Not About MLB revising Top 100 & Angel Top 20

[Toby Ziegler]

I'm counting down the days until the internet I told you so comes from Toby when Borenstein makes it to the MLB. Going to be legendary

 

Funny you should mention that. I've been thinking about writing a book about scouting in general. And I'm not going to pull any punches like I do here, haha.

[Inside Pitch]

lol at none of Borenstein's tools standing out. He has a ton of power. He has hit balls over 450 feet this year and last year. How many other prospects in your system have done that? Do scouts even watch these games? Ranked 15th is a joke. But I guess that's better than being left out of the top 50 like last year. Scouts are so bad it's not even funny.

 

Would love to see my brother get traded before the deadline to a competent organization that will actually give him opportunities.

 

Also just noticed that Snyder didn't even crack the top 20... Wow. As I said, this is a joke.

 

An outsiders opinion of the top 20 = The Angels are stupid and not giving a guy oportunities?    

 

Fan logic is always impressive..

[Inside Pitch]

Dur, reading comprehension? I never said anything about Calhoun.

 

He's not 100% healthy, so he's been a DH since he came off the DL. Yet the Angels told him they wouldn't promote him to AA unless he played in the field. Very short-sighted on their part. Why can't he DH for the rest of the season in AA? He's better than Cron, Cowart, Lindsey, Grichuk, and Witherspoon.

 

 

So they want him to be 100% before he takes the next step.  WHAT BAFOONS....

 

I agree he's better than Witherspoon.   The fact that he's a year older than both Lindsey and Grichuk and a level behind them makes it difficult to compare the numbers between the two and argue who is better.  But, there is little arguing that ZB has put up a far more impressive set of raw numbers this year than either did last --  its also worth noting that the league average age in the Cal League was older last year than this year.

[Toby Ziegler]

An outsiders opinion of the top 20 = The Angels are stupid and not giving a guy oportunities?    

 

Fan logic is always impressive..

 

Do you form opinions of your own, or do you blindly follow what other people say, Huckleberry?

[Toby Ziegler]

So they want him to be 100% before he takes the next step.  WHAT BAFOONS....

 

Yes, it's okay for him to DH in High-A but not in AA. MAKES SENSE...

[Inside Pitch]

My opinion is just as valid as your average scout. Scouts get it wrong all of the time. They are hardly infallible, and neither are you.

 

Keith Law graded Chris Sale's slider as below average and thought he wouldn't amount to anything. He also thought Paul Goldschmidt (never a highly rated prospect) would be a bust. The examples of embarrassing evaluative failures go on and on and on...

 

Forums are supposed to be a place where ideas are exchanged, and people have an open mind. None of you seem to have an open mind.

 

Sorry if my opinions are so offensive. I'm not going to filter myself on a public forum. And I really haven't done anything wrong. But if you guys can't handle someone who offers a different perspective, I'm not really sure what you're playing at then.

 

Apparently, open minds only count if they agree with your opinions,.   Seriously, take a deep breath and practice what you're preaching.

[Toby Ziegler]

Are you going to belatedly respond to all of my posts? Keep going. You're on a roll.

[Inside Pitch]

Yes, it's okay for him to DH in High-A but not in AA. MAKES SENSE...

 

Actually it does unless you're the type of person that's sooo full of yourself you don't think it would be in your own best interest to be at 100% when stepping up the challenge.    

 

The fact is he's proven he can hit HighA, and he's proven he can field I'm assuming.  The last thing they may want to do is take someone who may be a hard charger and have him re-injure himself trying to impress new teammates and coaches.   GOOD LORD THEY ARE STUPID

But apparently Mr Open mind doesn't think there is any room for any outside opinions including people who's best interest is to put players into the best position to suceed.

 

Grats on being smarter than the rest of baseball.

[Toby Ziegler]

Well, they obviously put him in the best position to succeed when he was stuck in limbo last year in Extended Spring Training. You're absolutely right. What could I possibly know about his situation? You clearly have a better grasp of it.

 

Mea culpa.

[Inside Pitch]

Love the condescension...

