Official 2021 Trade Deadline Discussion Thread

[Inside Pitch]

14 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

I would do Scherzer for Adams and maybe another low level guy.  That's it.  Assuming an extension.  No to Turner.  Too much cost to acquire and not enough control.  

I would still move Cobb, Iglesias and Heaney for prospects.  I would move any of the rest of the pen if someone would give us anything of even remote value.  Sans Mayers.  

I would move Jose Iglesias in a heart beat.  I don't have a problem with Fletcher at SS for the rest of the year.  Although I agree he's not the long term option.  

The pen is so bad that I don't think it will have that big of an impact to lose Iglesias.  Maybe 2 games for the rest of the year.  I'd bring up half a dozen guys in AA/AAA and let them ham and egg it for the rest of the season.  I would expect that at least one of the guys in return for Iglesias, Heaney and Cobb could step in as closer.  Even though it's not the way I would do it, I'd think that there would be 2-3 guys total from those trades that could step into the pen right now and also be ready for next year.  

BTW, adding a Scherzer extension pretty much exhausts what I would expect for payroll next year with maybe another 10-15 mil left to get a SS.  So keep that in mind.  My point is you still have to pay Max and as much as people think it should happen, payroll isn't going up.  Arte just won't do it.  That means very little payroll room to improve the pen.  

The chance of the Angels making the playoffs this year is very very slim.  That's reality.  They have to get something for expiring assets this year.  It's the first time they'll have had that chance in awhile and likely won't have it again for another spell.  They really need to seize that opportunity.  It could be 8 or 9 FV of 40 or better added in one fell swoop.  It's not just that it improves the farm but imagine having 8 more guys to trade for next year?  That would be huge.  

Again, for me, it's all about next year.  I don't think Minasian is going to be allowed to think like that but it's where I'd be right now if I were him.  

Turner is great, also unnecessary.

[Docwaukee]

Just now, Inside Pitch said:

Turner is great, also unncessary.

Love Turner.  He's a superstar.  Agree he's unnecessary.  (or however you spelled it.  )

[Inside Pitch]

2 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

Love Turner.  He's a superstar.  Agree he's unnecessary.  (or however you spelled it.  )

"Now is not the time to tread on Trea" -- Thunder

[Taylor]

2 minutes ago, Inside Pitch said:

"Now concludes to tread on Trea" -- Thunder

Fixed

[Stradling]

No real rumors as of now other than Scherzer will be traded. 

[eligrba]

17 minutes ago, Dochalo said:

my daughter is 12.  this is what I have become.  

Completely understandable.  With a son, you only need to keep track of one penis.

[rageous]

Angels should bring back Noe.

He's having a good year with the Diamondbacks with 2.57 ERA 0.79 WHIP.

[Dtwncbad]

If the Angels landed Sherzer, be honest, wouldn’t you be pretty excited about the Angels having a shot this year?

I would.

(And would assume the only way they would do it is to sign him to an extension so he would be great for next year.)

The guy is a beast and really fun to watch.

And I think many teams would deeply fear facing the Angels (especially with Trout and Rendon healthy) in a postseason series.

[stormngt]

3 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

Tbh even though I know trading them would net a decent haul, I'd really like for us to re-sign the Iglesiai. 

We need a closer long term. We need a shortstop long term. We aren't getting a cost-controlled starter for either of them, so signing them both should be priority number 1. 

Yes, I understand they can be traded and still be re-signed, but what are the odds of that happening? I feel like we have a better shot if we can start negotiating ASAP. 

I honestly don't see this team going into "sell" mode regardless, so more than likely we'll be holding onto them anyway.

Our biggest issue is the bullpen, and I think having the closer position locked down for the next 3 years or so is the best way to begin improving in that area.

Probably the same odds of keeping them and re-signing them in the off season.

[Second Base]

46 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

. . . But won’t fit her for about 19 years

Dad's have nothing to worry about. Victoria secret already announced they're replacing their Angels with "regular" women, like Megan Rapino. Let's just say if she's wearing that outfit, it probably won't be viewed as much.

It's a shame really. Regardless of political affiliation, I think we can all agree losing Victoria Secret Angels is a tragedy.

[Lazorko Saves]

 

Oh no, Nationals, your rebuild phase is coming to get you whether you like it or not...

Isn't that also known as Matt Harvey Surgery?

[Dtwncbad]

Just now, Second Base said:

Dad's have nothing to worry about. Victoria secret already announced they're replacing their Angels with "regular" women, like Megan Rapino. Let's just say if she's wearing that outfit, it probably won't be viewed as much.

It's a shame really. Regardless of political affiliation, I think we can all agree losing Victoria Secret Angels is a tragedy.

I heard that too.  I instantly thought of some poor 14 year old boy that grabbed that latest catalog and hurried to lock himself in the bathroom, and then opened up the catalog to see the equivalent of Roseanne Barr in a bright red silk smock.

Poor kid.  Too funny.

 

[Docwaukee]

7 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

If the Angels landed Sherzer, be honest, wouldn’t you be pretty excited about the Angels having a shot this year?

I would.

(And would assume the only way they would do it is to sign him to an extension so he would be great for next year.)

The guy is a beast and really fun to watch.

