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POLL: Perry Minasian Trade Deadline Grade


Chuck

Give GM Perry Minasian a grade on his Trade Deadline Deals  

114 members have voted

  1. 1. Give GM Perry Minasian a grade on his Trade Deadline Deals

    • A
      2
    • B
      34
    • C
      32
    • D
      23
    • F
      10
    • Too early to tell
      13


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1 minute ago, tdawg87 said:

Well, I wouldn't call whatever this was "selling". Not even close.

I mean someone has to want our crap.  We found takers for 3 players.  Not sure what team made the most selling trades but I can't imagine that's that far off.  No reason to really think we could've found takers for guys like Lorenzen and Bradley (injured), Tepera and Loup (expensive and underperforming) or any of the others who just either aren't very good, or teams aren't high enough on to give us a return that will do anything for us.

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2 hours ago, Wisconsin27 said:

I'm glad he was active and am fine with each trades respective return in that I can at least understand the idea of each.  That said, I just wish I understood the plan, or "vision," of this organization.  We can joke there isn't one, but that just can't be the case.  These guys (not just Perry, but those working with him) obviously spend hours mapping out a vision.  I just wish I could see it and trust that it comes to fruition.  I don't.

I share your pessimism, sadly, as it's truly hard to understand how any truly competent & mapped-out  "vision" would include signing the likes of Lagares, Wade, Duffy & Velazquez. Which, I would guess, Arte would like to know too...

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1 hour ago, Vlad27Trout27 said:

An F. Created more problems that solutions. 

Add a left fielder (unless Adell randomly turns it around), and a closer to the list of things we need now. 

They choice salery over the returns. The Syndgaard trade and Igleisas trade showed that. This also clearly implies that it's going to be the same bs over again in the off season. can't wait to hear the same old bs in the offseason on Arte willing to increase the payroll for the right player, or that Arte desire to improve the teams. FUCKEN bunch of lies. 

 

Just took a damn astep back 

 

 

Fletcher can easily man an outfield spot. Halos need to be making a play for someone like Swanson in the off season. All three pieces dealt have been disappointing this year, I dont get the romanticism of unloading Iggy/Marsh. Got that huge albatross off their throats and a top prospect that wasnt going anywhere with JT behind the plate in Philly. Solid B for fatboy PM.

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My grades for the trades:

Marsh for O'Hoppe: A+:  I can't believe Marsh got traded, but after finding out what the Angels got, I definitely was on board with it.  The Angels badly needed an upper level catching prospect and got one in this trade.   Losing Marsh hurts, he was a top 50 prospect and is still very young and maybe could've started to figure it out but it didn't look promising as he's striking out 35% of his at bats.  His glove is great, but is it Gold glove level good?  Debatable.  However, glove first outfielders are easier to find than decent catchers, so I definitely see the reasoning behind this trade.  If Stassi was having the year he had last season, this trade probably wouldn't have happened, but Stassi looks lost now too.  This fills a big need for the Angels for a replaceable player.  If you guys miss Marsh so much, the Angels can always sign Juan Legares again. 

Iglesias for Chavez & Davidson: A+++:  Wow, I can't believe this trade.  Now don't get me wrong, Iglesias is a great reliever and in my book still is.  His peripherals are great, he's just been giving up a lot of meatballs at terrible times. But giving the kind of contract to a closer for a team that has so many holes and is terrible is a giant waste of money.  Now at the time of the extension, I liked the deal because he was great and was worth almost 3 WAR last season, but now after seeing the many glaring holes the team has, the 16 million will hopefully be used well to start building some depth on the roster.  Iglesias also has a concerning drop in velocity and swing and miss rate from last season and he's 32 with 3 more seasons to go.  To get out of a pricey contract, that is in the beginning stages of going south, without retaining or giving up a prospect is a giant win.  Chavez is a bullpen filler for the rest of the year replacing Iglesias.  Davidson was Atlanta's 5th ranked prospect at the start of the season and could be a bottom of the rotation starter or swing guy out of the bullpen.  You can never have too much pitching.  To recap, get out of a pricey contract, got a starting pitcher prospect and a replacement bullpen arm for the rest of the season.  A+++

