2025 rotation could be not bad

[aceofpace]

With a potential rotation of Dana, Soriano, Anderson, Kochanowicz, and Detmers, the 2025 rotation could be promising even WITHOUT a free-agent pitcher. Any such signing and/or further development from their minor leaguers would be a bonus.
 

[Taylor]

Nice try, AJ.

[totdprods]

It would be foolish to count on the youth to produce over the course of a full season for 2 or 3 slots of a rotation. I have a ton of confidence in these guys being solid MLB arms, but the odds of all being productive and healthy for a 162-game season are extremely slim.

The Angels need to acquire one or two vet SPs this winter and count on these kids to cycle through one or two slots over the course of the year, until spots open up due to either injury, transaction (DFA or Canning, trade of Anderson), or ineffectiveness. Come 2026, they should be able to count on the youth movement to take over the rotation.

I’d like to see them sign a FA to a deal similar to what we got Anderson for, 3/$39M, and have him be our continuation of Anderson’s rotation slot. Dependable vet SP anchor. Also would like to see them nab one other arm on a 1-yr deal or find a salary dump guy like Chris Bassitt and have him replace Canning, who can then be DFA’ed a little more comfortably. That would give the Halos a solid vet trio at the top and Soriano and Detmers the back of the rotation, with the kids waiting in the wings. By July, Anderson and the 1-yr guy can be dealt and the prospects can come up for those slots, hopefully for good.

2025 pre-deadline:
• Anderson
• Manaea (or a similar 3/$39m type)
• Bassitt (or a similar 1-yr signing/salary dump trade target)
• Soriano
• Detmers
•minors: Dana, Aldegheri, Kochanowicz, Klassen, Bachman, Daniel, 

2025 post-deadline:
• Manaea
• Soriano
• Detmers
• Dana
• Aldegheri

I think Detmers has enormous potential so I’m leery to deal him, but if you can get two young bats like the Norby and Stowers for Rogers deal, it’s worth considering this winter or next summer, especially if the kids like Kochanowicz, Dana and Aldegheri have done well in their MLB starts.

[Chuck]

2 hours ago, aceofpace said:

With a potential rotation of Dana, Soriano, Anderson, Kochanowicz, and Detmers, the 2025 rotation could be promising even WITHOUT a free-agent pitcher. Any such signing and/or further development from their minor leaguers would be a bonus.
 

Yeah it's a good start for sure, but the team needs to add a good #2 at the very least IMO to head up the rotation. Maybe two! 

I'd be fine if they traded Tyler Anderson in the offseason and add two arms via free agency. Guys like Sean Manaea and Jack Flaherty would be great adds, followed by Detmers, Soriano and Dana/Koch.

[Ochocinco!]

We absolutely need to add 1 if not 2 starting pitchers via FA or trade. You can never have enough, someone out of the group OP mentioned will get hurt, one will suck, one may over perform and one just may be mehhh. Bring in a couple veterans and we will have a “solid” foundation to work with.

[totdprods]

Posted this in the Kochanowicz thread, but this has basicslly been our rotation this year, not counting Detmers’ start last night:

1. 3.55 ERA, 1.25 WHIP, 162 IP 
2. 3.66 ERA, 1.23 WHIP, 145 IP 
3. 4.88 ERA, 1.48 WHIP, 135 IP
4. 5.19 ERA, 1.39 WHIP, 144 IP
5. 6.73 ERA, 1.57 WHIP, 127 IP

Of those…

1. Anderson
2. Soriano and Fulmer
3. is mostly Sandoval and our five best SP prospects
4. Canning
5. Mostly Detmers and up-and-down filler (Cueto, Plesac, Daniel, Rosenberg, etc.)

And those are very basic metrics. ERA, Walks+Hits. As of now, it looks like the AL League Average AL pitcher is 4.08 ERA and 1.26 WHIP.

We need to replace at least two slots in the rotation with at least league average production, and aside from Detmers, I don’t know that there’s anyone on roster who I feel comfortable can produce that over a full season. 

[Angels 1961]

Manaea, Bassitt, Flaherty would all be nice additions. Would they want to come to a rebuild and will Arte want to spend. This off season will Perry say the same oh thing about wanting to compete and have his hands tied.

[Slegnaac]

They started 2024 with a rotation that seemed promising.... 

Sandoval

Canning

Detmers

Silseth

Anderson

We know how that went....

Edited Wednesday at 10:30 PM by Slegnaac

[tdawg87]

If they want to compete, they need 2 legit starters via FA AND Detmers, Silseth, Canning (if he's still on the team), Daniel etc... to pitch significantly better while Anderson and Soriano maintain what they've done this year. 