And I think many teams would deeply fear facing the Angels (especially with Trout and Rendon healthy) in a postseason series.

no.  I would be upset that they spent assets on something that isn't likely.  He could have an era of zero the rest of the year and it likely wouldn't get the Angels to the playoffs.  

It would be all about next year assuming the extension.  

[Docwaukee]

31 minutes ago, eligrba said:

Completely understandable.  With a son, you only need to keep track of one penis.

instead of all of them.  great adage.  

[beatlesrule]

The Athletic’s Ken Rosenthal has some details on Scherzer’s complex contract situation, as Scherzer’s deal contains a lot of deferred money.  The roughly $11.8MM remaining of Scherzer’s $35MM salary for 2021 is entirely deferred until 2028, so a new team wouldn’t have to pay that money out for seven years.  However, Scherzer’s luxury tax number would also be around the $11.8MM mark, which is certainly a factor for teams trying to avoid a tax payment.  Scherzer has another $7.5MM in signing bonus money due this September, but Rosenthal notes that this bonus payment “is solely the Nationals’ obligation.”

[mmc]

12 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

If the Angels landed Sherzer, be honest, wouldn’t you be pretty excited about the Angels having a shot this year?

I would.

(And would assume the only way they would do it is to sign him to an extension so he would be great for next year.)

The guy is a beast and really fun to watch.

And I think many teams would deeply fear facing the Angels (especially with Trout and Rendon healthy) in a postseason series.

No

[Revad]

1 hour ago, rafibomb said:

Heaney's peripherals are arguably the best of his career. I'm sure a lot of GM's see that and see a lot of value in getting Heaney a change of scenery.

I agree

33 minutes ago, eligrba said:

Completely understandable.  With a son, you only need to keep track of one penis.

As@father with a 17 old son, this can be a challenge

[Erstad Grit]

I'd only trade for Scherzer if we negotiate a 2 or 3 year extension.  Maybe 2/60 or 3/75?

[angelsnationtalk]

20 minutes ago, Dtwncbad said:

If the Angels landed Sherzer, be honest, wouldn’t you be pretty excited about the Angels having a shot this year?

I would.

(And would assume the only way they would do it is to sign him to an extension so he would be great for next year.)

The guy is a beast and really fun to watch.

And I think many teams would deeply fear facing the Angels (especially with Trout and Rendon healthy) in a postseason series.

No cuz we'd give away assets to get him to only have our bullpen blow his dominant starts...

[mmc]

 

[Dtwncbad]

10 minutes ago, mmc said:

No

Thanks for your honest answer.  That’s what I asked for.

[stormngt]

1 hour ago, jsnpritchett said:

So a couple young guys (20/21) with some upside.  Basically two wild cards.  That seems to set the baseline for Heaney's value, then.

Fine with me.  There better than getting nothing at end of the year.

[Second Base]

Don't get me wrong, Scherzer is awesome, I think you need to understand the toll it takes signing him. 

First off, it'll take prospects, big time prospects. The farm is going to take a major hit, and if we are building toward the future, you need to account for that. 

Second, it's going to cost some serious coin to get that extension hammered out. Probably 35 million a year across 3-4 years and he's already 36, which means you're taking on all the risk in this transaction. 

Third, if the Angels intend to rebuild their bullpen over the winter, they'll need available funds because generally speaking, teams aren't in a hurry to trade their good relievers away for nothing. The Reds were a special circumstance. So some of that bullpen rebuild will need to take place in free agency, and if the Angels have around 45 million to spend next winter, and 35 is spent on Scherzer, that leaves 10 million to cover shortstop and relief pitchers. It's not enough. 

And fourth, you need to consider who Scherzer is blocking. We all love what Jaime Barria did and agree he's been screwed over for three years regarding a rotation spot. And yet if you sign Scherzer, it effectively means Barria is gone next year. And with Ohtani, Scherzer, and Sandoval all penciled in, and Detmers and Rodriguez banging down that door, it likely means Suarez and Canning are both going to be in the outside looking in as well. So you're trading Scherzer and the added 35 million for Barria, Suarez and Canning, all three of which will have promising futures on the mound. I know that doesn't matter because Max is an ace, but I'm just saying that because of that personnel loss, the upgrade isn't as great as it otherwise would be. 

Factor all that in, and I'm just not sure Max Scherzer is where we need to go. He's about 15 million and a load prospects too expensive.

 

[failos]

6 hours ago, totdprods said:

Not saying I disagree, but improving the SP could also mean shifting any of Suarez, Barria, Rodriguez, Canning? into the bullpen and bumping out Cishek, Watson, Mayers, at least out of their roles if not entirely. Bachman is an option too.

Given how the market is going, it might be easier to shop for SP than RP. And we will need to fill rotation spots in '22, a head start on shopping here helps us now and later. 

Suarez does not belong in the BP. I would like to see more Canning, though. I’m not sure why Maddon keeps trotting guys like Shitshek and Guerra.

 

But I don’t disagree with you either, in principle. We could use pitching—whether it be SP or RP.

[failos]

6 hours ago, tdawg87 said:

We need both.

We could use both—we don’t really need SP right now. It doesn’t hurt to add more arms though.