Mariners

[Torridd]

I just took at the last box score and the Ms hitters appeared to be no better than ours for a 90-win team. How were they so good?

[Jason]

My cousin is a huge M’s fan and he text me last night “Stupid Ass Angels”. my response to him

 

[Angel Oracle]

Three things:

M’s weren’t decimated by injuries.

M’s had ridiculous clutch numbers.

M’s bullpen was ridiculously good.

[mmc]

1 hour ago, Torridd said:

I just took at the last box score and the Ms hitters appeared to be no better than ours for a 90-win team. How were they so good?

They were good at all of the things we sucked at, defense, bullpen, and clutch performances

[tdawg87]

Luck.

[UndertheHalo]

Just watch the games.  Overall the Mariners to a much greater extent are not huge fuck ups like the Angels.  They play much better defense.  Their pitching out of the bullpen in particular is much better.  The organization appears to run better.  That’s it.  They seem better coached and they seem better prepared in game.  What can you attribute that to ? Analytics prep maybe ? More scouting ?  That seems to be the main explanation for the difference this season.  They don’t have more talent at the major league level.  Good for them.  Seriously. 

Edited October 4, 2021 by UndertheHalo

[Sully151]

They played better within the Division.

[ukyah]

they had a massively negative run differential. i don't care what they do well, if you have 90 wins with that kind of RD, that's luck.

[Stradling]

13 minutes ago, ukyah said:

they had a massively negative run differential. i don't care what they do well, if you have 90 wins with that kind of RD, that's luck.

Yep.  They had a good season based on their record.  When you look at run differential they should have won 77 games.  We should have one 75 or 76.  

[tomsred]

I can sum this up quite quickly.  The Angels record vs. Oakland was 4-15, and the Mariners record against Oakland was 15-4.

[T.G.]

[Inside Pitch]

53 minutes ago, tdawg87 said:

Luck.

Wrong...  It's Fun Differential.  

The Mariners have learned the key to being clutch through "Fun", to such a degree that they had the "clutchiest" season in MLB history.  The fact that the players hold the GM in contempt to such a degree they openly criticize him and a franchise icon like Weaver's catching partner goes on record as saying they have gone four years without speaking is just noise.  Scoreboard baby!

Everything about the 2021 Mariners is totally repeatable and the team with a negative run differential, a 92 OPS+ and a 98 ERA+ is going to run the table next year.

See them rise!

[BTH]

The Mariners had way more consistent starting pitching than the Angels did, and had an excellent bullpen. That's the difference, in my eyes.

[T.G.]

1 minute ago, Inside Pitch said:

Wrong...  It's Fun Differential.  

The Mariners have learned the key to being clutch through "Fun", to such a degree that they had the "clutchiest" season in MLB history.  The fact that the players hold the GM in contempt to such a degree they openly criticize him and a franchise icon like Weaver's catching partner goes on record as saying they have gone four years without speaking is just noise.  Scoreboard baby!

Everything about the 2021 Mariners is totally repeatable and the team with a negative run differential, a 92 OPS+ and a 98 ERA+ is going to run the table next year.

See them rise!

[Inside Pitch]

BTW, the Toronto Blue Jays....

Had to play at home in three different parks... 

183 run differential,115 OPS+, 113 ERA+.

Only won one more game.

 

[ukyah]

8 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

Wrong...  It's Fun Differential.  

The Mariners have learned the key to being clutch through "Fun", to such a degree that they had the "clutchiest" season in MLB history.  The fact that the players hold the GM in contempt to such a degree they openly criticize him and a franchise icon like Weaver's catching partner goes on record as saying they have gone four years without speaking is just noise.  Scoreboard baby!

Everything about the 2021 Mariners is totally repeatable and the team with a negative run differential, a 92 OPS+ and a 98 ERA+ is going to run the table next year.

See them rise!

what's this story?

[Inside Pitch]

6 minutes ago, Trendon said:

The Mariners had way more consistent starting pitching than the Angels did, and had an excellent bullpen. That's the difference, in my eyes.

More consistently bad SP.   

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=sta&lg=all&qual=0&type=8&season=2021&month=0&season1=2021&ind=0&team=0,ts&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2021-01-01&enddate=2021-12-31&sort=20,d

Seriously..   The bullpen and non atrocious defense had a bigger impact on that team's pitching than did their starters.

[T.G.]

Just now, Inside Pitch said:

More consistently bad SP.   

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=sta&lg=all&qual=0&type=8&season=2021&month=0&season1=2021&ind=0&team=0,ts&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2021-01-01&enddate=2021-12-31&sort=20,d

Seriously..   The bullpen and non atrocious defense had a bigger impact on that team's pitching than did their starters.

[Inside Pitch]

11 minutes ago, ukyah said:

what's this story?

 

[BTH]

7 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

More consistently bad SP.   

https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=sta&lg=all&qual=0&type=8&season=2021&month=0&season1=2021&ind=0&team=0,ts&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2021-01-01&enddate=2021-12-31&sort=20,d

Seriously..   The bullpen and non atrocious defense had a bigger impact on that team's pitching than did their starters.

Their main core of SP could be counted on almost every turn in the rotation to not be AWFUL:

Flexen: 31 GS, 179.2 IP, 3.61 ERA
Gilbert: 24 GS, 119.1 IP, 4.68 ERA
Gonzales: 25 GS, 143.1 IP, 3.96 ERA
Kikuchi: 29 GS, 157 IP, 4.41 ERA

The Angels were trotting out Bundy, Heaney, Naughton, Junk, Detmers, etc. at times.

[ten ocho recon scout]

14 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

 

Kyle Seaoscia

[Jason]

15 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

 

I miss Weaver 

[T.G.]

3 hours ago, Torridd said:

How were they so good?

[Inside Pitch]

15 minutes ago, Trendon said:

Their main core of SP could be counted on almost every turn in the rotation to not be AWFUL:

Flexen: 31 GS, 179.2 IP, 3.61 ERA
Gilbert: 24 GS, 119.1 IP, 4.68 ERA
Gonzales: 25 GS, 143.1 IP, 3.96 ERA
Kikuchi: 29 GS, 157 IP, 4.41 ERA

The Angels were trotting out Bundy, Heaney, Naughton, Junk, Detmers, etc. at times.

Congrats -- the year is 2021 and you're pointing to raw ERA for pitchers in a pitchers park...   The ballpark, the bullpen, the defense all played a part in those results.   Those four did however manage to provide innings so, I agree that was a strong point.
 

[TheLordofOuts]