them with Williams and Richards has helped. Problem is Richards is not longer depth now. They need to sign Vargas, get another legit 2/3, and possible bring in someone to compete with Garrett or provide depth. Zach lee could be that guy, but they'd still need a 2/3.

[YouthofToday]

Successful organizations set themselves up for the long haul. We shouldn't ignore a prospect just because he might not help in 2014. I don't understand this logic.

[Stradling]

I'm guessing if there were no other options then people would be ok trading Howie for Lee and wait it out. But if the Angels can get another highly touted pitching prospect that is major league ready then we would prefer they do that.

[nate]

They need two mid tier starting pitchers and 2-3 bullpen arms.

 

They also must not struggle coming out of the gate like they have the last couple years.

[Docwaukee]

Successful organizations set themselves up for the long haul. We shouldn't ignore a prospect just because he might not help in 2014. I don't understand this logic.

then you are not thinking clearly.  Jaded by the sour taste this season has left. 

 

If the Royals barely miss the playoff or even slump slightly to finish off the season and end up around .500, should they trade Alex Gordon in the offseason for a high end pitching prospect currently in AA.

 

Successful organization set themselves up for the long haul while balancing that with a current window of opportunity.  We shouldn't ignore the possibility that we could still win in 2014.  It's all about balance

[vlad27]

pitching is where its at - hopefully Vargas isnt too expensive itwould be good to keep him. I'd like to see us go into the season with too much pitching - both rotation and pen.

[vlad27]

They need two mid tier starting pitchers and 2-3 bullpen arms.

 

They also must not struggle coming out of the gate like they have the last couple years.

agreed - i dont know how this will be acheieved but somehow we need to come out of the gate strong. I know ST games dont matter but i think the desire to win has to start somewhere- i think we should at least try and win those games 

[vlad27]

So you really think a rotation of Hanson and Blanton was good?  I knew it wasn't good for the get go and did not have high expectations on this year team  I hate it when people call this a underachieving season because it wasn't.  Dipoto gambled and lost.  Fact is the pitching staff wasn't good and wasn't deep and we faced injuries.  Just take a look at how they played the last 20+ games!  That was how the team is supposed to play without giving up 40% of their games before the first pitch (Blanton and Hanson) and rest of the staff is healthy.

i do believe that dipoto gambled and lost. Very risky relying on Hanson who was in obvious heavy decline and Blanton who was NEVER good - plus relying on Madson to come back and have a prominent role - very very risky . Had those deals worked out Dipoto would have been a genious but as we know that hasnt happened - a hug egamble that didnt work out . I hope we dont gamble next year when it comes to pitching   

[tdawg87]

Successful organizations set themselves up for the long haul. We shouldn't ignore a prospect just because he might not help in 2014. I don't understand this logic.

 

I don't understand this post. How is getting a prospect and having them start slow in their jump to the majors "ignoring" them? The idea is to get the most out of them and have them develop a little more before throwing them into the rotation for 30 starts. Everyone has this "now now now" outlook and when you get a top prospect they aren't necessarily ready to help "now".

[VariousCrap]

I agree, signing Vargas to be the team's #4 next year would be a great move.

 

Last week MLBTradeRumors posted that the D-Backs have said they want to get a major power hitter this offseason.  Maybe Trumbo could get the Angels some SP or BP arms for him?

 

As for FA starting pitchers, I think the Angels should consider Ubaldo Jimenez and Josh Johnson.  They won't cost as much as Garza and could be better than him next year.

 

Edited to add:  This team needs at least two solid BP arms, but I'd like to see them get three.

Edited September 16, 2013 by Jim B

[tdawg87]

You forgot to add that he had 21 starts in Double-A. Michael Wacha is 11 months older than him with and has only started 17 games throughout his ENTIRE minor league career. Making a jump from Double-A to the bigs isn't unheard of, especially with a pitcher of his caliber, Jose Fernandez made the jump from High-A to the bigs and btw, I'm not saying he'll have the same success as him. Anyway, I think an ERA of 4.23 and WHIP of 1.436 which Vargas has posted this year can be matched or outdone by a young arm we acquire

 

Cases like Fernandez are rare, and considering the team he pitches for it's not surprising they had him start the year with the big league club, since there was pretty much 0 expectations and pressure for the team to compete. Some guys are just ready earlier than others, and as I said, if the coaches feel that a young prospect is ready to start the season in the rotation then so be it. Wacha was also a late-season call-up, so The Cards were not relying on him to fill a significant void in their rotation for the entire year.

 

It is certainly possible that a great pitching prospect could match Vargas in terms of production, but it is also possible that they could match Hanson. That's the problem with relying on a guy who has never faced MLB batters before to get 30 starts. They could be incredibly good prospects but there will always be an adjustment period and "growing pains". Could they produce like Fernandez has? Of course. But that's a high risk for a team that is looking to compete every year.

 

Now, if the Angels want to take a step back and give a young guy an opportunity to show what he is made of and also develop his talent in the Majors then I have no problem with that. I just don't think it's necessarily the best idea to take gambles with the rotation when it was the single biggest issue (outside of the bullpen) for your team the previous year. With Vargas you pretty much know what you are going to get. Same with Wilson and Weaver. However Richards is more or less in the same boat a young prospect would be. While he has much more experience facing MLB pitchers it's a bit of a gamble to rely on him to make 30 starts in 2014, simply because he has never done it before. One unknown filling the 5th spot in the rotation is perfectly fine and most teams do it, but two? That's a huge gamble that could pay off, but also find the 2014 Angels in the same spot they are in now. I would much rather them go into 2014 with 4 pitchers who have a MLB track record of success, than 3. Keep the young, talented prospect in the back pocket for when an injury inevitably occurs. Then call them up in September to get some innings in. Then in 2015 you re-evaluate your rotation and see where the young kid fits. He'll have MLB experience now and the coaches will have gotten a good enough look at him to determine if he can take over the 5th spot in the rotation.

Edited September 16, 2013 by tdawg87

[Angel Oracle]

Pass on Ubaldo Jimenez, the guy has always had control issues, and a 5.00 ERA in 2011/2012.

Even with the solid ERA in 2013 (mid 3.00s), he's still walked 76 in 162 innings and has a 1.37 WHIP.

Most of all, he puts incredible torque on his wrist on the backside of his delivery.   That can't be good in the long run as he hits 30 next season.

 

How much, including rights fee, will it truly take to sign Tanaka?   No players nor draft picks are lost.

Edited September 17, 2013 by Angel Oracle