Angels and Reds have discussed Castillo trade, remain far apart

[Inside Pitch]

3 hours ago, khouse said:

In reading some of what the Met's fans have said...it's likely due to the fact he sat out the 2020 season but who really knows...

Ask a cat what they think of a German Shepherd.

[jsnpritchett]

15 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Ask a cat what they think of a German Shepherd.

[Kendo36]

Trading for Luis Castillo and signing either Ray/Scherzer/Stroman puts you in the World Series conversation. I think THAT should be the goal.

[Inside Pitch]

8 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

Sir, kindly refrain from laying waste to my narratives.

[Mark68]

19 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

Awwww...

[Erstad Grit]

1 hour ago, jsnpritchett said:

You're going to pay him $34M over the next 2 years, plus a $4M buyout after that, to be a "decent bench utility corner infielder"?

No... pay him $34M over the next 2 years, plus a $4M buyout after that, to be a "decent bench utility corner infielder in order to land Castillo while keeping all our top prospects. 

I'd prefer to just sign Ray, but I could see taking advantage of a Reds team desperate to shred payroll. If they are hell bent on dumping Moose and we could land Castillo, Gray, and Garrett taking on Moose wouldn't be that bad IMO. Dodgers have been doing this for a while. They took on Price to get Betts. They took on Crawford to get Gonzalez. 

[jsnpritchett]

43 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

No... pay him $34M over the next 2 years, plus a $4M buyout after that, to be a "decent bench utility corner infielder in order to land Castillo while keeping all our top prospects. 

I'd prefer to just sign Ray, but I could see taking advantage of a Reds team desperate to shred payroll. If they are hell bent on dumping Moose and we could land Castillo, Gray, and Garrett taking on Moose wouldn't be that bad IMO. Dodgers have been doing this for a while. They took on Price to get Betts. They took on Crawford to get Gonzalez. 

But you're still going to have to give up something in trade to get Castillo and Moustakas.  Even if it's a marginal prospect, then you're still paying Moustakas a total of $38M to be a bench player, plus ~$7-8M in 2022 and ~$12.5M or so in 2023 for Castillo.  So you've now laid out $58M for 2 years of Castillo and Moustakas, plus whatever prospects you traded.  Still seems like a bad use of resources.

Edited November 29, 2021 by jsnpritchett

[Jason]

Maybe Barria can be in the trade mix. I won’t miss that guy at all 

[tdawg87]

2 minutes ago, Jason said:

Maybe Barria can be in the trade mix. I won’t miss that guy at all 

That's why he won't be in the trade mix.

Though he's really not that bad and honestly deserves a spot in the rotation over Canning. I could see some team seeing his potential and wanting in on that shit.

[totdprods]

Just now, tdawg87 said:

That's why he won't be in the trade mix.

Though he's really not that bad and honestly deserves a spot in the rotation over Canning. I could see some team seeing his potential and wanting in on that shit.

With how tight the Reds are, Barria has some value being given the #5 spot and 160-180 IP. 

He's basically a throw in, but it clears a roster spot for the Angels to nab someone else and maybe he is the difference between the value in two other options in the deal. Say, Jackson v. Placencia, or Bush v. Daniel, or whatever.

[Warfarin]

6 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

That's why he won't be in the trade mix.

Though he's really not that bad and honestly deserves a spot in the rotation over Canning. I could see some team seeing his potential and wanting in on that shit.

Yeah.  Barria is out of options, and if we fill out our rotation, he may get squeezed out and become a long reliever, which is sorta underutilizing him.  I think it'd be best to use him in a trade.  He wouldn't fetch anything that great, but he can be use as a complementary piece in a bigger trade, or perhaps used to acquire a good reliever or versatile, good bench player.

[tdawg87]

1 minute ago, Warfarin said:

Yeah.  Barria is out of options, and if we fill out our rotation, he may get squeezed out and become a long reliever, which is sorta underutilizing him.  I think it'd be best to use him in a trade.  He wouldn't fetch anything that great, but he can be use as a complementary piece in a bigger trade, or perhaps used to acquire a good reliever or versatile, good bench player.

I am fine trading him, but if he isn't traded he fits perfectly as the #6 guy in the rotation. I think he's underrated @stormngt (got your back) and a lot better than people think.

Also I got his autograph drunk at 11 am so I want him to have a HOF career.

[Jason]

11 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

That's why he won't be in the trade mix.

Though he's really not that bad and honestly deserves a spot in the rotation over Canning. I could see some team seeing his potential and wanting in on that shit.

I know  I’d be fine with trading Canning too 

Edited November 29, 2021 by Jason

[Erstad Grit]

42 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

But you're still going to have to give up something in trade to get Castillo and Moustakas.  Even if it's a marginal prospect, then you're still paying Moustakas a total of $38M to be a bench player, plus ~$7-8M in 2022 and ~$12.5M or so in 2023 for Castillo.  So you've now laid out $58M for 2 years of Castillo and Moustakas, plus whatever prospects you traded.  Still seems like a bad use of resources.