Syndergaard for Moniak & Sanchez: B-: We all knew Syndergaard was gone when the season started to go south quickly.  He was solid, but when you're paying someone 21 million, you expect star production.  So while Syndergaard did produce, he produced like an above average starter and not a star.  So while it was a worth while gamble to sign him, the gamble didn't produce a jackpot.  Better to get something for him then to keep him and get nothing.  The return is fairly light, but I didn't expect too much for basically an average starter being paid star money. Moniak is Marsh's replacement.  He also strikes out a lot like Marsh.  Maybe Moniak will grow an epic beard like Marsh.  How do you feel if you're Adell? You see your good friend traded and thinking finally LF is all mine, then all of a sudden they trade for someone that's going to battle you for playing time. Guy can't catch a break.  Sanchez might turn into a decent player, which the Angels desperately need everywhere.

I hope these trades signal a rebuild in earnest.  Maybe Ohtani will be traded in the offseason so that teams can adjust offers to match the Angels' needs and replace the pieces they trade.  In a vacuum, I like these deals and give Perry an A. These are worthwhile trades that helps build up the farm system and hopefully produce players that can play at the MLB level and get some depth.  Hopefully Perry and Moreno learned that it's important to build depth and will use the money they've saved more wisely this offseason, but I'm not holding my breath. 

For those of you bashing these trades, this team was deeply flawed at the start of the season.  That 50 game start was a mirage that was helped by the players having super hot starts.  The reality is, this team is way too top heavy and reliant on aging and injury prone players.  Look at teams like the Yankees and Dodgers.  They have a solid deep lineup where there really isn't any easy outs, a deep starting rotation, and devastating bullpens.  They've had their share of injuries but since they have solid farm systems and depth, they're able to keep going.  These type of trades aren't meant to be sexy, but they're meant to help next season's team and beyond.  Will O'Hoppe, Davidson, Moniak, and Sanchez all pan out? Probably not, but if they don't, you're only paying the minimum to find out, plus you'll have 3-4 seasons to find out.  We already know how this season is winding up. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Wisconsin27 said:

I'm glad he was active and am fine with each trades respective return in that I can at least understand the idea of each.  That said, I just wish I understood the plan, or "vision," of this organization.  We can joke there isn't one, but that just can't be the case.  These guys (not just Perry, but those working with him) obviously spend hours mapping out a vision.  I just wish I could see it and trust that it comes to fruition.  I don't.

The plan is to appease dear leader Arte Moreno and his need for 3 million fans next year.

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Created a path for all of Marsh, Adell, and Ward to get regular playing time even if one of them will do it for a different team

Got something for a pending FA who may still sign here next year

Cut loose an expensive closer who seems to check out mentally way too often for my taste

The return isn't really ML ready talent but there's still an off season to work on that

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For all the skepticism I have towards Minasian, I will say that we are at a really interesting juncture in his time here….

We’re at a point where he’s been on the job long enough to start filtering through and moving on from Eppler’s farm. The MLB team has obviously not performed well these last two years, and Minasian’s acquisitions are large part of that, but also too are some of the internal players Eppler either rushed or, perhaps failed to develop. We can’t really judge Minasian’s FO on their minor league development yet because his guys have not really made it, exception Silseth. And while they obviously have influence on Adell, Marsh, others from Eppler’s tenure, doesn’t mean that the philosophies jive or took smoothly. This could be the start of a purge of Eppler’s talent.

And we don’t really know yet if that’s good or bad. Eppler’s farm haven’t really had a true full opportunity to prove themselves yet, but maybe this is Minasian deciding he doesn’t like what he’s seeing and he’s clearing the way for his developmental org. Generally speaking.

If we start seeing guys like Silseth, Murphy, Bachman, Bush, Joyce, Daniel, DiChiara even start impacting the team out of the gate this September or next year, it’ll be a pretty stark contrast to Adell, Marsh, Canning, Thaiss, even Suarez and Sandoval and their initial struggles, and be a really strong endorsement for at least the development and minor league plan Perry has in place. That’s maybe his last shot. Perhaps it explains some of the aggressive promotions and assignments.

Edited by totdprods
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I'm happy with it. The team sucked before the deadline and they'll suck after, just cheaper and with more minor leaguers. But here's my overall take.