 

Scouts are not the be-all and end-all. That should be abundantly clear to anyone who follows the game closely. Perhaps I dismiss them too easily, but you give them far too much credit. Scouts have and will continue to make monumental mistakes. They get it right a lot of the time, too. But they also miss quite a few things. It's about as hit and miss as any line of work.

 

I don't deny my bias. I also don't think that necessarily undermines anything I said. My arguments are impassioned, but they're also completely reasonable.

 

I never said I "called around." I don't have any GMs on speed dial. But I did make inquiries. Whether or not those inquiries are taken into consideration is out of my control.

 

If there's one thing I've learned it's that people need advocates. If no one else is willing to go to bat for my brother, I'll gladly do it. Clearly, most of you could care less. And that's fine. You've got your own lives to worry about. Your own families. To demean someone for only wanting what is best for his family is crazy.

 

The fact that he was drafted in the 23rd round only serves to illustrate my point about scouts. Thanks for bringing that up. Again, go ahead and demean me and him. I really don't care. For you and your ridiculous tone. I suggest you go f*** yourself.

 

Good lord.   Whines about someone being condescending and demeaning others, while being completely condescending.

 

Your supporting your brother is great.  Your acting like a stage mom is a bit crazy-sauce.  But, that's just my opinion and since you're such an open minded person who values interaction and the exchange of ideas you will likely tell me to go F myself.

 

You sir, are the most special snowflake of all time.

[Toby Ziegler]

Did I sleep with your mother or something?

[Inside Pitch]

7 straight hits for Zach, 8 consecutive times on base dating back to last game.

 

I think his time as a DH has benefited him. He told my dad he studied the opposing hitters when he was in the dugout. His plate discipline has improved a great deal since coming off the DL (10 BBs/10 Ks in 19 games - the 19th game is still going on as we speak) and he's doing much better against lefties.

 

Hitting .348 now. If only his hit tool were as good as Cron's...

 

 

I like him better than Cron personally simply because I value guys that can work counts and get on base..  But I'm a close minded idiot,.

[Tyler]

Go to bed you two.

[Inside Pitch]

Do you form opinions of your own, or do you blindly follow what other people say, Huckleberry?

 

 

Do you always assume you're smarter than everyone else or are you just being an asshole here because of the safety you're afforded by the internet?  Despite you being a completely douchebag, I'm rather high on ZB, and pay little mind to much of what's said in prospect ratings -- which is why I'm not the one with my panties in a bunch lashing out at everyone.  What's more I feel he's been a victim of his draft slot and the bias Vs players from the Midwest and smaller schools in general.    

 

There is very little arguing that if healthy he should have been playing over a guy like Chevy Clarke who is an ass and who cares more about looking good than actually being good -- and his draft slot shouldn't have been a factor although it would be extremely naive to think it didn't factor into things.   If they are looking at tools and deciding that he's an overachiever then IMO they are guilty of falling into the common mistakes of yesteryear -- I mean, are they going to argue that he doesn't have the "good face" too,  From what he's done and you're saying it seems your brother is more than just tools, unfortunately people are always quick to dismiss the Ecksteins and Kruks of the world.

 

All he's done is hit and IMO, because he is older they should have possibly been more aggressive promoting him.  I think it's fair to question why they haven't but, I do get them wanting him to be healthy.

 

BTW..  Mind pointing to where I'm blindly following what others say?

 

Dolt.

[Inside Pitch]

Are you going to belatedly respond to all of my posts? Keep going. You're on a roll.

 

 

I'm reading them now, I'm responding now..   Sorry Champ, despite your obvious genius I don't have an app or anything that tells me whenever the greatest, smartest person alive "You" offers his precious insights.  

 

LOL..  Not sure who made you the message board God, but unless there is some proclamation stating you get to determine when and how many times a person gets to respond, I'll do what I want and I guess, you'll have to deal with it.

 

[Inside Pitch]

Well, they obviously put him in the best position to succeed when he was stuck in limbo last year in Extended Spring Training. You're absolutely right. What could I possibly know about his situation? You clearly have a better grasp of it.

