Cubs shopping Contreras

[floplag]

Please tell me were in on this... 
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/12/cubs-extensively-shopping-willson-contreras.html

Even if its not true, lie to me if you have to, just tell me we are.

[DMVol]

Would cost at a minimum Adell or Marsh...

[T.G.]

I’ll save some of you the trouble...

Someone is going to ask if he can pitch. Someone else is going to mention how Minasian values catching. Someone else is going to offer up Adell. Something will be said about “run prevention.”  A few others will bring up pitching again. Someone will change the topic back to players on other teams. Finally, Lou will call us all dumbasses.

Edited December 29, 2020 by T.G.

[ScottT]

We are only in if fans tweet #contrerastoanaheim

[CanadianHalo]

4 minutes ago, DMVol said:

Would cost at a minimum Adell or Marsh...

After seeing the return they took for Darvish you can’t honestly think this

[Stradling]

13 minutes ago, floplag said:

Please tell me were in on this... 
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/12/cubs-extensively-shopping-willson-contreras.html

Even if its not true, lie to me if you have to, just tell me we are.

Like I said in another thread, I have no desire to trade prospects for a catcher when we need those prospects to get pitching.  I would much rather have Graterol and pitching than Contreras and less pitching.

[DMVol]

7 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

After seeing the return they took for Darvish you can’t honestly think this

Different circumstances....Contreras is 28 with two years of club control....Darvish is mid 30’s and owed something like 60 million....but, I agree that the return on Darvish looks light....

[Angelsfan1984]

9 minutes ago, CanadianHalo said:

After seeing the return they took for Darvish you can’t honestly think this

Darvish making 20m, Contreras making 4.5

[CanadianHalo]

3 minutes ago, Angelsfan1984 said:

Darvish making 20m, Contreras making 4.5

They’re not getting an Adell or Marsh type return for him

[Angels 1961]

19 minutes ago, T.G. said:

I’ll save some of you the trouble...

Someone is going to ask if he can pitch. Someone else is going to mention how Minasian values catching. Someone else is going to offer up Adell. Something will be said about “run prevention.”  A few others will bring up pitching again. Someone will change the topic back to players on other teams. Finally, Lou will call us all dumbasses.

Some will say Cubs in a rebuild

[Hubs]

21 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

Some will say Cubs in a rebuild

They should rebuild or retool honestly. Their core is all aging or expensive now and  they non tendered Schwarber, traded Darvish and Caratini and might trade Contreras and Bryant.

 

[Angelsjunky]

51 minutes ago, T.G. said:

I’ll save some of you the trouble...

Someone is going to ask if he can pitch. Someone else is going to mention how Minasian values catching. Someone else is going to offer up Adell. Something will be said about “run prevention.”  A few others will bring up pitching again. Someone will change the topic back to players on other teams. Finally, Lou will call us all dumbasses, and be right.

Fixed. I Lou.

[ukyah]

56 minutes ago, T.G. said:

I’ll save some of you the trouble...

Someone is going to ask if he can pitch. Someone else is going to mention how Minasian values catching. Someone else is going to offer up Adell. Something will be said about “run prevention.”  A few others will bring up pitching again. Someone will change the topic back to players on other teams. Finally, Lou will call us all dumbasses.

i agree.

[Docwaukee]

pass.  offensive minded catcher with questionable value on the prevention side.  

[Angels 1961]

43 minutes ago, Hubs said:

They should rebuild or retool honestly. Their core is all aging or expensive now and  they non tendered Schwarber, traded Darvish and Caratini and might trade Contreras and Bryant.

 

I agree, we should get Hendricks and Contreras sell the farm. Go get 2 other FA pitchers and couple bullpen pieces like Petit and Bradley.

[Turd Ferguson]

Worth kicking the tires but likely bigger fish to fry.

[Second Base]

We don't need Contreras. We have Graterol.

[Hubs]

23 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

I agree, we should get Hendricks and Contreras sell the farm. Go get 2 other FA pitchers and couple bullpen pieces like Petit and Bradley.

Would not take the farm probably three or four prospects for the four. Marsh only included if they get both and Adell not included as he’s as valuable as the two of them combined with maybe one additional name.
And I don’t know where you’re putting all these starting pitchers in a rotation that has three spots set in stone and would only have six if Ohtani was in it. So you have at a maximum two spots. Hendricks takes one. 

[Angels 1961]

9 minutes ago, Hubs said:

Would not take the farm probably three or four prospects for the four. Marsh only included if they get both and Adell not included as he’s as valuable as the two of them combined with maybe one additional name.
And I don’t know where you’re putting all these starting pitchers in a rotation that has three spots set in stone and would only have six if Ohtani was in it. So you have at a maximum two spots. Hendricks takes one. 

Ohtani would be a super plus if he comes back. Bundy, Heaney, Canning, Hendricks, Walker and Richards last 2 can be different FA. Canning has not pitched a full year and Heaney on IL a lot. Barria be long man in pen with Sandoval. Can never have enough pitching and Sandoval can start in minors. Ohtani if he comes back doubt he could pitch a full year and might not start till end of May.