Marsh: They gave up on him too early. Flat out. They'll regret this when he's a stud in three years. Having said that, the more I watch and read up on O'Hoppe, he's the real deal. He's a field general, and a captain of pitchers. I comp him with Chris Iannetta. But dealing Marsh also opens up an everyday slot for Adell and his bat needs to develop into a difference maker and you can't do that in AAA. 

Syndergaard: Everyone else was disappointed, but I was happy with the return. I was expecting relievers or middle infielders in AA. Nothing special. And they got nothing special. Mickey Moniak it's a fine 4th outfielder with upside and Jadiel Sanchez is a lottery ticket with his exit velocities from both sides of the plate. Mostly, they saved money. Great. 

Iglesias: I didn't think anyone would take on that contract. He's making 16 million a year for four years. That's an awful price to pay for a closer that's not someone incredible, like Hader. Not only did the Braves take it on, but they added a personal favorite of mine in Tucker Davidson, who I think will be like Jose Suarez, decent in the rotation of necessary but very effective across multiple innings as a reliever. And they got Jesse Chavez too, which is just hilarious. He's a great reliever this year. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Docwaukee said:

heh.  This poor bastard is either some sort of evil genius or he has no f'n clue what he's doing.  

I watched a guy trapped in mud put his truck in reverse and back into first and back and forth for about 15-25 minutes once before he finally decided to hop out to see how bad it was... Dude did a face plant into the mud when he did.  

All I could think of just now.

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well said @Second Base

I don’t know how to grade. I like each deal individually for what it was just fine. I just feel in the broader context it’s a bit jumbled. Sending signals they fully intend to compete in 2023, but dealt away pieces that would help that team making more holes, and acquiring not much to fill 2023 holes, at least on paper. 

Would’ve been interesting to see what offers were murmured for Rengifo or someone like Quijada. I suspect Toronto might have been inquiring on Rengifo given they acquired Merrifield and were at least connected to Raisel at a point. Maybe they wanted Rengifo and Raisel if they were to assume that money. Maybe the Angels were looking at Groshans or Biggio to replace Luis. I think I just would have liked to have seen one deal address some 2023 needs more, but that can also be done in winter, especially with a seller’s market. I have to think someone like Ward, Walsh, or Suarez or Sandoval could have gone a long way to ensuring we didn’t see Gosselin, Sierra, Lagares, Thomas types getting some many ABs. 

I just don’t have much confidence in Perry basically improving 10 spots on the roster in one winter.

 

Edited by totdprods
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4 minutes ago, totdprods said:

well said @Second Base

I don’t know how to grade. I like each deal individually for what it was just fine. I just feel in the broader context it’s a bit jumbled. Sending signals they fully intend to compete in 2023, but dealt away pieces that would help that team making more holes, and acquiring not much to fill 2023 holes, at least on paper. 

Would’ve been interesting to see what offers were murmured for Rengifo or someone like Quijada. I suspect Toronto might have been inquiring on Rengifo given they acquired Merrifield and were at least connected to Raisel at a point. Maybe they wanted Rengifo and Raisel if they were to assume that money. Maybe the Angels were looking at Groshans or Biggio to replace Luis. I think I just would have liked to have seen one deal address some 2023 needs more, but that can also be done in winter, especially with a seller’s market. I have to think someone like Ward, Walsh, or Suarez or Sandoval could have gone a long way to ensuring we didn’t see Gosselin, Sierra, Lagares, Thomas types getting some many ABs. 

I just don’t have much confidence in Perry basically improving 10 spots on the roster in one winter.

 

He'll need luck on his side. He's got some money to play with and will spend it, but we can't buy our way back into contention. He'll need some things to break right. 

1. Improvement at catcher. Stassi, Thaiss, O'Hoppe, doesn't matter. Someone needs to perform. 

2. First base is an offensively productive position and Walsh had been awful for a while now. A change is needed. 

3. Rendon needs to be healthy AND productive. 

4. Adell needs to reach his potential immediately. 

5. The Angels upside minor league pitching needs to impact the game, in the rotation or bullpen. Chris Rodriguez, Sam Bachman, Ky Bush

If all that happens, then whatever Minasian does to augment the team via free agency is fine. 

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3 hours ago, mmc said:

I mean someone has to want our crap.  We found takers for 3 players.  Not sure what team made the most selling trades but I can't imagine that's that far off.  No reason to really think we could've found takers for guys like Lorenzen and Bradley (injured), Tepera and Loup (expensive and underperforming) or any of the others who just either aren't very good, or teams aren't high enough on to give us a return that will do anything for us.

