Lose with Ohtani or Win without Ohtani

[oldguy]

On 8/5/2022 at 6:53 PM, Swordsman78 said:

The poll should be:

Lose with Ohtani

Lose without Ohtani.

There is no guaranteed win based soley on trading Ohtani.

Agree.  I choose "Lose without Ohtani."  I'm both a Halo fan and an Ohtani fan.  I'd love to see Shohei play in the postseason, and its just not going to happen in Anaheim.

[Angels 1961]

Win with Duggar

[floplag]

It truly needs a third options, win with him, but the real question is if thats realistic.  Is there a reality in which Moreno will go down that road payroll wise.  I personally dont think he will.
IF these are my only choices i choose the team winning no matter the roster or names on it. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

6 minutes ago, floplag said:

It truly needs a third options, win with him, but the real question is if thats realistic.  Is there a reality in which Moreno will go down that road payroll wise.  I personally dont think he will.
IF these are my only choices i choose the team winning no matter the roster or names on it. 

Who knows, maybe Arte goes crazy budget wise going forward. But I can't think of any scenario where spending money fixes a whole lot right now. FA class this winter isn't that great.

Judge isn't leaving NY. Turner might leave the Dodgers... but lots of teams will be in on him. And even if we got him, how much better are we? Sure, he's a massive upgrade. But we still have so many ?s everywhere else.

[Blarg]

I think if Ohtani could pitch in a 5 man rotation the Angels chances of winning are greater. It not just that the Angels have to employ a 6th starter, whether it's playing a Salt Lake shuffle or a dedicated spot, that pitcher takes up a roster spot and reduces the outings of better pitchers in the rotation. 

It's hard enough to field 5 arms in the rotation but adding a 6th hobbles the Angels over other teams able to use that roster space for another bench player. I creates fewer options for a manager to have that pinch runner for late innings or defensive replacement. 

To move forward with Ohtani I think it would be in the Angels best interest to move to a 5 man rotation, otherwise I don't see the Angels winning any more than 85 games when you are only seeing Ohtani 23 of possible 32 starts like last season. Even if he produces 27 starts, that still leaves 27 starts for a 6th tier pitcher. 

Ohtani becomes a white elephant in terms of total production in a 6 man rotation. A really fun to watch white elephant but a damn costly one all the same. 

[floplag]

1 hour ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Who knows, maybe Arte goes crazy budget wise going forward. But I can't think of any scenario where spending money fixes a whole lot right now. FA class this winter isn't that great.

Judge isn't leaving NY. Turner might leave the Dodgers... but lots of teams will be in on him. And even if we got him, how much better are we? Sure, he's a massive upgrade. But we still have so many ?s everywhere else.

Sure, its possible, but hes had so many chances to do so to date and hasnt.
Ill be pleasantly surprised and happy to be wrong.

We always seem to find ways to rationalize not making moves, im not looking at one off season, im looking at the body of work over the last 3-5.  Every conceivable part we could have needed has been out there, and weve chosen to go in other directions or weren't willing to go where it was necessary to go to get it done.  Business, took priority over baseball.

I do not expect our payroll to ever go over current levels, we will not go into the tax or even approach it.  There is clearly some reason this number of about 180 (AAV) works for Arte and going above it doesnt.

[Dtwncbad]

1 hour ago, Blarg said:

I think if Ohtani could pitch in a 5 man rotation the Angels chances of winning are greater. It not just that the Angels have to employ a 6th starter, whether it's playing a Salt Lake shuffle or a dedicated spot, that pitcher takes up a roster spot and reduces the outings of better pitchers in the rotation. 

It's hard enough to field 5 arms in the rotation but adding a 6th hobbles the Angels over other teams able to use that roster space for another bench player. I creates fewer options for a manager to have that pinch runner for late innings or defensive replacement. 

To move forward with Ohtani I think it would be in the Angels best interest to move to a 5 man rotation, otherwise I don't see the Angels winning any more than 85 games when you are only seeing Ohtani 23 of possible 32 starts like last season. Even if he produces 27 starts, that still leaves 27 starts for a 6th tier pitcher. 

Ohtani becomes a white elephant in terms of total production in a 6 man rotation. A really fun to watch white elephant but a damn costly one all the same. 

If Ohtani really needs to pitch every sixth game instead of every fifth game, that doesn’t mean you have to do a straight six-man rotation (where each of the six get the same number of starts).

You would just need a sixth guy to rotate in where necessary.

I think somebody even mapped this out looking at a full season schedule and the sixth starter got a surprisingly low number of starts.