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8 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

Montgomery will take the job.  Minasian will finally get full influence over the roster and put together the team he wants.  Including the coaches.  I'm not implying that means we're gonna start winning all of a sudden.  Just that he'll offer Montgomery the job and they won't lose 90 games or more next year so he'll look good on paper.  It'll be a nice opening salvo for Ray regardless of what new ownership does.  And in a lot of situations, new owners won't gut the front office.  So Minasian essentially has one last chance here.  If the team doesn't show something positive next year, they will move on.  

You might be right but why didn't they just make him the interim manager instead of Nevin? No managerial experience?

 

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2 hours ago, eligrba said:

Sounds like Eppler-Ausmus revisited. 

I was cruising around through bullpen stats the other day.   Realized that the 2019 team had one of the worst pitching staffs in franchise history.  Maybe the worst.   On top of that, the offense was decidedly mediocre.  They ended up with 90 losses.  This year's team should have performed much much better.  

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

You might be right but why didn't they just make him the interim manager instead of Nevin? No managerial experience?

 

Nevin doesn't have any either.  I mentioned this in another thread.  My theory is that the team was/is a hot mess.  Especially when Maddon was fired.  Minasian didn't want to hand that to the guy he sees as the future manager.  Part of my reasoning is that I don't think Minasian had full control of the roster going into 2022.  I think he picked the players to some degree but I think Maddon had a lot of influence on the direction of the team and the off season plan of going pitching, pitching, pitching.  Hence the Iglesias cluster.  Getting two free agent relievers.  And leaving half the lineup below replacement level without any depth to cover potential disasters should they happen - and they all happened.  I think Joe wanted pitching.  He called out the org on it to the media after the 2021 season.  

So it was 'fine Joe, we'll do it your way' and it didn't sit well.  Especially after a 14 game losing streak.  

Minasian didn't want to had his guy that team.  So he sold the bill of goods to Nevin.  Who's been capable after clearing out the Maddon stench.   I wouldn't keep him because he doesn't necessarily feel like the right guy to me but they've kind of stabilized into a slightly below .500 team over the last couple months.   Mostly beating bad team.  Mostly losing to good ones.  Kind of what you'd expect with the current talent level.  So Nevin has a bit of a 'feather in his cap' for his resume.  

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37 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

Minasian didn't want to hand that to the guy he sees as the future manager. 

I agree with this but simultaneously cringe at the reality that Minasian may not see his new manager as having the skill set to deal with the remains of the Maddon Shit Show.  Seems to me that Montgomery could have built up some social capital with the players by being the interim-manager this season.  Something doesn't seem right.

What a mess.

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51 minutes ago, eligrba said:

I agree with this but simultaneously cringe at the reality that Minasian may not see his new manager as having the skill set to deal with the remains of the Maddon Shit Show.  Seems to me that Montgomery could have built up some social capital with the players by being the interim-manager this season.  Something doesn't seem right.

What a mess.

I think he probably does see that but didn't want to hand him a pile of shit out of the gate.  He would want to give him a 'clean inning' if you will and not bring him in with runners on 2nd and 3rd and no outs in his major league debut.  So Nevin becomes the lackey of sorts.  I don't see why Montgomery couldn't have been building that social capital all along.  Plus, I think it ultimately gives Minasian a bit more flexibility should another name arise that he likes as well.  

Put it together in the off season when you've got a bit more time and you can do so due diligence.  You don't want to be absolutely obligated to Montgomery either.  What if a couple guys really impress during the interview process.   Then you've got a few months for whoever to start building rapport with the players and you have an entire spring to bring everyone together.  

They could have done it the other way and it would probably have been fine.  I don't think anything isn't right.  Just another way to go about it.  

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11 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

Minasian hands will be tied on spending. I believe Moreno will be in cut payroll mode. It started with trade of Raisel. Walsh may be gone as Thaiss can replace him. I see a very quiet off season for Angels.

Walsh makes the league min. and was injured (apparently) which may have had an impact on his poor performance.  He'll probably get an opportunity to rebound.  I don't disagree that this could be a quiet off season though.  

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16 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

Walsh makes the league min. and was injured (apparently) which may have had an impact on his poor performance.  He'll probably get an opportunity to rebound.  I don't disagree that this could be a quiet off season though.  

I can see them resigning Lorenzen for 2023 (maybe 2024 team option).   Then the 6th spot could be between CRod (if healthy) and Silseth with depth in the minors backing them up if needed.

I can see them bringing in one short term deal closer (Jansen for 1 year plus team option ?), as that wouldn’t impact the new owner much.

And of course, the main focus is working on keeping Ohtani beyond 2023 with the possibility of switching to a 5 man rotation after 2023.

Edited by Angel Oracle
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2 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

Nevin doesn't have any either.

Nevin has managed in the minor leagues. And he does have MLB managerial experience, now.

Montgomery has literally no experience. He went from front office to bench coach.

Plus at least Nevin has some cred as a former player.

I would keep Nevin over Montgomery but hey I'm not the GM.

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3 hours ago, Jay said:

You might be right but why didn't they just make him the interim manager instead of Nevin? No managerial experience?