That's a big ask. Is it possible? Absolutely. Is it likely? Ask Arte. I think they may add a starter but I wouldn't expect more than like, Frankie Montas.

[Hubs]

Sasaki fits in with this group nicely.

And I expect Anderson to be around at least until midseason.

[Hubs]

Angels have given up the second most runs in the AL this year, 668 in 138 games. 4.84 runs per game.

Starters have given up 415 runs, and Relievers 253 runs. 

Pitching seems to be better as of late, we've all seen the pen stats. 

Starters have given up 277 runs in first half (96 games) 138 runs in second half (42 games). This is 2.89 runs in first half and 3.29 runs in second half per start.

Relievers have given up 195 runs in first half (96 games) and 58 runs in second half. (42 games). This is 2.03 runs per game in the first half and 1.38 runs per game in the second half.

Starting and relieving have been pretty close in their averages, the relievers are throwing an average of 3 2/3 innings per game. Starters then average a tiny bit over 5 innings. 

Anderson and Canning both are giving up more runs in the second half than they did in the first.

Soriano is doing better in second half. Detmers was much better in his one start in the second half. 

Sandoval hasn't pitched in the second half. 

Angels have used 18 starters. Two are BP arms used as opener.

Suarez, Cueto, Silseth, Plesac, Rosenberg and Daniel all have ERA's over 6 in 15 starts. They've allowed over 53 runs as starters. Suarez's splits page would not load.

Edited Wednesday at 10:45 PM by Hubs

[failos]

6 hours ago, aceofpace said:

With a potential rotation of Dana, Soriano, Anderson, Kochanowicz, and Detmers, the 2025 rotation could be promising even WITHOUT a free-agent pitcher. Any such signing and/or further development from their minor leaguers would be a bonus.
 

All of them will have TJ next season thanks to you

[ShotimeDynasty]

Some thoughts on in system rotation options:

Soriano - great upside/big (re)injury risk
Anderson - real good performance upside(22/24)/big performance downside (2023)
Dana - 142 IP & counting; I think he can be counted on in 2025
Detmers - extremely volatile performer; potential Ace
Silseth - real good performance upside/injury & durability concerns

Jack K - 135 IP & counting; if September mirrors August he’s a serious candidate to contribute all season 
Aldegheri - very little exposure above A-ball, interesting wild card
Canning - DFA/long-relief candidate 

longshot wild cards that could play themselves into consideration:

Klassen
Davis Daniel 
Bachman
Rosenberg
Mederos 
Fulmer?
Kerry

[Angel Oracle]

Manaea has a player option with the Mets for 2025.

Although if he finishes the season like he’s pitched so far, he likely gets a multi-year deal worth more per year than his 2025 player option.

Just can’t be going big money big years for any rotation upgrade.   2-3 year deals are enough.

[Mark68]

I would not count on any of these guys to pitch 150+ innings for the Angels next year. The only one who will potentially pitch in 150 innings will not be with the Angels at the end of the year (Anderson). I think they still need to target starting pitching, definitely including Sasaki (if posted). Yeah, they should go after stop gaps whom they can flip in July. I like Dana's future--but I don't think he'll be fully ready in 2025. Not everyone can be Paul Skenes.

[totdprods]

52 minutes ago, Angel Oracle said:

Manaea has a player option with the Mets for 2025.

Although if he finishes the season like he’s pitched so far, he likely gets a multi-year deal worth more per year than his 2025 player option.

Just can’t be going big money big years for any rotation upgrade.   2-3 year deals are enough.

Recently said he was planning on declining and becoming a free agent. 

Our rotation has kinda started leaning right-handed heavy, Manaea would be a solid add. 

[Vlad27Trout27]

7 hours ago, totdprods said:

Posted this in the Kochanowicz thread, but this has basicslly been our rotation this year, not counting Detmers’ start last night:

1. 3.55 ERA, 1.25 WHIP, 162 IP 
2. 3.66 ERA, 1.23 WHIP, 145 IP 
3. 4.88 ERA, 1.48 WHIP, 135 IP
4. 5.19 ERA, 1.39 WHIP, 144 IP
5. 6.73 ERA, 1.57 WHIP, 127 IP

Of those…

1. Anderson
2. Soriano and Fulmer
3. is mostly Sandoval and our five best SP prospects
4. Canning
5. Mostly Detmers and up-and-down filler (Cueto, Plesac, Daniel, Rosenberg, etc.)