[Hubs]

31 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

Ohtani would be a super plus if he comes back. Bundy, Heaney, Canning, Hendricks, Walker and Richards last 2 can be different FA. Canning has not pitched a full year and Heaney on IL a lot. Barria be long man in pen with Sandoval. Can never have enough pitching and Sandoval can start in minors. Ohtani if he comes back doubt he could pitch a full year and might not start till end of May.

So you have a 7 man rotation with Ohtani or 6 without? 

No free agent starter the caliber of Walker or Richards are going to sign on for a pen/rotation role. Canning isn’t going to start at AAA after two years in the rotation. Bundy and Heaney start. 

I’m all about depth but no guy is gonna sign here if there’s not a clear role or rotation spot. You might get guys trying to prove they can still be major league pitchers to do that but I don’t think Richards or Walker sign on for that. Starters make way more money than most pen guys and unless they’re offered a closing role, no established starter ever wants to move to the pen. 

This is why you sign guys like Dillon Peters or Jake Faria to minor league deals. Then they know they can possibly make the majors but would also maybe start in AAA.

Despite their injury histories neither of these guys are at that level.

And incidentally this is why earlier in the offseason I was saying they only needed one legit starter, cuz I didn’t think they’d go for a straight 6 man, which seems to be more of a possibility after Maddon’s interviews with the media a few weeks back. I thought they’d go to The 5.5 man they used in 2018 When Ohtani was healthy which limits the 6th man to way less starts. 
 

Bundy, Heaney, Canning and Hendricks with one of the names you mentioned like Richards or Walker plus Ohtani is a legit rotation. And you have Barria and Pena in the pen and Sandoval and Suarez and Farria in AAA. Detmers and CRod in AA.

That seems like good depth to me.

[Angel Oracle]

2 hours ago, Stradling said:

Like I said in another thread, I have no desire to trade prospects for a catcher when we need those prospects to get pitching.  I would much rather have Graterol and pitching than Contreras and less pitching.

It’s likely that the only good trade involving Contreras for the Halos could well be Hendricks, Contreras, and Heyward’s entire salary?

Halos get the top pitcher and solid catcher they have been needing for quite a while, and still a good defensive RF who can hit some.

If somehow Adell has to be included, then so be it.   Before that though, try to offer Canning, Sandoval, Vera, and Thaiss.

Would rather trade for Gray (hopefully not needing to include Adell) and sign Realmuto, Pillar, and Bradley.

The trick is to improve enough this off-season, while trying to keep the farm mostly intact for another year.

Edited December 30, 2020 by Angel Oracle

[Angel Oracle]

Okay, here’s the pitch framing rankings for Halos catchers along with a few others.

2019 (MLB):

Realmuto #6

Stassi #8

Stallings #15

YaMo #29

Contreras #45

Suzuki #55

James McCann #64

 

2020 (MLB):

Realmuto #2

James McCann #9

Contreras #11

YaMo #12

Stallings #13

Benboom #14

Stassi #19

Suzuki #60

[angelsnationtalk]

3 hours ago, CanadianHalo said:

They’re not getting an Adell or Marsh type return for him

They'll for sure want MLB ready pitching who's cost is minimum and controllable. Enter Sandoval.
Angels could likely stomach dealing Adams as well and maybe add in Jones. 

If they can keep Adams and use bigger package like Jackson and a few other then i'm all in. 
 

Would leave an Adell/Marsh trade for a dream of a Castillo trade possible and still leave possible flexibility to make run for Bauer. (yes I know it would be a moonshot)

Contreras: $6M
Castillo: $5M
Bauer backloaded: $25M year one

Convince Arte to spend a tiny bit more and I'm in for this^^

[Angels 1961]

1 hour ago, Hubs said:

So you have a 7 man rotation with Ohtani or 6 without? 

No free agent starter the caliber of Walker or Richards are going to sign on for a pen/rotation role. Canning isn’t going to start at AAA after two years in the rotation. Bundy and Heaney start. 

I’m all about depth but no guy is gonna sign here if there’s not a clear role or rotation spot. You might get guys trying to prove they can still be major league pitchers to do that but I don’t think Richards or Walker sign on for that. Starters make way more money than most pen guys and unless they’re offered a closing role, no established starter ever wants to move to the pen. 

This is why you sign guys like Dillon Peters or Jake Faria to minor league deals. Then they know they can possibly make the majors but would also maybe start in AAA.

Despite their injury histories neither of these guys are at that level.

And incidentally this is why earlier in the offseason I was saying they only needed one legit starter, cuz I didn’t think they’d go for a straight 6 man, which seems to be more of a possibility after Maddon’s interviews with the media a few weeks back. I thought they’d go to The 5.5 man they used in 2018 When Ohtani was healthy which limits the 6th man to way less starts. 
 

Bundy, Heaney, Canning and Hendricks with one of the names you mentioned like Richards or Walker plus Ohtani is a legit rotation. And you have Barria and Pena in the pen and Sandoval and Suarez and Farria in AAA. Detmers and CRod in AA.

That seems like good depth to me.

OK just sign Walker

[Angels 1961]

7 minutes ago, Angels 1961 said:

OK just sign Walker

Would you take Hendricks, Contreras and Heyward if Cubs paid half of 71 mill owned Heyward over next 3 years.