 

Mea culpa.

 

Ii actually agree IF that's what happened, it makes little sense.  You're too eager....   Im pulling for your brother.  I think the Angels may have found a real diamond in the rough,

[Inside Pitch]

Go to bed you two.

 

 

I'm actually getting up.   I'm on the East coast, I get up early, read box scores, catch up on the message board and hit the gym before going to court.

[David Mueller]

Hey, Toby.  No need to get defensive.  If your brother keeps hitting like he is, he'll force his way into the Angels plans.  He's on an unholy tear right now, the likes of which I have rarely seen.   Zach got drafted later, and there's always a desire of teams to be proven right on the guys they drafted early, so those guys do get preferential treatment to some extent, in EVERY organization.  However, the main desire of any team is to win games, and anyone who can help them do that will be on the field.

 

Now, I'm not sure why Zach is getting dinged for not hitting as well at home.  I'd think that a 1000+ OPS at home is still pretty good?  Even though he has 15 of his HR on the road, I guess it depends on exactly how he hit those HR, and maybe you have some insight into that.  It is pretty clear that Zach has nothing more to prove in Inland Empire at this point with a 1300+ OPS over the last 20 games, so I can't blame you for wanting to see him in AA.

 

Either way, it will be next year when we'll see what Zach's timetable is.  It would be nice to see him in the Arizona Fall League too.  One thing that it looks like he could work on a bit is his plate discipline.  26 walks is a bit low for someone with his crazy numbers...then again, I haven't been fortunate enough to see his games so maybe there is another reason for the low walk total.

 

(This is my first post - I'm really a Twins fan, but Trout has become my favorite player, and I like some of the guys in the Angels system like Rondon, Yarbrough, and Borenstein especially.  My Twins have a pretty great farm system too!)

[Angel Oracle]

I like how Zach is willing to learn, as shown in his studying other hitters while serving as DH.

[Toby Ziegler]

(This is my first post - I'm really a Twins fan, but Trout has become my favorite player, and I like some of the guys in the Angels system like Rondon, Yarbrough, and Borenstein especially.  My Twins have a pretty great farm system too!)

 

I actually saw Sano play last year in Cedar Rapids and Beloit. Tremendous talent. He's going to be a monster. Kind of a head case, though. Reminds me a bit of Hanley, in the good and bad ways. Buxton appears to be headed for stardom as well.

[Second Base]

With Zach, whenever I've watched him play, the best case I see for him is Daniel Nava.  But don't have tools that excite scouts, but they play above their skill sets.  They both have similar build, Zach has a little more power projection in his swing while Nava has a better approach.  

[Toby Ziegler]

With Zach, whenever I've watched him play, the best case I see for him is Daniel Nava.  But don't have tools that excite scouts, but they play above their skill sets.  They both have similar build, Zach has a little more power projection in his swing while Nava has a better approach.  

 

I don't want to get into it with you again, but I feel like this is yet another backhanded compliment from you.

 

Nava is a good player. I've always liked him. But as far as Nava being Zach's ceiling as a player comp, I think you're way off. Zach has quite a bit more power than Nava, not "a little." His tools are also much better than you give him credit for. As usual, I'm disappointed but not surprised by another inaccurate assessment of Zach.

[HaloMilliVanilli]

Being compared to any player who is actually playing at the MLB level (and not just hoping to someday) should always be taken as a compliment.

[Angelsjunky]

The Great Borenstein Controversy of 2013.

[David Mueller]

I don't see how Nava can be compared to Borenstein in any way, other than that they are both lefties.  Nava did not even play in a minor league system until he was 25, and at that age, at one of the ultimate hitting havens in the minor leagues, he OPS'ed over 100 points lower than what Borenstein is OPS'ing right now, in his age 22 season (though he just turned 23 now, towards the end of the year)

 

Maybe you can compare them in the sense that neither of them are high draft picks with ridiculous tools.  If I were to make a comparison, I'd say something like Jason Kubel, at least when he was on the Twins.  He seems to have declined since going to Arizona, though, at least this year.