To avoid saddling him with a team built for someone else maybe.   Check out how many people think Nevin has done a terrible job, why saddle your guy with that label.  I think you are right (as you said in your next post), and they may just keep Nevin on and keep Montgomery on the bench as the earpiece to the GM.

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2 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

Nevin doesn't have any either.  I mentioned this in another thread.  My theory is that the team was/is a hot mess.  Especially when Maddon was fired.  Minasian didn't want to hand that to the guy he sees as the future manager.  Part of my reasoning is that I don't think Minasian had full control of the roster going into 2022.  I think he picked the players to some degree but I think Maddon had a lot of influence on the direction of the team and the off season plan of going pitching, pitching, pitching.  Hence the Iglesias cluster.  Getting two free agent relievers.  And leaving half the lineup below replacement level without any depth to cover potential disasters should they happen - and they all happened.  I think Joe wanted pitching.  He called out the org on it to the media after the 2021 season.  

So it was 'fine Joe, we'll do it your way' and it didn't sit well.  Especially after a 14 game losing streak.  

Minasian didn't want to had his guy that team.  So he sold the bill of goods to Nevin.  Who's been capable after clearing out the Maddon stench.   I wouldn't keep him because he doesn't necessarily feel like the right guy to me but they've kind of stabilized into a slightly below .500 team over the last couple months.   Mostly beating bad team.  Mostly losing to good ones.  Kind of what you'd expect with the current talent level.  So Nevin has a bit of a 'feather in his cap' for his resume.  

I need to scroll down and see if you've already posted.  Jerk!

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19 hours ago, Angel Oracle said:

60 game season

Still, it was getting blood out of a turnip. The Marlins seem to be run a lot like the Athletics. Good scouting and player development, usually reasonably competitive, trade players once they become good because they won't be staying. In a perpetual rebuild. Nobody is going to win consistently there. That said, I don't know enough about Mattingly's leadership style to know whether he would be a good fit with the Angels.

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5 hours ago, jsnpritchett said:

They were outscored by 41 runs that year.  Their projected record based on run differential was 26-34-- which is the same record the Angels had in 2020, coincidentally.  They ended up going 31-29, so there was definitely some luck/overachieving involved. 

I have no idea if he's a good manager, but to hold his lack of success with the Marlins and only pointing to his record with guys like Justin Bour, Starlin Castro, and John Berti leading his teams is just silly

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12 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

Montgomery will take the job.  Minasian will finally get full influence over the roster and put together the team he wants.  Including the coaches.  I'm not implying that means we're gonna start winning all of a sudden.  Just that he'll offer Montgomery the job and they won't lose 90 games or more next year so he'll look good on paper.  It'll be a nice opening salvo for Ray regardless of what new ownership does.  And in a lot of situations, new owners won't gut the front office.  So Minasian essentially has one last chance here.  If the team doesn't show something positive next year, they will move on.  

 

4 hours ago, Stradling said:

This is my assumption as well. 

I agree.

It makes too much sense not to happen, imo.

 

I think Nevin remains on the staff, either as bench coach or 3B coach, and Montgomery is the manager. I could see them wanting to give Montgomery a bench coach with MLB managerial experience (which could be Nevin) but is more likely Rod Barajas or Trey Hillman.

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27 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

To avoid saddling him with a team built for someone else maybe.   Check out how many people think Nevin has done a terrible job, why saddle your guy with that label.  I think you are right (as you said in your next post), and they may just keep Nevin on and keep Montgomery on the bench as the earpiece to the GM.

Yeah I see your point. Minasian was protecting "his guy" because he knew the team was going nowhere anyway. Let Nevin take the flak.

IMO Minasian would have appeared foolish to dismiss a person of Maddon's caliber and replace him with the likes of Montgomery, when he has a more experienced person available in Nevin.

So now what to do with Nevin? I don't think you demote him back down to 3B coach or whatever, and promote Montgomery. That would look kind of dumb.

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1 hour ago, Jay said:

Nevin has managed in the minor leagues. And he does have MLB managerial experience, now.

Montgomery has literally no experience. He went from front office to bench coach.

Plus at least Nevin has some cred as a former player.

I would keep Nevin over Montgomery but hey I'm not the GM.

Montgomery Career WAR is 0.1

Nevin Career WAR is 15.9

 

 

 

edge: Lowell

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8 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

I think he probably does see that but didn't want to hand him a pile of shit out of the gate.  He would want to give him a 'clean inning' if you will and not bring him in with runners on 2nd and 3rd and no outs in his major league debut.  So Nevin becomes the lackey of sorts.  I don't see why Montgomery couldn't have been building that social capital all along.  Plus, I think it ultimately gives Minasian a bit more flexibility should another name arise that he likes as well.  

Put it together in the off season when you've got a bit more time and you can do so due diligence.  You don't want to be absolutely obligated to Montgomery either.  What if a couple guys really impress during the interview process.   Then you've got a few months for whoever to start building rapport with the players and you have an entire spring to bring everyone together.  

They could have done it the other way and it would probably have been fine.  I don't think anything isn't right.  Just another way to go about it.  

nm

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