And those are very basic metrics. ERA, Walks+Hits. As of now, it looks like the AL League Average AL pitcher is 4.08 ERA and 1.26 WHIP.

We need to replace at least two slots in the rotation with at least league average production, and aside from Detmers, I don’t know that there’s anyone on roster who I feel comfortable can produce that over a full season. 

Sad thing is that if our 3-5th starters had 4era, we might have been in the wildcard race. Easily could have added 10-15 wins 

[Vlad27Trout27]

I'd steer clear of Manaea—he's struggled up until this season.

As I mentioned, I'd look at adding Kikuchi. He can be a solid #2/#3 in any rotation and would slot right into the #3 spot.

After that, I'm all in on getting Bieber. He'd primarily be relied on for 2026, but he's the ace you go after to pair with some potential breakout starters.

1. TA: He seems like the clear #1, though, unfortunately, we’re starting to see some decline.

2. Soriano: I see him as a solid 3.40 ERA guy who can eat innings.

3. Kikuchi: A dependable #3.

4. Internal battle: This spot is open until Bieber is ready.

5. Detmers: He’s the wildcard—he could either be a solid #2 or fall to the #5 spot

[Angel Oracle]

1 hour ago, totdprods said:

Recently said he was planning on declining and becoming a free agent. 

Our rotation has kinda started leaning right-handed heavy, Manaea would be a solid add. 

Trading Anderson and signing Manaea would keep it at 3 RHPs and 2 LHPs, pretty good mix.

[totdprods]

5 minutes ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

Sad thing is that if our 3-5th starters had 4era, we might have been in the wildcard race. Easily could have added 10-15 wins 

Easy peasy, especially because bullpen has been fine most of the year and offense has been somewhat okay at times.

And as excited as I am about the young arms coming up, I worry about counting on too much from them too soon. It’s a little easier to go through growing pains with bats as the injury risk is less. Not so with arms. We’re close to having legitimate depth in the rotation, but it would be beyond risky to go into 2025 relying on the young arms full-time for a bulk of the rotation. Shoot for that come 2026. 

[totdprods]

2 minutes ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

I'd steer clear of Manaea—he's struggled up until this season.

How so? His FIP has been between 3.66 and 4.53 all of his full seasons, and under 4 in four of the last five years. 

WHIP has been between 1.12 and 1.30 the last five years.

He seems as good a bet as any to be a 140 IP, 4.25 ERA, 1.25 WHIP guy next year, and has some relief utility too. 

He isn’t amazing, but we just need him to be who he’s been the last five years to be an improvement over what we’ve had at back of the rotation.

[BTH]

I’m not as concerned about filling innings as others are, which is why I’d trade Anderson while others might not.

I’m fine watching a crop of young pitchers sink or swim. Kochanowicz, Silseth, Dana, Aldegheri, Bachman, Daniel.

The priority has to be veteran bats. I cannot watch the likes of Drury, Kavadas, Stefanic, Rendon, Pillar, etc. getting hundreds, if not thousands, of PAs.

[totdprods]

27 minutes ago, BTH said:

I’m not as concerned about filling innings as others are, which is why I’d trade Anderson while others might not.

I’m fine watching a crop of young pitchers sink or swim. Kochanowicz, Silseth, Dana, Aldegheri, Bachman, Daniel.

The priority has to be veteran bats. I cannot watch the likes of Drury, Kavadas, Stefanic, Rendon, Pillar, etc. getting hundreds, if not thousands, of PAs.

We need to do both, and the pen is about half-full going into 2025. We’re bottom of the AL offensively and pitching. Rolling with just kids in the rotation is a surefire way to burn them up early in their careers. 

By my count, at a minimum, the Angels need 2 SP, one full-time bat, two bench bats, and 2-3 relievers, with at least one being a high-lev guy.

At a minimum. 

Two vet arms who can give us league average innings, a legit bat to slot in at DH (or rotate with Trout or Rendon at DH), a high-lev reliever to help setup Joyce, a cheap vet reliever or two to stabilize pen, a solid UT IF, and an OF who can mash lefties and platoon with Moniak. Huge wishlist. But I think it can be done. 

[BTH]

24 minutes ago, totdprods said:

By my count, at a minimum, the Angels need 2 SP, one full-time bat, two bench bats, and 2-3 relievers, with at least one being a high-lev guy.

Which means we’ll get 0 or 1 SP, no bat, no bench bats, and 4-5 relievers.

[Ochocinco!]

$11mill on another reliever and you will love it