When will the Halos next seriously contend for the post-season?

[Angel Oracle]

Have at it.

[failos]

[Slegnaac]

When they have superior pitching.

[Lou]

5 minutes ago, Slegnaac said:

When they have superior pitching.

Fuck 

[mmc]

When Oakland does their inevitable sell off within the next couple years and the Astros take a step back, which could be as early as next season.  Course this will likely coincide with Seattle’s #2 ranked farm translating to MLB success, so who knows.  I could see us running the division during that grace period where those 2 teams regress and the Mariners aren’t at their peak yet, though we’ll have to play our cards right

[tdawg87]

No.

[Revad]

I agree.

[ELEVEN]

About 3 years after Arte Moreno draws his final breath.

 

 

Too soon?

[T.G.]

How the hell should we know?

[ScottT]

2022

[rottiesworld]

When Moreno sells the team and we get a new owner who will not interfere with what the GM is doing.

[Angels_Make_Me_Drink]

2023. Next year we might be in a WC spot if some things break our way such as health and some lucky pickups but I think we're going to need another season of growth from our young SP core and building up or RP while adding/retaining a SS and some veteran SP. 

Hoping for next year, expecting 2023. 

[notherhalo]

probably around the time Trout is retiring 

[Docwaukee]

there are a lot of systemic problem in my opinion.  could they overcome a bunch of those with health and talent?  we'll see.  I'm as hopeful with the developing talent level as I've been yet as disappointed as I've ever been with the way the org is being run and their leadership.  I think the combo of Arte and Maddon is a major obstacle to the success of this team and I think Minasian is going to be painted into a corner with the moves he's allowed to make.  I look at other well run orgs as a comparison and actually see that the Angels have more potential talent than someone like the Giants yet for reasons, the Angels just can't figure it out.  The whole is never greater than the sum of the parts for the halos.  At least it hasn't been for awhile.  And that seemed to be the hallmark of early MS teams.  

One of my goals for the team this year was to avoid the extremes of horrible.  Granted, a bunch of the reasons we haven't been able to accomplish that is due to injury, but in spite of that we've still had the vast majority of our pen perform terribly and our defense has been catastrophic.  

An average defense and pen and avoiding truly awful performances in other areas like at the plate or SP will make this team much better.  I look around this team and see a lot of really good if not great players.  It's the truly awful one that offset all of that.  I don't even know what to say anymore frankly as history could repeat itself in 2022.  And if it does then shame on the team and org.  

[LAA Road Tripper]

The first line of Doc’s post is about as accurate as one could get and his description of the organization just got better from there. This is a less-with-more franchise without a legitimate excuse.

[Lou]

51 minutes ago, LAA Road Tripper said:

The first line of Doc’s post is about as accurate as one could get and his description of the organization just got better from there. This is a less-with-more franchise without a legitimate excuse.

Crap, now I'm going to have to read his post. 

[eligrba]

12 hours ago, Dochalo said:

there are a lot of systemic problem in my opinion.  could they overcome a bunch of those with health and talent?  we'll see.  I'm as hopeful with the developing talent level as I've been yet as disappointed as I've ever been with the way the org is being run and their leadership.  I think the combo of Arte and Maddon is a major obstacle to the success of this team and I think Minasian is going to be painted into a corner with the moves he's allowed to make.  I look at other well run orgs as a comparison and actually see that the Angels have more potential talent than someone like the Giants yet for reasons, the Angels just can't figure it out.  The whole is never greater than the sum of the parts for the halos.  At least it hasn't been for awhile.  And that seemed to be the hallmark of early MS teams.  

One of my goals for the team this year was to avoid the extremes of horrible.  Granted, a bunch of the reasons we haven't been able to accomplish that is due to injury, but in spite of that we've still had the vast majority of our pen perform terribly and our defense has been catastrophic.  

An average defense and pen and avoiding truly awful performances in other areas like at the plate or SP will make this team much better.  I look around this team and see a lot of really good if not great players.  It's the truly awful one that offset all of that.  I don't even know what to say anymore frankly as history could repeat itself in 2022.  And if it does then shame on the team and org.  

I agree. It is becoming more apparent the problem is systemic and I suspect rooted in player evaluation, scouting and development.  However, over the past couple years, it looks like player development is improving.  The scouting and evaluations continue to be either inaccurate or ignored.  I think the current philosophy is sound but the execution is poor.  The most obvious example involves shifting the defense but pitching away from the shift, which seems to happen lots.  It's almost like there are several game plans being implemented independently.

Thankfully, the clubhouse vibe issue sounds like it has been fixed.

[Taylor]

"Next year"

But next year, the answer will also be "next year."

[Docwaukee]

4 hours ago, eligrba said:

I agree. It is becoming more apparent the problem is systemic and I suspect rooted in player evaluation, scouting and development.  However, over the past couple years, it looks like player development is improving.  The scouting and evaluations continue to be either inaccurate or ignored.  I think the current philosophy is sound but the execution is poor.  The most obvious example involves shifting the defense but pitching away from the shift, which seems to happen lots.  It's almost like there are several game plans being implemented independently.

Thankfully, the clubhouse vibe issue sounds like it has been fixed.

Personally I think they've done a nice job in scouting and PD with what resources they've had available.  From that standpoint I feel like they've gotten a lot out of a little.  Especially considering where they started.  It's the approach for the major league club that's just puzzling.  It's actually a bit odd at how poor of a job has been done in terms of finding even halfway decent filler.  With the exception of the occasional util guy or random pen arm, the last three years has been a collection of fairly extreme awfulness.

When you are in a position where you need 9 guys to do as close to as well as they've ever done and not be as bad as they've been at any given point you are setting yourself up for failure.  You can catch lightning in a bottle here or there.  But not 9 times or even 5 times a year.  You have to know who you are and who you eventually want to become instead of faking your way to trying to be that before you're ready.    

[T.G.]

1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

You have to know who you are and who you eventually want to become instead of faking your way to trying to be that before you're ready.    

Are you talking about @Taylor?

[Docwaukee]

4 minutes ago, True Grich said:

Are you talking about @Taylor?

Noooooo.  Of course not.  

 

Maybe.  

[TheLordofOuts]

When we stop drinking Jobu’s rum 

[Taylor]

6 minutes ago, True Grich said:

Are you talking about @Taylor?

I'm the most authentic person you know.

[AngelsFaninGA]

1 hour ago, Dochalo said:

Personally I think they've done a nice job in scouting and PD with what resources they've had available.  From that standpoint I feel like they've gotten a lot out of a little.  Especially considering where they started.  It's the approach for the major league club that's just puzzling.  It's actually a bit odd at how poor of a job has been done in terms of finding even halfway decent filler.  With the exception of the occasional util guy or random pen arm, the last three years has been a collection of fairly extreme awfulness.

When you are in a position where you need 9 guys to do as close to as well as they've ever done and not be as bad as they've been at any given point you are setting yourself up for failure.  You can catch lightning in a bottle here or there.  But not 9 times or even 5 times a year.  You have to know who you are and who you eventually want to become instead of faking your way to trying to be that before you're ready.    

Can't speak for other teams that I don't follow as closely but our bad players (the bottom quarter to third of the roster) tend to be not just bad, but disastrously awful. Tons of guys with 6+ ERA's across meaningful innings, and in prior years guys like Joyce and Ibanez batting .180 across meaningful at bats. I'm baffled that they continue to strike out on these signings every year. 

[T.G.]

2 minutes ago, Taylor said:

I'm the most authentic person you know.