I don't think trading our top prospects for 2 years of Castillo is a good use of resources.  

[jsnpritchett]

22 minutes ago, Erstad Grit said:

I don't think trading our top prospects for 2 years of Castillo is a good use of resources.  

I agree, as I said earlier in the thread.  I don't really see a path forward for an Angels/Reds trade that I'd be happy with.

[tdawg87]

9 minutes ago, jsnpritchett said:

I agree, as I said earlier in the thread.  I don't really see a path forward for an Angels/Reds trade that I'd be happy with.

Not with what they're asking.

But I'm Always going to play devil's advocate here and say we will hate every big trade because unfortunately you gotta give up a lot for premium talent.

Edited November 29, 2021 by tdawg87

[stormngt]

7 hours ago, DCAngelsFan said:

I dunno about "drastic" - but maybe "necessary"

Management has to see that if we want to keep two likely first-ballot hall-of-famers together for the next several years, we have to give them a path to the World Series.  Ohtani, I think, will be loyal to a fault.  But I'm certain he doesn't want to spend his entire MLB career watching the playoffs from Japan,  no matter how much money we have for him.  He can get money from any team - we need to give him a path to the championship.    

And you know what?  Arte is 75 - his window is closing, too.  It's hard to imagine he'll ever be in a better position than the next 2 or 3 years.  

He's been burned by big free agent signings (trades) before - but his footprints were all over the backs of his gm's in those - he needs to trust his GM, just tell him "By Any Means Necessary" and  sign the checks. 

Doesn't Ohtani have to come close to repeating this last season performance a few more times before being considered furst ballet HOF?

[IheartLA]

12 hours ago, Erstad Grit said:

I don't think trading our top prospects for 2 years of Castillo is a good use of resources.  

If perry has two years to win to keep his job it could potentially be a great use in his mind.

also our top prospects have been basically replacement level at the big league level in their limited time recently. (Adell,Marsh,Canning,Detmers) I’m not sure these guys will be game changers.

[Warfarin]

13 minutes ago, IheartLA said:

If perry has two years to win to keep his job it could potentially be a great use in his mind.

also our top prospects have been basically replacement level at the big league level in their limited time recently. (Adell,Marsh,Canning,Detmers) I’m not sure these guys will be game changers.

Detmers literally went from being drafted to pitching in the majors in a year's worth of time, after not even having pitched in a minor league season in 2020.  He has quite a bit of potential and is likely going to be solid.

Marsh and Adell both have a ton of potential.  Marsh has a high floor in that he projects to be a good defensive CF, so he just needs to have a decent bat to make him a solid MLB player.

Adell has a ton of potential, but also a low floor because of his contact issues.  Still, he was making steady progress until his injury, and he is still incredibly young.

Canning, I think, probably has the least potential of the four.  I think we sorta see who he is largely at this point.  He's more of a backend rotation SP who can flash mid-rotation stuff.  

Still - these are all players that teams need to be successful in the long-term.  Good, cheap, young players to complement the very expensive veterans that we have.

[tdawg87]

16 minutes ago, IheartLA said:

If perry has two years to win to keep his job it could potentially be a great use in his mind.

also our top prospects have been basically replacement level at the big league level in their limited time recently. (Adell,Marsh,Canning,Detmers) I’m not sure these guys will be game changers.

You base that on their "limited time"?

[eligrba]

12 hours ago, Warfarin said:

Yeah.  Barria is out of options, and if we fill out our rotation, he may get squeezed out and become a long reliever, which is sorta underutilizing him.  I think it'd be best to use him in a trade.  He wouldn't fetch anything that great, but he can be use as a complementary piece in a bigger trade, or perhaps used to acquire a good reliever or versatile, good bench player.

Heaney was signed for 8.5 mill. Barria is,  at worse, just as good as Heaney. 

[ten ocho recon scout]

55 minutes ago, IheartLA said:

If perry has two years to win to keep his job it could potentially be a great use in his mind.

also our top prospects have been basically replacement level at the big league level in their limited time recently. (Adell,Marsh,Canning,Detmers) I’m not sure these guys will be game changers.

Of all of them, Detmers is the one Im least excited to lose. Who knows, he could be the next newcomb(?). 

But he likely ends up a solid middle of the rotation guy, if not better. And its been years since we made one of those, let alone had one we could rely on for several years.

[Cosmo_Kramer]

29 minutes ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Of all of them, Detmers is the one Im least excited to lose. Who knows, he could be the next newcomb(?). 

But he likely ends up a solid middle of the rotation guy, if not better. And its been years since we made one of those, let alone had one we could rely on for several years.

Would love to get Castillo if they can keep Marsh and Detmers

[Taylor]

18 hours ago, ten ocho recon scout said:

Ill say this. And @Dochalo is likely going to throw a shoe at me and call me an idiot, but it "feels" different this year. In that we may actually finally do something drastic.

AJ right now:

[IheartLA]

4 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

You base that on their "limited time"?

Some top 5 prospects like Franco and Tatis play good right away. Some like Lux and Senzel just loiter.