So, people should gloss over that the person heading the sell off is the same guy who chose to add all those pieces you are classifying as our crap?

Of the three expensive RPs, he moved the one with the best chance of rebounding.  He's created two new holes on a roster littered with holes, and now we have to hope that the guy that orchestrated the mess "will do a better job of building the roster"."

"Please Sir, I'd like some more" -- Oliver Twist

 

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3 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

So, people should gloss over that the person heading the sell off is the same guy who chose to add all those pieces you are classifying as our crap?

Of the three expensive RPs, he moved the one with the best chance of rebounding.  He's created two new holes on a roster littered with holes, and now we have to hope that the guy that orchestrated the mess "will do a better job of building the roster"."

"Please Sir, I'd like some more" -- Oliver Twist

 

If we’re just talking my opinion personally I don’t give a damn about the 2023 team as I don’t think we have a shot regardless.  My only complaint is that we didn’t sell more, though we did sell more than I was expecting which is why I gave it a favorable grade

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9 minutes ago, mmc said:

If we’re just talking my opinion personally I don’t give a damn about the 2023 team as I don’t think we have a shot regardless.  My only complaint is that we didn’t sell more, though we did sell more than I was expecting which is why I gave it a favorable grade

Yep, would have been ecstatic moving Loup for a used spider cobweb, just to move that salary. 

It's an F for me less because of the actual moves and more because of what comes off as having zero plan.  There needs to be a better end goal than "guys I really need to do better".  

Right now, after last season's "lets build a pen full of different looks" and this season's "let's build a super expensive pen", why should anyone expect different?

Literally just throwing shit on a wall hoping something will stick.

My favorite part.... Reporter: " Can you build a winner in 2023?".  Perry Minasian: "We'll see".

 

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9 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

So, people should gloss over that the person heading the sell off is the same guy who chose to add all those pieces you are classifying as our crap?

Of the three expensive RPs, he moved the one with the best chance of rebounding.  He's created two new holes on a roster littered with holes, and now we have to hope that the guy that orchestrated the mess "will do a better job of building the roster"."

"Please Sir, I'd like some more" -- Oliver Twist

 

'I have to build a better roster next year' 

So I'll trade my best defensive OFer who probably has the best chance to improve at the plate of all my young players and a closer who has a really good chance at rebounding that I didn't want to trade last year when he didn't have a high salary because I wanted to keep him.  So the team makes a commitment to him for four years and pitches him halfway through his first year.  To save money for what? 

And what did we get for our main expiring asset?   a fourth OFer because hey.  proximity.  

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2 minutes ago, Docwaukee said:

'I have to build a better roster next year' 

So I'll trade my best defensive OFer who probably has the best chance to improve at the plate of all my young players and a closer who has a really good chance at rebounding that I didn't want to trade last year when he didn't have a high salary because I wanted to keep him.  So the team makes a commitment to him for four years and pitches him halfway through his first year.  To save money for what? 

And what did we get for our main expiring asset?   a fourth OFer because hey.  proximity.  

Remain Calm All Is Well GIF

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50 minutes ago, Second Base said:

He'll need luck on his side. He's got some money to play with and will spend it, but we can't buy our way back into contention. He'll need some things to break right. 

1. Improvement at catcher. Stassi, Thaiss, O'Hoppe, doesn't matter. Someone needs to perform. 

2. First base is an offensively productive position and Walsh had been awful for a while now. A change is needed. 

3. Rendon needs to be healthy AND productive. 

4. Adell needs to reach his potential immediately. 

5. The Angels upside minor league pitching needs to impact the game, in the rotation or bullpen. Chris Rodriguez, Sam Bachman, Ky Bush

If all that happens, then whatever Minasian does to augment the team via free agency is fine. 

I beg to differ, if Arte gave Perry to spend where the Mets and Dodgers spend next season, they can definitely contend.  The problem is that Moreno isn't letting Perry spend above a certain amount.  When the big boys spend 300 million and you're spending 60-65% of that, then you need to beat them in other areas like scouting and development.  Unfortunately, Arte doesn't invest in that either and they're saddled with large contracts for 3-4 players. 

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